Tongxin Information

[spike]

Spoke too soon...

Hi

I spoke too soon about the reliability. On my commute on Friday I thought I'd lost power to the motor. When I investigated further I could hear the motor spinning inside the hub. I'm guessing it's the cracked retaining ring issue again. I've asked for a replacement and I'll post what happens next. It's a shame! I thought Tongxin had solved this problem now. Maybe they sent me the old model as a sample?

Spike

PS: No over-volting or over-amping was responsible here. Maybe I'm just a bit too heavy for this motor.

 

[flecc]

I don't think it's you or the particular motor Spike. The Nano tends to be particularly fragile when in larger wheels, especially 700c.

They are great in folders since the torque advantage of 16" or 20" wheels substantially reduces the strain on the design's weak points.
.

 

[mechaniker]

PS: No over-volting or over-amping was responsible here. Maybe I'm just a bit too heavy for this motor.

Hi spike,

as an mechanic I can tell you this motordesign cant work well for a long time.
special in a big rim, i agree with flecc.
I have selled once this motors but i stop because from around 100motors the most havent survived longer as some month ;-(
After the first brocken is arrived, i have check inside the motor, only two words "forget it"
Most time the pins or the big wheel from planetary gearbox go brocken.

my reconment, buy an other motor

frank

 

[pjvenner]

Good luck

It sounds great in theory but it will be fraught with difficulties. Even operating as a non-profit, it would be subject to UK consumer regulations if sales are made outside of the group. Even though import duty has been paid, there will be more tax to pay on every sale. Items sold online or by mail-order can be returned for no good reason (at the supplier's cost). I think these are some of the reasons that big businesses haven't seized the opportunity - You'd think that with ever-rising fuel prices and the drive to go 'green' that they must have considered the idea already. These niggles would hit the profits of a profit making organisation. They would bankrupt a non-profit organisation.

 

[wurly]

Spike, they just break sometimes without any reason.I machined a sleeving ring to re-enforce the original. So far that has worked on one of my motors, on another i can't stop it sliding off and fouling the outer hub. I use bafang motors now. I still like the Tongxins but they are aren't very reliable.

Frank, maybe you can help me? do you know where to get replacement rings? we have tried to contact tongxin direct but they don't reply. I have a couple if motors i that i could get going again if i had replacements + i would like to have a spare just in case.

 

[spike]

One more try.

I'll give the Tongxin one more try simply because I've already paid for another kit. The broken one is in a 26" wheel. The new one will be in a 700c wheel. Given what Flecc and Frank have said it probably won't last a month. If it fails I will switch motors.

Do you guys have an opinion on which is the quietest of the small geared hubs? The near silence under load was my reason for risking the Tongxin.

Spike

 

[spike]

Cytronex

Hi spike,

as an mechanic I can tell you this motordesign cant work well for a long time.
special in a big rim, i agree with flecc.
I have selled once this motors but i stop because from around 100motors the most havent survived longer as some month ;-(
After the first brocken is arrived, i have check inside the motor, only two words "forget it"
Most time the pins or the big wheel from planetary gearbox go brocken.

my reconment, buy an other motor

frank

Hi Frank

The guys at Cytronex seem to have built a successful business around the Tongxin motors. I wonder if they get a different version?

Spike

 

[mechaniker]

Do you guys have an opinion on which is the quietest of the small geared hubs? The near silence under load was my reason for risking the Tongxin.

Spike

Hi Spike,

smaler and more light weigth and lower noise as a tongxin, this will be difficult to build. Thats the reason for the sucess of Tongxin. This is the advance of tongxin but you pay for it with a sensitve motor.
The same Motordesign use also the weifeng Motorcompany and they told me that they use better material and so i check this motor but with the same result as the tongxin

I think if you would not drive with more as 10Amp´s on controller , it can work but with 14Amp´s no chance

The bafang swxu is 1,9kg weight and a much better construction but have a noisy sprocket gearbox because of high rpm. The tongxin dont use sprockets, it is a friction drive, so tongxin has low noise.

Whether tongxin have change something inside the motor in the last year, i have no idea.
but i dont think so.

for Wurly,
i have seen in my basement a motor (only the inside parts, gearbox-dc-motor) from tongxin but i´m not sure it is the right one for you because there was two different diameter for the big ring. If you have intrest i can send to you for the price of deliver-fee
BTW, to change the gearbox is not so easy on this motors

On tongxin you cant buy spareparts because the motor is in china at the producer only 20Euro, so what should he take for a sparepart like this ring.
And belief me, the saleswoman from tongxins outrider store (vivian and Diana) have no idea what you mean, or they have no intrest in what you mean

have a good day
frank

 

[flecc]

Hi Frank

The guys at Cytronex seem to have built a successful business around the Tongxin motors. I wonder if they get a different version?

Spike

They do have their troubles. HarryB in this forum had one which gave up, but he was unhappy with the replacement motor which had a reduced performance. The suspicion is that it's been downrated as Frank has indicated, to make it last longer. As a result Harry changed to a Panasonic powered bike, the next best thing for free running, which he commutes with reliably.
.

 

[spike]

Panasonic bike

They do have their troubles. HarryB in this forum had one which gave up, but he was unhappy with the replacement motor which had a reduced performance. The suspicion is that it's been downrated as Frank has indicated, to make it last longer. As a result Harry changed to a Panasonic powered bike, the next best thing for free running, which he commutes with reliably.
.

OK. So Cytronex reduced the juice for longer life? I will try that with the next motor.
I would be happy with a Panasonic bike, but they are not available in Australia. Shame!

 

[spike]

Hi Spike,

smaler and more light weigth and lower noise as a tongxin, this will be difficult to build. Thats the reason for the sucess of Tongxin. This is the advance of tongxin but you pay for it with a sensitve motor.
The same Motordesign use also the weifeng Motorcompany and they told me that they use better material and so i check this motor but with the same result as the tongxin

I think if you would not drive with more as 10Amp´s on controller , it can work but with 14Amp´s no chance

The bafang swxu is 1,9kg weight and a much better construction but have a noisy sprocket gearbox because of high rpm. The tongxin dont use sprockets, it is a friction drive, so tongxin has low noise.

Whether tongxin have change something inside the motor in the last year, i have no idea.
but i dont think so.

for Wurly,
i have seen in my basement a motor (only the inside parts, gearbox-dc-motor) from tongxin but i´m not sure it is the right one for you because there was two different diameter for the big ring. If you have intrest i can send to you for the price of deliver-fee
BTW, to change the gearbox is not so easy on this motors

On tongxin you cant buy spareparts because the motor is in china at the producer only 20Euro, so what should he take for a sparepart like this ring.
And belief me, the saleswoman from tongxins outrider store (vivian and Diana) have no idea what you mean, or they have no intrest in what you mean

have a good day
frank

Thanks Frank
I have found the OutRider staff to be more responsive and helpful, but as you say, the end result is the same. A useless motor that is not worth fixing because it is the same cost as buying a new motor.

 

[flecc]

No that's true, I didn't realise you were there Spike. Many Australians have bemoaned the absence of the Panasonic powered bikes. Maybe if states like Victoria introduce the EU style rules as they are trying to do, the 250 watt permission will bring Panasonic into the market with their own range, which now includes some nice sporting models.
.

 

[HarryB]

OK. So Cytronex reduced the juice for longer life? I will try that with the next motor.
I would be happy with a Panasonic bike, but they are not available in Australia. Shame!

As Flecc says I have owned several Tongxin motors - the first was very powerful, pulling strongly uphill and seemingly unburstable. Despite the abuse I gave it it never let me down. It was a bit of an experiment as I installed it in a Torq 1 but the bike wiring become unreliable with water ingress - otherwise I am sure I would have continued with this bike.

The second was in my Cytronex and was problably as powerful but lower geared at 175rpm. This bike felt great and for a time was perfect but I did break the motor and had it replaced with a substantially less powerful version - this motor blew electrically and took out the controller. The new motor had the same power but I broke the retaining ring (because I rode it over some cobbles under power). Of course the feeling of power was subjective - it seemed I was being propelled up a hill faster or accelerated faster. I didn't really try any objective tests which in retrospect I should have.

I would have thought if you treated the motor well and as a consumable it would be worth the rewards it gives. For me I wanted to get as near to 100% reliability as possible - something I have so far found with the panasonics (it is early days yet at under a year).

 

[jerrysimon]

There is one for sale on ebay here at the moment

I have four of these motors now the first one is 15 months old, 1400 miles and counting.

I agree it seems these motors are both fragile and only seem to be reliable in specific applications as discussed previously.

I recall EWC saying something about having the facilities to replace rings.

It would also be interesting to see what Freedom E have to say about them, being supliers for both small wheel and larger wheel bikes.

Regards

Jerry

 

[Pedalo]

Just to add another Tongxin users experience, my Cytronex had completed nearly 3000 miles before I sold it and I never had any problems with the motor.
I was very careful though in that I would always pedal up to speed before switching on the motor as recommended by Cytronex.

For my DIY Brompton, my first motor failed after only 700 miles. To be honerst though, I was less careful and had started using the motor to accelerate away at trafic lights and roundabouts, and I did hear the motor slip a few times before I finally broke it. Since fitting my spare, I've been using it at lower power and reverted to taking more care about when I start the motor. It's now done 700 miles and still going.

As everyone has said these motors do offer the benefit in that they are quiet and offer little resistance, but it's well worth operating them carefully and keeping a few spare motors. They are probably best for the DIY enthusuasts who are happy to swap out motors themselves, or for users who can tolerate some down time (and the associated expense) while they get their motor replaced for them.

 

[spike]

Hi all

I received a replacement motor ring, freewheel and tools from the factory this week. The instructions are just a set of photographs, but sufficient to do the job. When I've done the work I'll start a new repair thread and put the photos into a pdf doc with some explanatory text.

Cheers

Spike

 

[wurly]

Hi Spike
Just a small tip. When you assemble the outer ring and rollers together, use a press to install the rollers/ring over the motor shaft and twist the assembly in a rotary motion. This will prevent the rollers getting scored by the motor shaft as it goes on. I have had Tongxin trouble before with notchy rollers. They can jam the whole rotatating assembly and leave the motor spinning making the situation worse.
(And thanks once more to Frank for suppling me with the spare tongxin gearbox, much appreciated :0)

 

[mechaniker]

Hi Mel,

thank´s Mel, i like to help

Frank

 

[spike]

Hi Spike
Just a small tip. When you assemble the outer ring and rollers together, use a press to install the rollers/ring over the motor shaft and twist the assembly in a rotary motion...

Thanks Mel

 

[jerrysimon]

Hi all

I received a replacement motor ring, freewheel and tools from the factory this week. The instructions are just a set of photographs, but sufficient to do the job. When I've done the work I'll start a new repair thread and put the photos into a pdf doc with some explanatory text.

Cheers

Spike

Wow you did well to get some spare parts!

I would love to see the photos they sent and obviously any you take when you repair it. I am lready invested in these motors (I have two spare) so am interested to see your repair.

Can I ask how you got the spare parts, cost etc ?

Regards

Jerry