Help! Street Machine GT conversion

Benjahmin

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Yes, did wonder about the 12 magnets, seem to recall people having issues.
Not too bothered about changing levels, though this may be because my Ezee is speed control rather than current level.
 

AntonyC

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The usual bar end shifter would be indexed for 9 speeds and switched to non-indexed when your old motor was fitted. With 9sp you could get at least 34T and maybe smoother shifts.

Current kit is based on an Ezee. So it's this high torque that I would look to replicate. If I could find an unmarked Bafang BPM, that'd be nice.
The AKM128, BPM, Shengyi SY22 and your Ezee are all in the same power bracket but the AKM is 3/4 the weight so it may overheat sooner than the others if your hills are tough. An Ezee or BPM for example, it wouldn't guarantee a safety margin as there are so many other influences, but here's _an_ Ezee and a motor nearly the weight of the AKM managing 2 miles or half a mile on a 15% climb:

 

saneagle

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The AKM128, BPM, Shengyi SY22 and your Ezee are all in the same power bracket but the AKM is 3/4 the weight so it may overheat sooner than the others if your hills are tough. An Ezee or BPM for example, it wouldn't guarantee a safety margin as there are so many other influences, but here's _an_ Ezee and a motor nearly the weight of the AKM managing 2 miles or half a mile on a 15% climb:
AKM 128 is rated at 800w, those others are only 500w. Size and weight have nothing to do with over-heating. It's winding speed and efficiency that matter.
 

Benjahmin

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There are some tough hills. I take the 50% approach, that is I try to keep the minimum climbing speed equal to or greater than 50% of the modal speed. So around 8mph for a 15mph motor.
My Ezee has never felt even vaguely warm, the controller however is a different matter. Hence the 9 fets.
 

Nealh

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I would opt for a bz 10c pas if you have a hollowtech type BB, never yet had a slip or issue with the two parts pas set up bar the 12 pole not playing ball. Ever since a 10 pole has been my go to option. Simply set C1 /1 and it will work.
 

AntonyC

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AKM 128 is rated at 800w, those others are only 500w. Size and weight have nothing to do with over-heating. It's winding speed and efficiency that matter.
Agreed regarding making heat, the biggest savings come from electrical design. Also these motors shed heat poorly (cool cases) so it builds up inside and a heavier motor heats up more slowly.

Check out the simulation: the Ezee produces 0.7 times the heat, is 1.6 times heavier and takes 2.8 times as long to overheat. If its heating weren't simulated you could estimate that it might climb for twice as long (1.6 / 0.7 = 2.3).
 

Benjahmin

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It's a square taper BB.
I've had the same issue on two bikes now. The pas disc doesn't grip the shaft tightly and can develop a wobble so that the distance to the sensor is variable, and also develops rotational slip. In both cases the crank was removed so the disc could be slipped off whole. Then a piece of 1" heavy gaffa tape (gorilla) was wrapped around the diameter of the disc, then cross pierced with a knife. Slipped back on the shaft this has proved to be an unsightly but effective remedy.
 

Nealh

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Fit the disc direct to the small chain ring and then throw the sensor over so it picks up ok, once the disc is fixed to the chainrings it can't slip.
 

saneagle

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Agreed regarding making heat, the biggest savings come from electrical design. Also these motors shed heat poorly (cool cases) so it builds up inside and a heavier motor heats up more slowly.

Check out the simulation: the Ezee produces 0.7 times the heat, is 1.6 times heavier and takes 2.8 times as long to overheat. If its heating weren't simulated you could estimate that it might climb for twice as long (1.6 / 0.7 = 2.3).
The simulation means nothing because the AKM makes less heat than those other motors. All you're achieving is to cause some worry for OP. The motor he has chosen is the best one for what he wants, and it will work very well. That's all that matters.
 

Woosh

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AKM 128 is rated at 800w, those others are only 500w. Size and weight have nothing to do with over-heating. It's winding speed and efficiency that matter.
I have akm128 and dwg22c 250w. The dwg22c being bigger whines less on steep gradient. I doubt aikema would have rated their 128 motor 800w. Bms battery did.
 

Nealh

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Topbikekit rate the akm128 as a 500w and 800w also.
 

Benjahmin

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Fit the disc direct to the small chain ring and then throw the sensor over so it picks up ok, once the disc is fixed to the chainrings it can't slip.
Love to fit to the small ring, done it on my carrera. However on this one there's a rather substantial steel ring guard, it's all a bit tight on that side. Only a couple of mil between small ring and ring guard stays.
So I think I'm going to need a pas with the detector that would normally fit on the down tube. Here it would fit on the stub tube that holds the front deraileur.
Having said that I can't bloody find one !:mad:
Looks like it might have to be KT-V12L, at least it's a one piece disc.
 

Benjahmin

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I have akm128 and dwg22c 250w. The dwg22c being bigger whines less on steep gradient. I doubt aikema would have rated their 128 motor 800w. Bms battery did.
Love to buy from you Tony(save a lot of faffing) but, at this point, I don't need a battery and, as far as I know, you only sell complete with batteries.
Also I can't see the 128 on your site. Am I missing something?
 

AntonyC

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gt-rrc.jpg

@saneagle: thanks for clarifying, with this many variables your experience with AKM is indeed what matters.

@Benjahmin: would this PAS mounting work for you? (Not my bike)
 
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Benjahmin

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Yes, I had wondered about the idler. Just went to look and there's certainly enough room and mounting brackets , however the idler can spin independant of the chain despite having teeth (may need to look at that) but it's a possible.
 

Woosh

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I can't see the 128 on your site. Am I missing something?
I bought the AKM128 kit from bmsbattery a few years back for testing.
I played with it for a few hours and it stayed in its carton ever since.
I like Aikema products but they are nowhere near bombproof like your old ezee kit.
Manufacturers like Aikema and Tongsheng don't discipline their dealers like Bafang do.
They let their dealers claim more or less anything. Tongsheng for example make only 1 controller with 4 variations: 36V/48V and with/without throttle. They don't charge much for the optional extras (48V instead of 36V, with throttle instead of without).
Dealers like me judge the extra risk running the kit at higher voltage versus the benefit of having extended torque range, customers misuse the throttle versus the benefit of easy hillstart and set the price of the options accordingly to cover breakages.
 

saneagle

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I have akm128 and dwg22c 250w. The dwg22c being bigger whines less on steep gradient. I doubt aikema would have rated their 128 motor 800w. Bms battery did.
There are two versions - cassette and freewheel. The freewheel one is wider and has a much larger stator with a lot more copper in it. The freewheel version is rated at 800w and the cassette version at 500w. The DWG22C wines more because its lower internal RPM puts is more likely to be in the zone where you can hear the commutation pulses. If your AKM was worse, it was because you were using a crappy controller or you had the high speed version and were running it under load at low speed.
 
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saneagle

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I bought the AKM128 kit from bmsbattery a few years back for testing.
I played with it for a few hours and it stayed in its carton ever since.
I like Aikema products but they are nowhere near bombproof like your old ezee kit.
Manufacturers like Aikema and Tongsheng don't discipline their dealers like Bafang do.
They let their dealers claim more or less anything. Tongsheng for example make only 1 controller with 4 variations: 36V/48V and with/without throttle. They don't charge much for the optional extras (48V instead of 36V, with throttle instead of without).
Dealers like me judge the extra risk running the kit at higher voltage versus the benefit of having extended torque range, customers misuse the throttle versus the benefit of easy hillstart and set the price of the options accordingly to cover breakages.
I never heard of any problem ever with an AKM 128 except that the cassette freewheel pawls go rusty when people don't oil them. That happens to all cassette motors if you use them in the winter and don't oil them, though some worse than others. OP will be using the freewheel version that can't get that problem.

The AKM 128 motor is especially useful for guys that have to deal with very steep hills or ride slowly or tow stuff. It does it much better than a Bafang BPM because it has the advantage of a much higher reduction ratio so that the motor is still spinning efficiently when a similar RPM (wheel speed) Bafang BPM, Ezee motor or anything like that will stall out or overheat. Like with any motor, you have to choose the version that's appropriate to your needs.

I've never seen a low speed version of an Ezee motor. They're mainly designed for the US market 20 mph. They're big and strong but not particularly efficient for low speed and high torque situations. There's a 180 rpm version of the BPM, though not easy to find. It's very efficient for climbing and towing, but struggles for 12 mph.

AKM128 is probably the quietest motor I've ever heard.
 
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Woosh

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It's not a problem, rather a limitation. I bought their kit with KT controller and LCD3. Ran it at 800W* for a while until it started to whine more and more loudly. I haven't used it since.

*the LCD3 has battery power meter
 

Woosh

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I had an ezee kit in for servicing some years back. Had a quick peek at the motor. It's well built and quite sturdy, a bit at the opposite of aikema motors. I bought a few of their aikema 85SX. It's good and lightweight but can't open them. I asked aikema to supply me with the tool. Am still waiting more than a year now. Explains why I stopped selling their 85SX. I still have some 85SX for servicing but rather replace them with Mxus or shengyi