Roundabout grumble about car drivers

Hello all,

 

Mini roundabouts and roundabouts in general I'm very annoyed at car drivers ignoring the rules of the road, I approach a roundabout and I have right of way to those coming onto the roundabout from my left.

 

The roundabout particularly at my work, car drivers tend not to look and just to drive across so I'm approaching and see a car coming on to my left ~ is he gonna stop for me he's still moving still moving and I think I shall slow down and see either I stop or I go on around and he's right up my arse as we go round. I'm very cautious now becasue I've been knocked off at a mini roundabout by a dozy lady and she totally buckled my rear wheel and I had to fork out for a new one.

 

So why are car drivers eager to get from A to B and are ignoring the rules of the road?????? Its scarey!

Because they're in a protective box and you're not.

For your own protection you have to ride defensively. Make sure you have seen/made eye contact with the driver, otherwise the only safe assumption is that they're going to pull out on you. If that means you're in the middle of the road and someones right behind you - so be it.

Hello all,

 

Mini roundabouts and roundabouts in general I'm very annoyed at car drivers ignoring the rules of the road, I approach a roundabout and I have right of way to those coming onto the roundabout from my left.

 

The roundabout particularly at my work, car drivers tend not to look and just to drive across so I'm approaching and see a car coming on to my left ~ is he gonna stop for me he's still moving still moving and I think I shall slow down and see either I stop or I go on around and he's right up my arse as we go round. I'm very cautious now becasue I've been knocked off at a mini roundabout by a dozy lady and she totally buckled my rear wheel and I had to fork out for a new one.

 

So why are car drivers eager to get from A to B and are ignoring the rules of the road?????? Its scarey!

There are a few roundabouts round here, and I'd assume it's probably the case for many of us, which are more like T-junctions. Indeed, one pretty much is a T-junction where someone put a spot of white paint on the road and a couple of signs.

 

I see drivers treat them as if the roundabout simply didn't exist at all. That applies whichever way I am travelling, and whether driving a car or on a bike. And if, when driving, I slow down to an appropriately slow speed, and give way as indicated/required, other drivers often think I am the one in the wrong.

 

 

For me, it is the natural - if unwanted - consequence of the design and some roundabouts interacting with human drivers.

There are a few roundabouts round here, and I'd assume it's probably the case for many of us, which are more like T-junctions. Indeed, one pretty much is a T-junction where someone put a spot of white paint on the road and a couple of signs.

 

I see drivers treat them as if the roundabout simply didn't exist at all. That applies whichever way I am travelling, and whether driving a car or on a bike. And if, when driving, I slow down to an appropriately slow speed, and give way as indicated/required, other drivers often think I am the one in the wrong.

 

 

For me, it is the natural - if unwanted - consequence of the design and some roundabouts interacting with human drivers.

 

My gripe is over car drivers who do not indicate at roundabouts - are they going left? straight on? or right? If a car is approaching from my right and not indicating I virtually stop until it is clear where they are going

My gripe is over car drivers who do not indicate at roundabouts - are they going left? straight on? or right? If a car is approaching from my right and not indicating I virtually stop until it is clear where they are going

Just stop here:

 

My gripe is over car drivers who do not indicate.

 

I know I too make mistakes, but I try to indicate at all times. From many years ago, typically walking home in the dark from a pub, drivers have little idea who might want to know what they are intending to do. They (we!) often do not realise someone in the shadows, or hidden by a tree, cares.

So why are car drivers eager to get from A to B and are ignoring the rules of the road?????? Its scarey!

 

It's as much as anything due to them not thinking of bicycles, they are looking for motor vehicles which they do give way to when they are approaching from the right.

 

But with mini roundabouts I agree with Oyster. In the main they are a thoroughly bad idea for everyone which should never have been introduced, especially not on T junctions. They aren't large enough to work efficiently, let alone safely.

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My gripe is over car drivers who do not indicate at roundabouts - are they going left? straight on? or right? If a car is approaching from my right and not indicating I virtually stop until it is clear where they are going

 

There's some truth in this, but how does car driver coming from your right indicate they are going straight on, which especially on a mini roundabout could be appropriate?

 

All a car driver can do is indicate when entering if they are going around to the right, then indicate left on reaching their exit choice. For straight on there's no indication so you are still left guessing if they are going straight on or are just too lazy to indicate.

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My gripe is over car drivers who do not indicate at roundabouts - are they going left? straight on? or right? If a car is approaching from my right and not indicating I virtually stop until it is clear where they are going

There's a bad one at our Tesco which is just off a big roundabout, with a bike path crossing the Tesco exit from the roundabout. Good points are (1) that there is a bike path, (2) that there is a central reservation for bikes between the Tesco entrance and exit, and (3) that people leaving Tesco are usually very helpful. The bad point is that very few drivers on the roundabout indicate whether or not they intend to take the Tesco exit.

You think you've got it bad. Have a look at what I have to contend with as I pass my Tesco. It's always very busy. It's actually smaller than it looks in the photo. The mini roundabout is about 6 car lengths from the crossing. Cars don't have time to indicate because they're too busy watching what the other cars are doing. All the cars have to change lanes there. You always have to stop before initiating the crossing, which means you don't have enough speed to get across either half before cars come rushing around without looking. Nearly every time I cross, a car has to do an abrubt stop, and I normally get an apologetic wave from them, though sometimes an angry look as if I've done something wrong.

 

The orange line is the crossing from cycle path to cycle path. The dot shows the only refuge point

Edited February 28, 20215 yr by vfr400

You think you've got it bad. Have a look at what I have to contend with as I pass my Tesco. It's always very busy. It's actually smaller than it looks in the photo. The mini roundabout is about 6 car lengths from the crossing. Cars don't have time to indicate because they're too busy watching what the other cars are doing. All the cars have to change lanes there. You always have to stop before initiating the crossing, which means you don't have enough speed to get across either half before cars come rushing around without looking. Nearly every time I cross, a car has to do an abrubt stop, and I normally get an apologetic wave from them, though sometimes an angry look as if I've done something wrong.

 

The orange line is the crossing from cycle path to cycle path. The dot shows the only refuge point

[ATTACH type=full" alt="41008]41008[/ATTACH]

 

Crazy situation. I think the advocates for self driving cars needed to have a look at such as this before making their claims. Little wonder that they are backing down now.

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You think you've got it bad. Have a look at what I have to contend with as I pass my Tesco. It's always very busy. It's actually smaller than it looks in the photo. The mini roundabout is about 6 car lengths from the crossing. Cars don't have time to indicate because they're too busy watching what the other cars are doing. All the cars have to change lanes there. You always have to stop before initiating the crossing, which means you don't have enough speed to get across either half before cars come rushing around without looking. Nearly every time I cross, a car has to do an abrubt stop, and I normally get an apologetic wave from them, though sometimes an angry look as if I've done something wrong.

 

The orange line is the crossing from cycle path to cycle path. The dot shows the only refuge point

[ATTACH type=full" alt="41008]41008[/ATTACH]

I knew ours was mild compared to some, but that is really excessive/brilliant(ly awful)/...

As I understand it, a vehicle only gets precedence once it has crossed the stop line and is on the roundabout. However, virtually all motorists ignore this rule and blithely sail on relying on vehicles waiting to enter 'downstream' to give way.

I saw a crash locally where a car approached the roundabout at 6 o'clock position, at 30 mph, did not slow down and found that the car approaching from 9 o'clock had driven onto the roundabout before the first car crossed the line and established precedence.

The 6 o'clock man was furious claiming that the 9 o'clock man should have given way. Problem was that the skid marks for the 6 o'clock car started before the stop line.

As I understand it, a vehicle only gets precedence once it has crossed the stop line and is on the roundabout. However, virtually all motorists ignore this rule and blithely sail on relying on vehicles waiting to enter 'downstream' to give way.

I saw a crash locally where a car approached the roundabout at 6 o'clock position, at 30 mph, did not slow down and found that the car approaching from 9 o'clock had driven onto the roundabout before the first car crossed the line and established precedence.

The 6 o'clock man was furious claiming that the 9 o'clock man should have given way. Problem was that the skid marks for the 6 o'clock car started before the stop line.

I had exactly that situation. I was turning right at a mini-roundabout. A car was approaching from the right, but I was there first, so went onto the roundabout; however, the car in front of me stalled and blocked me, so I wasn't able to get off the roundabout. The woman on the right didn't stop and hit my backwheel with her off-side bumper. My car was more or less pointing towards the road she had come from because I was half-way round when she hit me. You should have heard the expletives that came out of her mouth. She threatened me with everything. She knew the rules because her husband was a senior policeman. I calmly explained the rule, while taking photos. I pointed out the position of my car and the angle she had hit me. My car had a white mark on the tyre so not enough to claim anything from her. She had a stoved in bumper. I guess her husband put her straight when she got home.

Easy rule: Be able to stop in the distance you can see to be clear (on your side of the road if you want to be pedantic).

A simpler translation is the 'two second rule'. You can apply it anywhere - mini-roundabouts, motorways, blind corners, etc.

 

Hence why the day-dreaming knucklehead nice driver to the rear is nearly always found to be at fault.

 

I'd agree that the major problem is that the drivers are looking for other mobile gilded cages, not other vehicles in a more general sense.

A simpler translation is the 'two second rule'. You can apply it anywhere - mini-roundabouts, motorways, blind corners, etc.

Are you one of those people that blocks the roundabout for ages, while you wait for a 2 second gap in front of you? When the traffic is tailing back in all three directions at a T-junction mini-roundabout, you'll never get 2 seconds in front of you because if you wauit that long, the cars from the left will continue to jump on, and if one were to wait, you still have the problem of the cars coming from the right.

No. I:

- take the least crowded lane into the roundabout

- anticipate the gaps well ahead of reaching the give way lines

- straightline roundabouts when safe to do so

- go in slow, come out fast, like any hazard

 

I won't be in line with another vehicle and less than 2 seconds behind it if I can help it. I'll agree you have to occasionally 'push in', and cause the person behind to be less than 2 seconds behind me, but it's rare, and I minimise it.

 

I'll be quicker and safer across a roundabout than most other road users, and hopefully less noticeable.

I do advanced training for motorbike riders.

Out walking one day I saw an interesting incident at a mini roundabout. Car approaching with a motor cycle behind. Car driver manoeuvred around the roundabout and started to exit on the straight out road. Sudden squeal of brakes as the motorcycle came to a halt alongside the car. He had gone the wrong way round the roundabout. Motorcyclist to car driver "what the **** are you doing?" car driver response, obviously, "going the correct way round the roundabout" .

Not one of my pupils.

 

looks like a table top jump to me

When I was last cycling in the 80s - before my recent conversion to "E", I used to stick to the left around roundabouts, and very carefully and rather slowly proceed around them, signalling to my right whenever I passed an exit I didn't want to take, all the while looking over my right shoulder for vehicles hurtling at me, while simultaneously trying to not get run over by cars not seeing me from the left. When I restarted cycling a few weeks ago, I completely forgot my old method and went straight around a roundabout as if I was driving a car, and it was terrifying - alternately looking over both shoulders would have probably thrown me off balance... I literally used "The Force", like Luke Skywalker in Star Wars. Dumb. I'm going back to my old, highly paranoid method. It's tempting to derestrict my ebike and install a throttle to whizz around roundabouts like I'm riding a motorbike, but probably foolish, because bicycles are less visible.

 

I plan routes to avoid as many roundabouts as possible. It's crazy how so many roundabouts don't even feature a pavement anywhere around or near them.

 

There seem to be many more roundabouts than there used to be in the 80s - even my old routes to work have been disrupted by lots of them. Dangerous mini roundabouts are cheaper to install than traffic lights. Maybe with a return to post world war taxation levels, there will be much more spent on infrastructure, and the blasted things will be replaced.

 

looks like a table top jump to me

 

 

Just add wings, and we'll get gliding cars before we get flying cars.

Crazy situation. I think the advocates for self driving cars needed to have a look at such as this before making their claims. Little wonder that they are backing down now.

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The self-driving car fad is an investment scam - investors go short on hyped tech stocks like that, after the inevitable initial post Initial Public Offering stock price overvaluation. There are too many variables for self-driving cars to be made safe, for quite a few years to come. But I could be wrong.

You think you've got it bad. Have a look at what I have to contend with as I pass my Tesco. It's always very busy. It's actually smaller than it looks in the photo. The mini roundabout is about 6 car lengths from the crossing. Cars don't have time to indicate because they're too busy watching what the other cars are doing. All the cars have to change lanes there. You always have to stop before initiating the crossing, which means you don't have enough speed to get across either half before cars come rushing around without looking. Nearly every time I cross, a car has to do an abrubt stop, and I normally get an apologetic wave from them, though sometimes an angry look as if I've done something wrong.

 

The orange line is the crossing from cycle path to cycle path. The dot shows the only refuge point

[ATTACH=full]41008[/ATTACH]

 

 

 

I'm amazed that was allowed to be built! But wait... is that a supermarket car park? Silly me - local government decided that bribes and jobs mattered more than the trouble it's worth creating a safer solution.

 

 

 

Nearly every time I cross, a car has to do an abrubt stop

 

 

The odds look bad... is it only matter of time till you encounter a driver who doesn't see you? There are lots of almost blind drivers out there. I sometimes take a longer route to avoid nightmare junctions like that - on an ebike, a mile or two extra doesn't matter.

Agreed they're risky on a bicycle. I tend to try and keep my speed up - 15mph is safer than 5mph since it buys you time from the following vehicles, and you're keeping up with the traffic better. The less the speed differential, the safer (assuming you have good brakes!). Main roads and roundabouts are where I occasionally turn the boost up, just to 'keep up' with the flow better.

 

Also a bit of lateral movement can help you get spotted, so swinging into a roundabout can make you more noticable, but that's not always possible if you have other vehicles close by. On 2+ lane roundabouts I'll take a lane like a car would, if it's not too far round.

 

On massive roundabouts, it's a question of waiting for a gap, and sticking to the outside so there's only the offside to keep checking. I have a mirror fitted too, but a shoulder check is still vital if you're changing position towards a gap/area that a car could also get into.

This is a Belgian roundabout with cycle lane and give way red markings for motor vehicles.

It is actually the infamous 'Hellfire Corner' of First World War renown.