Pedelec Nirvana

[Peter.Bridge]

Prompted by @saneagle's comment - What is your Pedelec Nirvana ? Here's mine

1. 48V 15 A Sine Wave controller with power based PAS levels - plenty of smooth quiet power for the steepest road hills even for people that are not as slim as they used to be
2. Rear Geared Hub motor - something like Bafang G020 (H400/400b/405) or AKM 128 2.8-3.5 kg - big enough to not overheat up those hills. (I have got a crank motored bike too but find the hub motor a more relaxing ride on the roads)
3. 48V 20Ah battery - at low assist levels gives very long range.
4. Bottom Bracket Torque Sensor - Assist comes in when you are putting pedalling effort in, not when the pedals are turning. Also, comes with single chainring so you can ditch that front derailleur (you won't need it )
5. Hardtail bike with Air forks (mine has got cheap coil forks) and hydraulic disc brakes
6. Extras : mudguards, pannier rack, panniers, lights, puncture resistant road/light trail tyres , suspension seat post , Zefal Dooback mirror, action camera. (I haven't got this but SatNav that you can read in Sunny conditions would be nice)

 

[saneagle]

Prompted by @saneagle's comment - What is your Pedelec Nirvana ? Here's mine

1. 48V 15 A Sine Wave controller with power based PAS levels - plenty of smooth quiet power for the steepest road hills even for people that are not as slim as they used to be
2. Rear Geared Hub motor - something like Bafang G020 (H400/400b/405) or AKM 128 2.8-3.5 kg - big enough to not overheat up those hills. (I have got a crank motored bike too but find the hub motor a more relaxing ride on the roads)
3. 48V 20Ah battery - at low assist levels gives very long range.
4. Bottom Bracket Torque Sensor - Assist comes in when you are putting pedalling effort in, not when the pedals are turning. Also, comes with single chainring so you can ditch that front derailleur (you won't need it )
5. Hardtail bike with Air forks (mine has got cheap coil forks) and hydraulic disc brakes
6. Extras : mudguards, pannier rack, panniers, lights, puncture resistant road/light trail tyres , suspension seat post , Zefal Dooback mirror, action camera. (I haven't got this but SatNav that you can read in Sunny conditions would be nice)

Woah, woah! You were doing so well until point 4. Torque sensor? Go and take a cold bath, then come back and try again. I think a couple of cogwheels in your head have slipped out of mesh. A quick bang against the wall might reset them, so let's try.

 

[Az.]

My Pedelec Nirvana is traffic free network of wide cycle paths so I could get from point A to B without risking my life.

 

[Az.]

1. 48V 15(...)
2. Rear Geared Hub motor(...)
3. 48V 20Ah battery(...)
4. Bottom Bracket Torque Sensor(...)
5. Hardtail bike with Air forks(...)
6. Extras (...)

You know it is easily achievable, right? What stops you? Do you want to die rich?
PS Why not full sus?

 

[saneagle]

Woah, woah! You were doing so well until point 4. Torque sensor? Go and take a cold bath, then come back and try again. I think a couple of cogwheels in your head have slipped out of mesh. A quick bang against the wall might reset them, so let's try.

Just by way of example. I've been laid up for 3 weeks with this stupid bird flu or whatever it is. After 7 days, it attacked my knee and has completely seized it. I've run out of nearly everything and need to go shopping. Unfortunately, I buried my old bike at the back of the garage while I've been experimenting with my new torque sensor one. With only one leg, I can't get my old bike out, and I've got no chance of getting my torque sensor bike to the shop and back.

I've done several miles on my old bike with one leg in the past when I fell off and bashed my knee badly. It was uphill all the way too.

 

[Cadence]

It depends on where Nirvana is. Mine is reached on roads, cycle paths, towpaths and light gravel tracks. No log jumping or muddy drops for me, so a suspension fork is just unnecessary extra weight. I can get all the suspension I need from 2" wide tyres at low pressures.
Not tried a torque sensor, but the lazy part of me likes a bit of ghost pedalling - particularly at the end of a long ride.
Otherwise, it's a good list, but I would personally add a step-through frame that still allows space for a downtube battery rather than on a rack. Cannondale Adventure is the nearest I've seen so far (albeit with a suspension fork).

 

[Peter.Bridge]

You know it is easily achievable, right? What stops you? Do you want to die rich?
PS Why not full sus?

I have got most of that, it's only by experimenting that you find out. I would probably start off with a slightly higher spec donor bike with air forks if I was doing it again.
I wasn't really sure I needed full sus for road / light trail (though I would definitely consider for MTB use). I thought it would reduce the effectiveness of my pedalling for road use

 

[saneagle]

Let me do it for you:

1. 48V 15A or 17A KT Sine Wave controller with power based PAS levels - plenty of smooth quiet power for the steepest road hills even for people that are not as slim as they used to be
2. Rear Geared Hub motor - something like Bafang G020 (H400/400b/405) or AKM 128 2.8-3.5 kg - big enough to not overheat up those hills. The motor should have a high internal reduction ratio for better climbing efficiency.
3. 48V 20Ah battery - at all assist levels gives very long range.
4. Bottom Bracket cadence sensor plus dependent throttle as power boost control.
5. Full suspension bike with air suspension - Rocky Mountain Element or Carve.
6. Hydraulic discs brakes - ideally Shimano M765 combined shifters.
7. Extras : mudguards, lights, puncture resistant road/light trail tyres, Zefal Cyclops mirror, action camera.

 

[Waspy]

I can get all the suspension I need from 2" wide tyres at low pressures.

Yes, I agree. Against all advice I prefer running my 2.1" tyres at 30 PSI. I understand the low pressure/puncture argument, but I'll take my chances.

 

[Az.]

I have got most of that, it's only by experimenting that you find out. I would probably start off with a slightly higher spec donor bike with air forks if I was doing it again.
I wasn't really sure I needed full sus for road / light trail (though I would definitely consider for MTB use). I thought it would reduce the effectiveness of my pedalling for road use

I am looing around for a new bike for my daughter. I can't see anything nice for her, but I have seen many good and cheap bikes for adults on Facebook. I strongly suggest you go for your dream bike.

 

[Waspy]

Let me do it for you:

5. Full suspension bike with air suspension - Rocky Mountain Element or Carve.

Yes, I've soon yours and they have the shock absorber tucked well out of the way but they are not easy to find and not always cheap. I have seen one or two on eBay and FB but they are always medium, I would prefer a large and I only really need the frame.

This slightly scruffy one on FB is 19" (I would prefer 20") in Loughborough for £190

This tidy frame is also 19" but it's in the USA and would cost £260 with postage.

 

[Cadence]

Yes, I agree. Against all advice I prefer running my 2.1" tyres at 30 PSI. I understand the low pressure/puncture argument, but I'll take my chances.

I'm only a recent convert. Bought some Schwalbe Big Apple 26" x 2" (lighter Raceguard version). I'm around 70kg and my heavy steel rigid MTB I guess at near 30kg with kit fitted and tools etc. in panniers. I ran my old 2" cheapo tyres at 50psi front/55 rear, which were "OK" without being brilliant.
I've gradually reduced the Big Apples on successive rides to 35/40. The ride is soooo comfortable without sacrificing rolling ability.
Back to the list. I'd add 650B wheels as a nice compromise between 26" and 700C. This seems to be that way hybrids and ready-built e-bikes are going, so there should be a good choice of tyres going forward.

 

[matthewslack]

Those big tyres work even better on a wide rim. 30mm or more is now common on mountain bike wheels, and cargo bikes such as Tern use 36mm, with a 60mm tyre section.

 

[Waspy]

I'm only a recent convert. Bought some Schwalbe Big Apple 26" x 2" (lighter Raceguard version). I'm around 70kg and my heavy steel rigid MTB I guess at near 30kg with kit fitted and tools etc. in panniers. I ran my old 2" cheapo tyres at 50psi front/55 rear, which were "OK" without being brilliant.
I've gradually reduced the Big Apples on successive rides to 35/40. The ride is soooo comfortable without sacrificing rolling ability.
Back to the list. I'd add 650B wheels as a nice compromise between 26" and 700C. This seems to be that way hybrids and ready-built e-bikes are going, so there should be a good choice of tyres going forward.

I should have added that I also enjoy suspension forks and a suspension seatpost.

I give a lot of thought to comfort and one of the biggest things that I've found that aids comfort is trekking/sweep back handlebars and an uncut steerer tube. No good for mountain biking but fine for leisure/towpath use.

650 wheels look great but I'm committed to 26" for now.

 

[Waspy]

Those big tyres work even better on a wide rim. 30mm or more is now common on mountain bike wheels, and cargo bikes such as Tern use 36mm, with a 60mm tyre section.

Interesting.

 

[Peter.Bridge]

I give a lot of thought to comfort and one of the biggest things that I've found that aids comfort is trekking/sweep back handlebars

Oh yes, forgot that one, I've done that on my current conversion

 

[saneagle]

Yes, I've soon yours and they have the shock absorber tucked well out of the way but they are not easy to find and not always cheap. I have seen one or two on eBay and FB but they are always medium, I would prefer a large and I only really need the frame.

This slightly scruffy one on FB is 19" (I would prefer 20") in Loughborough for £190

This tidy frame is also 19" but it's in the USA and would cost £260 with postage.

I bought my first for £250, which was a really good price. The second was just the frame and suspension for £170, like in your photo. Recently, there was one with carbon forks for only £250. I was going to buy it just for the forks. I wish I had now. Keep looking. One will turn up. There's this one on a UK website, but it seems to be in Germany. It might be worth contacting the guy.

Rocky Mountain Element Team SC used in L | buycycle UK

Buy a pre-owned Rocky Mountain Element Team SC 2005 at buycycle - Striving to be the world's largest marketplace for used bikes. Up to 70% off.

buycycle.com

 

[Raboa]

My set up would be,:
A made to measure frame
A mid drive that suits low cadence
A belt drive
Internal geared hub
Suspension seatpost and stem

You can achieve this with a change to the BBS02 stator but I would like it as standard
Veer do a joinable belt drive but only suits frames with certain dropouts. I think you could modify a chain tensioner to make it work on a standard frame.

 

[Waspy]

I bought my first for £250, which was a really good price. The second was just the frame and suspension for £170, like in your photo. Recently, there was one with carbon forks for only £250. I was going to buy it just for the forks. I wish I had now. Keep looking. One will turn up. There's this one on a UK website, but it seems to be in Germany. It might be worth contacting the guy.

Rocky Mountain Element Team SC used in L | buycycle UK

Buy a pre-owned Rocky Mountain Element Team SC 2005 at buycycle - Striving to be the world's largest marketplace for used bikes. Up to 70% off.

buycycle.com

Nice find. That is a very tidy, very well equipped bike and it's a large! but he wants over £700 with shipping etc. I think I'll just keep an eye out on the usual sources for a decent used frame or decent complete bike without hundreds of pounds of expensive parts.

There's no real rush, but thanks anyway.

 

[mr_ed]

‘Fixie’ rear wheel with belt drive to mid-drive that is discreetly integrated into the frame.
Mid drive of about 750W with a built in CVT, regen braking, torque sensing.
20Ah battery discreetly built in to the frame with onboard charger and fast charging available from a public car charger.
Carbon frame
All wiring neatly hidden in the frame
Just a phone mount for display and controls via an app.
All weighing ~ 15kgs!