Ongoing reliability of Kalkhoff/Focus Impulse 2 motors
- Thread starter Tomtomato
- Start date
I've seen mercs and BMWs very low down on reliability surveys. Audi/VW tend to be a lot better. I think German engineering quality is a mythology.
The Kallkhoff Agattu and Pro Connect bicycles were and still are very good bikes, good design and build quality. And when they decided to make electric versions back in 2007, they used the excellent series 2 Panasonic 26 volt crank unit.
The outcome were two of the best e-bikes ever to hit the market, some members commuting on them ever since. Even better, their batteries lasted five years too.
But then they decided they wanted to use a German crank unit and adopted the Daum one, calling it Impulse in a pretence it was their own. That was the first of the German crank drive designs and had sold very few independently. The first series wasn't bad, the failure rate very low, but with more powerful competitors such as Bosch arriving, they upped the Impulse power for the series 2, and the rest is history.
If only they'd stuck with Panasonic they'd have got their 36 volt later unit and avoided all the troubles.
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No, it has just gone downhill like everywhere else as companies try to increase profit margins. German engineers are highly qualified but they lack imagination so they conceive products that are more and more bland IMO. With ZF getting into the electric bike business with various partners there might be a shakeup ahead.
The whole Kalkhoff farce is because they brought motor manufacturing in house to increase profit margins. They are pretty good at building bikes but not very good at building motors.
D
Deleted member 4366
Guest
Back in the 70s. the German car makers were probably the only ones to use proper quality controls. They were based on following rigid routines to adhere to standards. The result was what we call "solid German engineering", where the product would be very robust at the expense of other parameters.
During the 70s, the Japanese started using a more cooperative approach based on statistics, so they leapt ahead of everyone on quality. It wasn't until the late 80s that the British and American car producers recognised the gap, so they paid the Japs to show them how to do it, while the Germans, on the whole, kept to their rigid routines.
During the 90s, everybody tried hard using every technique available, but there were three fundamental approaches. the Germans focused on rigid routines and standards, the Japs kept their cooperative approach and the British added creativity into their systems. at that point, I'd say that the big German producers, in particular Mercedes-Benz, were slipping behind. I packed it all in in 2000, so I've lost touch of where they all stand now.
I've seen fundamental flaws in the way German companies approach quality - mainly that the hierarchical structures lead to arrogance rather than cooperation, but, generally, they still do a good job.
Reputations always are based on results from a long time ago.
True indeed. Apparently, in the Victorian period, German engineering products were considered poorly made tat by British standards but the Germans made a concerted effort to up their game and soon matched or overtook us. (I think I heard this on a BBC4 documentary).
Sony apparently started out as a company with a reputation for producing cheap low quality tat, their main product being a deep fat fryer if memory serves correctly. They made it their mission one day to turn that opinion around and be known for high quality.
Not quite, Sony were the first company to licence transistor manufacture, the second company to put a transistor radio set on the market, and the first to do so with their own transistors. My family had one in Ireland in 1957.! ( Yes that date is correct) . I was given access to it and continued to " improve " it until it stopped working... Making me very popular with my parents...
German engineering also gained by losing the war. New machinery.
Saab suffered from over engineering their cars. They went on forever. Forgetting that people need to buy new ones on a regular basis to make a profit.
then GM bailed them out and the rest is history. Beware of Americans bearing gifts.
Saab suffered from over engineering their cars. They went on forever. Forgetting that people need to buy new ones on a regular basis to make a profit.
then GM bailed them out and the rest is history. Beware of Americans bearing gifts.
SAAB never sold enough, regardless of who was in charge. Making 4000 or less per model per annum was never going to be viable long term.
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Hi,
Has anyone had any luck getting a refund?
I ask as we have two impulse 2 powered Kalkhoff bikes, both of which are now failing again.. This will be their second motor replacement in less than 18 months!! The bikes where bought from 50cycles.
We live in Devon so miles from 50cycles to keep taking the bikes back!! also the main issue is breaking down as it is rather hilly around here so would be completely stuck!
Rob
Has anyone had any luck getting a refund?
I ask as we have two impulse 2 powered Kalkhoff bikes, both of which are now failing again.. This will be their second motor replacement in less than 18 months!! The bikes where bought from 50cycles.
We live in Devon so miles from 50cycles to keep taking the bikes back!! also the main issue is breaking down as it is rather hilly around here so would be completely stuck!
Rob
Try and negotiate a swap to the Kalkhoff Bosch powered bikes. It would be worth you offering to put some money towards it, if a deal can be done.
Thanks Peter, that is a great idea.. Did not even know they had a range of Bosch powered bikes now.
I have a Pro Connect B10 (The B signifying Bosch) which I've only had for a few weeks and just approaching 400 miles on the clock. I do like it and the cycle parts all seem of good quality. I've only ever heard people complain about the Impulse motor the rest of the bikes seem fine.
apologies for bumping a long post - but I'm contemplating a kalkhoff beat - does anyone know if the impulse 2.2 is reliable? I gather the impulse 2.0 had problems. does anyone have longer term experience of a kalkhoff beat with impulse 2.2? I wonder what the top speed is, and whether the lack of a suspension fork is an issue given our third world pot holed roads?
D
Deleted member 4366
Guest
Read this, then decide for yourself:
http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/beat-bike-toba-crossbar-bike-log.27632/
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