You said 1000 of years ago. Punishment shootings in Ireland happen now.
200 years ago impailment happens in Europe. Gassing and crucifixion happened in living memory. Think and check your history before you make sweeping discriminatory statements.
Leaving the EU
- Thread starter flecc
- Start date
200 years ago impailment happens in Europe. Gassing and crucifixion happened in living memory. Think and check your history before you make sweeping discriminatory statements.
Tillson is right about inflicting unnecessary pain to aminals we kill for food though. Not just our government but the EU as a whole should get rid of halal and kosher food labelling. I am against sport fishing too.
Absolutely, I'm in total agreement with Tillson and yourself about these issues. There comes a point where our standards have to be accepted without compromise.
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Those acts do happen, but today they are illegal here. Torture happens in the UK today, but again, it's illegal. In some Islamic cultures, stoning a woman to death as a punishment for being raped is quite acceptable. Flogging people to death is also acceptable and Saudi Arabia still crucify people. That's a few examples of 1000 year old practice still alive in other cultures.
It really does defy belief that you can seek to justify these acts based on illegal and unacceptable practice within today's UK society. This is so far removed from sanity that
Labelling would be a good start, then at least we would have the option not to buy meat produced in this way.
I have been to a slaughter house and seen conventional slaughter techniques. Even this is far from ideal, but if we are to demand meat in the quantities we require, this is how it will be produced.
The minimum we can do is to reduce the pain and distress for the animals going through this hell. Religious slaughter just makes it worse. Where are the RSPCA in all of this?
Busy getting new members and raising funds, while still appearing to support fox hunting.
It's the Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Some Animals.
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I do not justify I'm merely pointing out the gross error on your argument.
It isn't thousand years since the western opinion was its ok to do these things. In Living memory in Western Europe mass murder, torture, etc were considered perfectly acceptable. Ripping a fox to bits with dogs has only just been banned.
Trying to state that the immigrants are a 1000 years behind us is wrong.
They include Christians Jews atheists. People who just want to live in peace.
They also have sick twisted people just as we do.
Wow looks like we will be responsible for world war three, the destruction of the planet a threat of terrorist attacks the destruction of Europe and various other catastrophes if we vote to leave the EU. Of course none of these are scare tactics but are total and indisputable facts because they are from the remain camp. All statements from the Brexiters camp are to be treated as scaremongering. As in the debate between Nick Clegg (anyone remember him ) and Nigel Farage where the ukip man pointed out that the whole population of the EU could if they wished come to the UK unhindered. This was pounced on by Clegg as scaremongering. He then quickly followed that by saying that three million jobs would be lost.This of course is pure fact. It seems that for a country that would be reduced to the status of Guernsey upon exit, we have a disproportionate influence on world events. I have reached the conclusion that the remain camp is in total panic and fears that we will vote to leave and is therefore spouting this drivel on a daily basis. I believe that most sensible people in this country will see through this tripe and not be swayed by it. If we vote to stay we will regret it almost immediately as the EU turns the screw on us and takes away even more of our freedoms. Let's take this opportunity to get our freedoms back
On this point I'm in agreement in a sense Gray.
The fact is that all warnings of consequences on both sides of the debate are scaremongering, simply because nobody can possibly know either way.
I don't pretend to know. I'm mainly in favour of staying the course with the EU because the possible final benefit is so great.
Beyond that everything is just opinion. My opinion is that on our own in the way the world is developing will ultimately leave us the poorer. Your opinion is the opposite. It's not worth us arguing about this, since we aren't going to change opinions just on the basis of someone else believing differently.
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Flecc as you say we will have to agree to differ on this but as always I have a great respect for the measured way in which you state your case. I just wish the people running the stay/leave campaigns would conduct them in the same way and treat us with some respect
A sentiment that I'm sure is shared with an increasing number of people. Hopefully those debating will realise before too long that their present style of argument is non-productive.
A possible outcome could be many so sick of the whole issue that there'll be a low turnout to vote, the worst possible consequence.
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they are all career politicians. Spin is what they do for a living.
I have come up with plan over my indecision on which way to go.
Quite simple really, as she who commands opposes everything I do or think, I will vote opposite what she will.
But I have a postal vote and goes off two weeks earlier than the due date, she could change her mind. Oh bother.
Quite simple really, as she who commands opposes everything I do or think, I will vote opposite what she will.
But I have a postal vote and goes off two weeks earlier than the due date, she could change her mind. Oh bother.
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I have an even simpler system (though,apologies,it doesn't shed light,r probably thankfully heat Ito the debate), abstain: I'm in Africa at the moment,and think it's great,I have half a mind to move here. Both sides of the brexit debate is IMHO morbidly self interested and self obsessed. There's a bigger happy world out there that happily doesn't give a rat's ass about this kind of navle gazing.
My sister did that! She gave up on this country some years ago and has lived in India, Pakistan, West Africa, South America and currently Bulgaria. I've also got a niece doing similar, I never know where she'll pop up again.
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I read that the BBC is to exclude the British party with the largest representation within the EU parliament, the third biggest party in British politics and the party which forced a referendum on EU membership from their Wembley debate on EU membership. This of course is UKIP.
Isn't this the clearest demonstration to date that the government and the biased broadcasting corporation are frightened to death that the truth will come out about the EU, its failure and our membership.
It is undemocratic practices like this which are commonly deployed by the pro-EU side which turn me off the idea of EU membership. This should be speaking to you, they are suppressing free debate and the truth. Why?
Isn't this the clearest demonstration to date that the government and the biased broadcasting corporation are frightened to death that the truth will come out about the EU, its failure and our membership.
It is undemocratic practices like this which are commonly deployed by the pro-EU side which turn me off the idea of EU membership. This should be speaking to you, they are suppressing free debate and the truth. Why?
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The answer to your question "Why?" is that it's a side effect of our first past the post electoral system.
So UKIP suffers unfairly. And it's not only UKIP now, it's unlikely that the Labour party can hold power in Westminster in the foreseeable future without the Scottish vote. That's because the Scots now have two Socialist parties to vote for, their own SNP one which holds most of the power in Scotland now with devolution, or the Westminster one which influences hardly anything in Scotland now. It stands to reason they will vote for their own one, the SNP, leaving Labour out in the cold.
The answer to both of these problems is simple, the proportional representation that Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland now enjoy we need in the UK electoral system.
That would enable UKIP to be fairly represented with true proportions and also give Labour a chance again.
The present mixture of three out of four with proportional representation but the overall voting as first past the post is irrational.
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