Kalkhoff latest impulse crankdrive system

Thought it worth a fresh thread of its own as probably a significant development in crank drive systems. we have been chatting about this new system on another thread...

Flecc said this:

I think the Impulse system is holding lots of promise, having the potential to overcome the occasional things that a few don't like about the other current systems from Bosch, Daum and Panasonic.

 

For once it could be the crank drive that suits almost everyone.

This impulse system has been available at shows for test rides since April this year in Germany. And on sale since mid August. A lot of threads on these bikes on German pedelec. here are some + urban biking brief review, at the end of threads are links to others etc....

Ok seems that the translated links dont work. go to site. click on "discussions" and click on Derby cycles forum. from there scroll through until you find first impulse thread and from there you will find loads of others...

Google Translate

Google Translate

Google Translate

Leichter fahren, schneller stoppen: Kalkhoff Impulse - YouTube

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from what I have read it is potentially a better system the the often criticised "counter intuitive" Panasonic crank drive. a bit more willing but not as good as the Bosch. importantly it is cheaper, have a look at 2012 Panasonic prices! A few testers say it is noisy. choice of 11Ah or 15 Ah batteries. I just wish they had been a bit more adventurous with battery placement as I prefer the look of Bosch/Storck battery within triangle (achieving a normal wheelbase) For me it fails on looks as very traditional and German styling.Hopefully some better looking pro connect style bikes will come....

German pedelec forum have a Kalkhoff representative as a member and there contributions are very usefully and informative......

Edited October 8, 201114 yr by eddieo

Does this link work Google Translate

Thanks! yes it does...

the one I tried to load started with this: "I rode the Derby Cycle Impulse (price around 2000 €) for a road show"

title : "Derby Cycle Impulse"

and then loads of links at end of that thread...

Edited October 8, 201114 yr by eddieo

I agree with eddeio....which makes a change , they could have put the battery in the frame, though i only think this works on the 'diamond' frame, not the step through.

I think i much prefer the look of the Bosch system, but not its shortcomings.

The battery capacities seem just right for the pedelec system, wonder whats happened to their 'new' 18ah battery?

Coaster brake? never tried one, has anyone had experience of these, they certainly don't seem popular here.

Is this the development that flecc has been keeping under his hat for some time?

Edited October 8, 201114 yr by Biged

Thanks Eddie and Arstu.

A bike's looks are a very personal thing of course Eddie, but I prefer the look of the Impulse equipped bikes to the Bosch equipped ones. From the outset I haven't liked the look of the Bosch "scrotum" hanging under the crank area. The line of the Impulse system looks so much neater in it's relationship with the cowling and bike. And I prefer an integrated-to-unit battery sitting behind the seatpost rather than a remote one with longer trailing connections, neater and potentially far more reliable over time.

Added to these, the smoother operation of the Impulse system will give it wide appeal and it's good that we have this choice. The Bosch system sharp cutoff at 15 mph definitely put it out of the frame for me, and the small battery doesn't help it. I don't buy the "use two batteries" argument when today's high capacity Li-polymer batteries are so light and compact as the Kalkhoff batteries show.

Kalkhoff via Derby Cycles are really going places in the e-bike world. In the latest developments, having blocked a takeover by the Accell Group, Derby Cycles are now planning a mutual partnership with the Pons company who own Gazelle, making them an even bigger combined player in Europe and internationally. The fact that they as an e-bike manufacturer have their own brand power units and batteries puts them in a unique position internationally, giving them huge design and development potential.

I think the impulse system may be a development by Daum? its hard to get to the facts sometimes with the poor auto translation...So when they talk about "thumb" they are discussing Daum on some of the impulse threads:confused:

The Bosch is lovely you need to try it...Range more then enough for me as Bosch is renowned for being an efficient system.

I am even considering a rethink and going for a ProConnect BS10 10-GXT (350 watt Bosch) for myself. when and if they are available... and moving the DaaHub kit to a stepthrough for the wife....

Edited October 8, 201114 yr by eddieo

I think the impulse system may be a development by Daum? its hard to get to the facts sometimes with the poor auto translation...So when they talk about "thumb" they are discussing Daum on some of the impulse threads:confused:

 

The Bosch is lovely you need to try it...

Definitely no Daum involvement from my understanding of the Impulse development, Daum very much a rival. "Thumb" appears to be a mistranslation of an operating word.

I don't need to try the Bosch in it's present form Eddie, I just can't stand any system that shuts off sharply at 15 mph. There have been plenty of them in the past and all have been horrible to ride where I'm concerned. I'm far from alone in that, our friends at A to B also hate that on every bike they've reviewed that's like that.

The virtual death of the Yamaha system in the market is very relevant to the Bosch. The Yamaha gave more power than the Panasonic without the latter's early phase down so it should have been a real winner. What stopped that? The widely disliked harsh operation at cutoff speed and the small 8 Ah battery. Sounds familiar?

Thanks Scott

Any idea regards the ProConnect BS10 10-GXT ? When will it be available, or if purely a special order? plus an indication of price would be nice.

also have you tried the "Impulse compact" or sahel version, as wondering what they are like (for the wife)

Edited October 8, 201114 yr by eddieo

A couple more links if anyone is interested.

Kalkhoff : Kalkhoff Impulse receives first

Kalkhoff Impulse: Home

Hi

 

I can confirm the Kalkhoff Impulse was totally designed and developed by some very smart engineers in Derby Cycles who hold the patent for the coaster crank drive motor. A team was given the task 5 years ago to come up with a Coaster brake crank drive motor. They traveled the world taking the best from the best.

So does this mean there have been no improvments in the way the rest of the motor works? If all it is, is that they have added a back pedal break, (I personally back pedal breaks) then that is not good. I saw in another thread that 50cycles will not be importing them with this feature on, so that would mean we are going to be paying higher prices for no improvments!

So does this mean there have been no improvments in the way the rest of the motor works? If all it is, is that they have added a back pedal break, (I personally back pedal breaks) then that is not good. I saw in another thread that 50cycles will not be importing them with this feature on, so that would mean we are going to be paying higher prices for no improvments!

Misunderstanding, this refers to the new Kalkhoff Impulse system for 2012 which does have many improvements over other makes.

All former and present models use the Panasonic unit.

Being a bit of a thicky, can I ask some idiot question?

What is an Impulse drive?

How does an Impulse drive differ from the present Panasonic drive?

Why is an Impulse drive better / worse than any bother type of drive?

My knowledge is that it takes the best features of the others and the Panasonic unit and combines them.

It's motor drives via the chainwheel like the Bosch unit, no more small sprocket problems and less wear.

It's system allows full power at any cadence and is cunningly arranged so that low, medium or high cadence riders can have their individual prefered cadence at legal cutoff speeds.

It uses a sensitive torque sensor like the Panasonic one so operates more smoothly than the newer rivals.

It uniquely can have an integrated back-pedal brake, effective too, a first for crank drive units.

It has an additional display console showing a variety of facts, including road speed.

It uses a to-the-frame and mudguard styled battery of quite high capacity for long range as standard.

The rest will have to wait until we try it.

.

Edited October 8, 201114 yr by flecc

Being a bit of a thicky, can I ask some idiot question?

What is an Impulse drive?

I was in the process of writing exactly the same question when I read yours........

I suspect the term 'impulse drive' is purely a marketing term

Annoyingly someone beat us to the Startrek reference in a previous thread!

Annoyingly someone beat us to the Startrek reference in a previous thread!

All we need to do is engage the warp drive, travel through a worm-hole and go back in time and beat them to it. However, the thought of a bike with warp drive is a little terrifying and I'd recommend extra thick knee pads.

Edited October 9, 201114 yr by daudi

Technically there are 4 types of chainwheel drive a la Panasonic.

1/ The crank drive. Works well but is prone to inconsistent power output and tends to be unreliable

2/ The warp drive. A clever idea but many question the use of an oval chainwheel

3/ The impulse drive. Technically ingenious but riders report a lack of urge at some points in a journey and a surfeit at others.

4/ The sex drive. Generally considered the most powerful but has a high failure rate with age.

Technically there are 4 types of chainwheel drive a la Panasonic.

 

1/ The crank drive. Works well but is prone to inconsistent power output and tends to be unreliable

 

2/ The warp drive. A clever idea but many question the use of an oval chainwheel

 

3/ The impulse drive. Technically ingenious but riders report a lack of urge at some points in a journey and a surfeit at others.

 

4/ The sex drive. Generally considered the most powerful but has a high failure rate with age.

Or in short, Warped Cranks have a Sex drive Impulse.

A question if I may, is this new Impulse drive back pedal brake work as a regen brake or friction pads? I can see the benefit of a regen brake all in one simple to use unit but otherwise it's just another crank drive - in itself a good idea.

Note to self - I must stop reading about all these new developments as I can't afford yet another ebike!

There can be no regen involved, the back pedal brake is integrated into the crank and not associated with the motor or a wheel hub.

Nor is it a friction pad brake, it's almost certainly a roller and ramp brake like the one Shimano make for bike hubs, so no maintenance needed.

Sounds like a useful thing to have (the roller brake), I wonder why they've never been popular in this country.

I don't know of any specific reason, but as long ago as 60 years our English customers disliked them.

They are more suited to leisurely utility riding like that more common on the Continent, and the traditional ones were never very effective. Originally based on brake drums, shoes and pads, car style, they often got oil soaked rendering them useless.

Even the modern Shimano roller and ramp incarnation is much weaker than any rim or disc brake.