German e-bike market success

[flecc]

In 2017 almost three-quarters of a million e-bikes were sold in Germany, one in five of all bicycle sales. If only we in the UK could enjoy that success, here it's probably only one in forty at most.

All the detail on this link
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[egroover]

I spent a week cycle touring (non powered) last year in the Ruhr area, it seemed every other bike we saw on the paths and trails was an ebike.

 

[Nealh]

In 2017 almost three-quarters of a million e-bikes were sold in Germany, one in five of all bicycle sales. If only we in the UK could enjoy that success, here it's probably only one in forty at most.

All the detail on this link
.

And not counting the many ebike kits fitted by diyers, a read thru pedelec.de threads shows a vibrant scene there as well.

 

[Steve Bowles]

The best e-bikes seem to be German-made. German engineering, and work ethic are a winning combination.

 

[Benjahmin]

Sure, and the most expensive and practically impossible to repair yourself and if you need a new battery - better go and see the mortgage broker.

 

[anotherkiwi]

The best e-bikes seem to be German-made. German engineering, and work ethic are a winning combination.

https://etrike.wordpress.com/

Chinese and Canadian and German bits assembled in Germany by a photographer does that make him an engineer?

 

[cyclebuddy]

The best e-bikes seem to be German-made. German engineering, and work ethic are a winning combination.

Various comments I’ve been reading lately on this forum:

Kalkhoff are probably the most unreliable e-bike motors available.

Bosch motors are made in France.

Riese and Muller use Taiwanese frames and Cube frames aren’t made in Germany either.

Given that almost all of the other bits screwed onto a "German" e-bike come from the Far East anyway, what part of a German Branded e-bike is actually German... apart from the excessively inflated price?

On the other hand, there seem to be some pretty good, well-engineered e-bikes coming out of Czech/Romania if you want an e-bike assembled in the EU by workers who genuinely do seem to have a good work ethic... but being sold for sensible money.

 

[Steve Bowles]

Various comments I’ve been reading lately on this forum:

Kalkhoff are probably the most unreliable e-bike motors available.

Bosch motors are made in France.

Riese and Muller use Taiwanese frames and Cube frames aren’t made in Germany either.

Given that almost all of the other bits screwed onto a "German" e-bike come from the Far East anyway, what part of a German Branded e-bike is actually German... apart from the excessively inflated price?

On the other hand, there seem to be some pretty good, well-engineered e-bikes coming out of Czech/Romania if you want an e-bike assembled in the EU by workers who genuinely do seem to have a good work ethic... but being sold for sensible money.

My comment just solidifies my inexperience regarding e-bikes. I chose the Riese-Muller Charger GT on the recommendation of an 80-year old friend who has put 4000 miles on his Homage since August.

 

[RobF]

Both my previous Rose and current Riese and Muller Charger have a solid build quality which I've not seen on any other bikes.

Quality bits skilfully assembled is all it takes, but lots of makers seem to fall down on one, the other, or both.

 

[cyclebuddy]

Both my previous Rose and current Riese and Muller Charger have a solid build quality which I've not seen on any other bikes.

Quality bits skilfully assembled is all it takes, but lots of makers seem to fall down on one, the other, or both.

Well, that sounds to me like a great testament to the quality of Far Eastern manufacture given the bulk (probably all) of your Riese and Muller bike is actually manufactured, if not assembled, there.

All we seem to be missing is the opportunity to pay the poor Far Eastern factory another £50 to assemble your Riese and Muller bike properly in the factory where it's actually made, and you could've avoided the whole "German assembly" thing and saved yourself a thousand quid or two?

 

[Steve Bowles]

It seems you have a bias against Riese-Muller and anything labelled "German-made". I know my bike was made to order, whether in Germany or Outer Mongolia is scant relevance if the engineering was done by Herrs Riese und Muller. That every owner of an R-M electric bike raves about the build-quality is a testament to the work-ethic and quality control of whatever factory is producing these bikes -- something most other bike manufacturers are not obviously enforcing.

I don't know (or care) what bike your pedalling, but I'm sure a side-by-side comparison with an R-M and yours would be enlightening. And BTW, R-M owners aren't concerned about saving a grand or two if the bike they receive is everything they've always wanted.

 

[cyclebuddy]

It seems you have a bias against Riese-Muller and anything labelled "German-made". I know my bike was made to order, whether in Germany or Outer Mongolia is scant relevance if the engineering was done by Herrs Riese und Muller. That every owner of an R-M electric bike raves about the build-quality is a testament to the work-ethic and quality control of whatever factory is producing these bikes -- something most other bike manufacturers are not obviously enforcing.

I don't know (or care) what bike your pedalling, but I'm sure a side-by-side comparison with an R-M and yours would be enlightening. And BTW, R-M owners aren't concerned about saving a grand or two if the bike they receive is everything they've always wanted.

You're missing the point entirely. Your German bike isn't German at all. It's a product of Global manufacture... just with an inflated German price tag. R&M are as German as Woosh or Amps bikes are British. I am half-German by the way, so have no axe to grind. But hey. delude yourself if you choose to.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

And those bikes use Bosch electrical parts. It's the electrical parts that give the most reliability issues apart from the accelerated wear and tear on the drive train. Did the Riese and Muller engineers didn't change them to make them any more reliable than any other Bosch bike? Is there a special R&M bearing or seal behind the drive sprocket to stop water getting in?

Bosch parts are made in China, and have the same kind of manufacturing quality issues as many other parts.

When did anybody ever have a non-electrical problem with a Kudos bike? AFAICS, build quality isn't really an issue on bikes from any of the established brands.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Re Riese and Muller. They are certainly assembled in Germany, I have been there and seen the factory.

The frames come in from Taiwan and most of the components are made in Asia as per most electric or vanilla bikes. A large percentage of the Bosch motor parts are made in China. I'm not sure where the battery is made but I would guess China or Japan, but certainly Asia.

So what?

Although they are only assembled in Germany, it does not mean to say they are not great bikes. They are assembled with care and precision... as are most of the products that come out of China in particular or Asia in General

When will we stop worrying about where a product is made/built, surely it's the product that counts not the country of origin? As long as the assemblers and buyers are happy that slave or child labour is not being used to make the products, it really doesn't matter.

 

[Steve Bowles]

Re Riese and Muller. They are certainly assembled in Germany, I have been there and seen the factory.

The frames come in from Taiwan and most of the components are made in Asia as per most electric or vanilla bikes. A large percentage of the Bosch motor parts are made in China. I'm not sure where the battery is made but I would guess China or Japan, but certainly Asia.

So what?

Although they are only assembled in Germany, it does not mean to say they are not great bikes. They are assembled with care and precision... as are most of the products that come out of China in particular or Asia in General

When we stop worrying about where a product is made/built, surely it's the product that counts not the country of origin? As long as the assemblers and buyers are happy that slave or child labour is not being used to make the products, it really doesn't matter.

Bloody hell! I insisted that they used child-slave labour!

 

[Ajax]

I've always thought Ebike would take off in a big way if a lead character in a soap where to be seen riding one, or if a postel worker in a rural area soap was featured riding one as a normal fixture. I know i only discoverd the ebike by accident.

Now if only Sir Clive Sinclair, back in the day, had the foresight to 'reinvent' the electric hub motor instead of his feable 'electric car'.

Product placement anyone?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I can remember round about 1992, when the LE Velocette was next to useless and you couldn't give them away. I used to go to all the classic and vintage motorcycle auctions to see them go through unsold at £30. Then a guy on Coronation Street started using one, and the price immediately jumped to £300 for the same bikes.

 

[RobF]

I'm sure my Bosch battery is marked Made in Poland, and someone said the motors are made in France.

Not that it's so important, although the only bit I've had conk out on any of my three Bosch bikes is the Chinese made thumbswitch.

Quality components, properly assembled is all that's needed.

The premium German brands are good at that.

It comes down to what you value.

I would rather pay slightly more for a slightly better overall product, which is what you get with the likes of Riese and Muller.

Some buyers are very price sensitive.

We all make our choices.

 

[flecc]

I can remember round about 1992, when the LE Velocette was next to useless

It was a solution to a problem that never existed.
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[flecc]

Now if only Sir Clive Sinclair, back in the day, had the foresight to 'reinvent' the electric hub motor instead of his feable 'electric car'.

He did try repeatedly to produce e-bike motors and an e-bike, all three useless like almost everything he ever produced.

They were the Zeta 1 friction drive on tyre front motor, the Zeta 2 being almost the same thing but mounted on the back wheel and just as useless, and the failed Zike e-bike.
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