Wait 'till you see Wicky's nose start to water!I see Flec thinks it's funny.
I don't think so, I think it's bloody hilarious, made my eyes water.
Face masks...
- Thread starter Zlatan
- Start date
Come off it, 11 to 16 year olds frightened by a cyclist wearing a face mask? No way, that suggestion is a joke, the majority of them being teenagers as likely to be frightening to other people.
I'm betting a single pupil complained to the head teacher who then overreacted well beyond her authority.
I agree that the cyclist could have conducted himself better, but he was reasonably aggrieved at being wrongly challenged and bringing in the police was a gross overreaction for someone doing absolutely nothing wrong.
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I think it is most likely the "fear" came from parents and not the kids. Unfortunately, it's the way many people live in these times.
Indeed, far from being fearful one of our biggest social problems is that today's kids don't seem to fear anything. Even in primary schools as young as 8 year olds are openly defiant of teachers, even physically attacking them and being excluded.
The notion that this crowd of 11 to 16 year olds pouring out of school were frightened by one man wearing a face mask is ludicrous, laughable.
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at the end of the day ...he was challenged by a member of staff who was not happy at this actions/behaviour near to school premises. Something must have happened to warrant calling the Police. They attended. The officer tried to reason with the male by making him aware that his actions were causing harassment , alarm and distress ( to whom is not important )..He refused to co-operate with the officer.
Rather than having a to and fro with the male the officer COULD have dealt with him by arresting him for conduct likely to cause a breach of the peace OR if there was sufficient supporting evidence from staff and possibly a member of public COULD have been arrested for disorderly conduct contrary to section 4a of the Public Order Act and let the custody Officer make a decision as to whether or not the arrest was lawful and if detention would be authorised and then let CPS make a decision whether to proceed with a prosecution case or release with No further action being taken.
In some cases the process decision is the responsibility of the case progression manager and not cps for simple cases where a fixed penalty for disorder may be issued or a ''simple caution''
but we don't know the full back story as none of use were there.
Rather than having a to and fro with the male the officer COULD have dealt with him by arresting him for conduct likely to cause a breach of the peace OR if there was sufficient supporting evidence from staff and possibly a member of public COULD have been arrested for disorderly conduct contrary to section 4a of the Public Order Act and let the custody Officer make a decision as to whether or not the arrest was lawful and if detention would be authorised and then let CPS make a decision whether to proceed with a prosecution case or release with No further action being taken.
In some cases the process decision is the responsibility of the case progression manager and not cps for simple cases where a fixed penalty for disorder may be issued or a ''simple caution''
but we don't know the full back story as none of use were there.
and if ''fear'' or alarm and /or distress was caused to ANYONE then the cyclist has committed and offence which MAY render him liable to arrest.
Please dont let the issue of him being a CYCLIST cloud your judgement. If he caused distress to ANYONE present or other wise then he should be dealt with accordingly.
I would definitely have arrested him. Complaint from member of staff / actions outside a school / distressing members of public.
The decision to charge / caution / fixed penalty / NFA would be determined on the full back story - that being previous convictions / previous cautions / previous fixed penalties / witness or complaint statements and any previous incidents at the location or educational establishments involving this person.
The cctv / video taken of this incident would also be siezed as evidence.
So to go back to your question ;-
Throwing the book ? - the cps /courts make that decision.
I would take positive action to remove this person from the location - that isn't throwing the book at him.
The decision to charge / caution / fixed penalty / NFA would be determined on the full back story - that being previous convictions / previous cautions / previous fixed penalties / witness or complaint statements and any previous incidents at the location or educational establishments involving this person.
The cctv / video taken of this incident would also be siezed as evidence.
So to go back to your question ;-
Throwing the book ? - the cps /courts make that decision.
I would take positive action to remove this person from the location - that isn't throwing the book at him.
I work with loads of ex police although not my background (bobbies, detectives, senior management - sorry not down with actual titles/ranks)
I did a quick pop quiz today out of interest. Less than 5% would have arrested on info available ( one out of 23 respondants)
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If you watched the video, you would have heard the H'officer say he was there on another matter. FFS, he was picking his step-child up from school wearing something on his head which someone found distressing. Some people find clowns and Santa distressing. It's no wonder that so many people have no respect for the Law these days is it?
Mine was not a question it was a statement which you have quite clearly decided on
The guy may have been a bit edgy but far from distressing members of the public if you think he was distressing the public you have lead a very sheltered life
The copper was also trying to throw his weight around unless you watched a different video to me approaching the guy when he was trying to walk away and fronting up to him
They were both a bit edgy but hardly anywhere near an arrest or removal
But hey we all have our opinions im just glad you don't have any authourity as many people would be filling up cells
You are being ridiculous if you claim a legitimate item of clothing can be said to cause fear or distress.
Answer me the question I posed earlier. What would you do if a muslim woman turned up for her child with niqab or burkah almost completely covering her face and someone complained it was frightening?
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on the info available from the video...A ''complaint from a teacher who states that she is alarmed at the actions of the cyclist. She states, and I'm not going to call her a liar , that a member of her school ( pupil ) has expressed concern over the males demeanour and appearance . I would do the same as the cop. I would firstly point out that his actions / appearance are causing concern. I would ask him to remove his face mask. He refuses so I would ask his name. He refuses. I would point out that he causing a breach of the peace or is committing an offence contrary to the Public Order act. He refuses his name.. I would then warn him that failure to provide his details may also render him liable to arrest. He refuses...I ARREST HIM...Positve action taken . Happy member of public. Unhappy ''cyclist'' TOUGH !
He had the chance, many chances, He chose not to comply.
So please go back to your Detectives / seniors / former cops and ask this ;-
1) When was than last time a Detective went to a complaint of masked male outside a school acting in manner that caused harassment alarm and distress ? --
2) Same question to a (Former ? ) Senior Officer.
3) Now as the former Senior officer this. He/she arrives for work on a Monday Morning around 10am. His voicemail is ringing, there are scores of emails waiting to be answered from Partnerships ( councillors, education dept , the head teacher of the school, the local MP ,the safeguarding partnership as to why positive action was NOT taken at the incident at the school involving the masked man when an officer attended?)
4) Ask the Former senior officer this ;- When he/she attends the safeguarding partnership meeting the next morning and is sat around the table schmoozing the local council - can he /she satisfy their barrage of questions as to why there was no action taken at the school
5) ask the former senior officer this ;- How will he/she answer the request for a full report I requested by the Chief Constable I- as your responses to the local council etc have not been acceptable and so they have raised the issue with the PCC who has dropped init back onto the toes of the CC ref the lack of action taken at the school incident.
6) Now ask the former cops how they would compile their duty report requested by the Former senior officer who has received the request by the CC , detailing their activities at the school now that it has gone viral on social media and national media.....
So its not an easy job, is it ?
He had the chance, many chances, He chose not to comply.
So please go back to your Detectives / seniors / former cops and ask this ;-
1) When was than last time a Detective went to a complaint of masked male outside a school acting in manner that caused harassment alarm and distress ? --
2) Same question to a (Former ? ) Senior Officer.
3) Now as the former Senior officer this. He/she arrives for work on a Monday Morning around 10am. His voicemail is ringing, there are scores of emails waiting to be answered from Partnerships ( councillors, education dept , the head teacher of the school, the local MP ,the safeguarding partnership as to why positive action was NOT taken at the incident at the school involving the masked man when an officer attended?)
4) Ask the Former senior officer this ;- When he/she attends the safeguarding partnership meeting the next morning and is sat around the table schmoozing the local council - can he /she satisfy their barrage of questions as to why there was no action taken at the school
5) ask the former senior officer this ;- How will he/she answer the request for a full report I requested by the Chief Constable I- as your responses to the local council etc have not been acceptable and so they have raised the issue with the PCC who has dropped init back onto the toes of the CC ref the lack of action taken at the school incident.
6) Now ask the former cops how they would compile their duty report requested by the Former senior officer who has received the request by the CC , detailing their activities at the school now that it has gone viral on social media and national media.....
So its not an easy job, is it ?
Flecc - This is where the possibly of race / religious discrimination may now come into this post . I would deal with every incident on its merit and professionally and within the constraints of the law. Should you feel that you have suffered harassment , alarm and distress then crime would be recorded and investigated accordingly A full report would be submitted to CPS.
They would make a decision whether or not to progress your case / complaint and also to consider if YOU have committed an offence by making this complaint. For example have you made a complaint in order to incite race or religious hatred ?
With the case of a person wearing full head to toe Niqab. This persons identity can be established in a correct and professional manner by taking that person to one side out of view of the public and a person of the same sex can then request they lift the veil in order to make a positive identification - usually from photographic I/d..You may have sen this take place at passport control in airports. There is sometimes an old fashioned hospital screen placed near to the passport desk.
I think that this post has now run its course and there is now a possibility of it running away and so I would request that it be closed.
Stumpy, have you considered a career in the Force? I think you could go all the way to the top
Who are you to request a post be closed ? and that is a question just to clarify
also are you not the one discriminating against the bloke for picking up his child with a face mask on
double standards or what yet you want to show professionalism in the case of the Niqab which in my eyes in no different to his face mask
I think its you who should quit the thread for Discrimination.