Electric brompton is coming soon?

[patpatbut]

I think we are close

http://www.ibtimes.com/iconic-brompton-folding-bicycle-going-electric-purists-get-over-it-2369089

 

[shemozzle999]

I think I'll wait until they release the bike before making any comments. I just hope they have used the government innovation grant wisely.

 

[trex]

There are two major problems I see with an e-Brompton: can it be kept light enough for the normal carrying stance? -12kg -13kg is possibly the limit, and secondly, the world is moving towards £1000 e-bike, folding or not.
I fear they have left it too late to make any significant impact.

 

[flecc]

Ah, the Electric Brompton.

It brings to mind some other things I'd still have liked to have seen, the Gryphon, the Loch Ness Monster, the lost city of Atlantis.
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[anotherkiwi]

At least you will have seen the electric Morgan!

 

[Croxden]

I wanted a jet pack. We were promised in the Eagle we would have them now. Must have been politicians.

 

[oldgroaner]

Talk about inertia! it would take a couple of days to redesign the brompton to make a good Ebike, who is the proprietor kidding?
Here is my Sparticle Brompton,
It isn't actually being held together with red sticky tape, that's to stop me damaging the paint as I can no longer (don't laugh) get my leg over!
and the only extras it needs are
1) a PAS sensor on the bottom bracket .
2) Moving the battery and controller to the rear rack so you leave them connected when folded
3) Some decent front suspension
3) A Nuvinci auto change rear hub gear.
4) V or disc brakes PLEASE!!!
If he can't manage that he's in the wrong business!
I am 72 and would quite likely die of old age if I waited for Brompton to do anything innovative, why don't they ask the original designer to have a go (if he's still available)
Brompton are like a lot of British companies, lacking any spirit of adventure, when there's a world out there to exploit, they cling on to what they know.

 

[oldgroaner]

T

There are two major problems I see with an e-Brompton: can it be kept light enough for the normal carrying stance? -12kg -13kg is possibly the limit, and secondly, the world is moving towards £1000 e-bike, folding or not.
I fear they have left it too late to make any significant impact.

The difficulty seems to me that they haven't yet grasped the notion that the brakes are supposed to actually stop the bike quicker than putting your shoe against the tyre, hence in the link provided timid Tim was talking about attaining the staggering velocity of 10MPH.
One of the many joys of the Brompton is the fact that unless you keep the speed down going downhill, the brakes somehow (without slowing the bike appreciably) heat the rims up so much the tyres burst!
This I suppose classifies Brompton owners like myself as "Extreme Sport" enthusiasts.
A couple of days ago I came down a hill in Devon with a very broken road surface and gradually the speed built up (it was a clear road so I let it go) as far as i can judge the bike computer was reading somewhere over 30mph, but at the time I was caught up in my own version of the opening sequence from "The Bionic Man" (remember that?) and reading the display was very difficult.
Have you ever noticed how time slows down at times like that? there was ample time to enjoy the situation.
The option was to try applying extreme force to the brakes (risky) or trust to luck.
I chose (wisely I feel ) the latter, though I was at the point of thinking that 72 years was a pretty good innings when luckily as all hills do, eventually it flattened out and I was able to bring the beast under control.
Since then my speed is kept down to somewhere around 15mph when going downhill!
A pal of mine had the unique experience of a front wheel burst, flying over the handlebars, and being run over by his own bike, fortunately without suffering injury to anything more than his pride, (he landed on grass) and muddy legs after retrieving the bike from a ditch.
This is where the Brompton scores, he folded it up and caught a bus home.

 

[patpatbut]

We are close


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[Deleted member 4366]

All that time for that! I'm the eternal sceptic, so I hope I'm wrong, but that just looks like a copy of Jerrysimon's idea, but with a crappier motor (Crystalyte NSM direct drive?). Jerry offered to help them, but they welched out at the last moment. they could have had that 5 years ago.

With all that development time and help from Formula 1 designers, I was expecting something like the Gocycle with a bespoke motor, but with a better folding mechanism.

I hope that video is just a bit of misdirection and just shows an early prototype. Surely, that's not the actual bike? When I used to teach product design at secondary school, the kids would come up with designs like that in a few hours with a bit of prompting. 9 years for that???

I guess we'll have to wait for the price, but I could knock up a better attempt than that in an afternoon with my mate's 3D printer, a Q85 motor, an S06S controller and a hundred quid's worth of cells from Ebay for a total cost of about £300 retail and probably half the weight, plus you wouldn't need that ridiculous bag thing on the front.

 

[flecc]

With all that development time and help from Formula 1 designers, I was expecting something like the Gocycle with a bespoke motor, but with a better folding mechanism.

Me too, this could be disappointing. One thing that concerned me about Will Butler-Adams comments earlier was him saying the motor assists with 20 to 30% of the power needed. That's only an Eco level, making it lower powered than anything else on the market. No doubt that's to keep its weight minimal, but there comes a point of low power where having e-assist isn't worth the added cost and complexity.
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[patpatbut]

All that time for that! I'm the eternal sceptic, so I hope I'm wrong, but that just looks like a copy of Jerrysimon's idea, but with a crappier motor (Crystalyte NSM direct drive?). Jerry offered to help them, but they welched out at the last moment. they could have had that 5 years ago.

With all that development time and help from Formula 1 designers, I was expecting something like the Gocycle with a bespoke motor, but with a better folding mechanism.

I hope that video is just a bit of misdirection and just shows an early prototype. Surely, that's not the actual bike? When I used to teach product design at secondary school, the kids would come up with designs like that in a few hours with a bit of prompting. 9 years for that???

I guess we'll have to wait for the price, but I could knock up a better attempt than that in an afternoon with my mate's 3D printer, a Q85 motor, an S06S controller and a hundred quid's worth of cells from Ebay for a total cost of about £300 retail and probably half the weight, plus you wouldn't need that ridiculous bag thing on the front.

Hi Dave

I totally agree with you. I wish you would come up something rather than front hub motor.

On the other hand, have you seen q83 motor? It is on BMSB but you need to buy 100 to place the order. It seems a good fit for brompton as the width is 73mm

Pat


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[patpatbut]

Hi Dave

I totally agree with you. I wish you would come up something rather than front hub motor.

On the other hand, have you seen q83 motor? It is on BMSB but you need to buy 100 to place the order. It seems a good fit for brompton as the width is 73mm

https://bmsbattery.com/home/843-q83-36v250w-front-driving-ebike-hub-motor.html

Pat


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Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jerrysimon]

Wow you guys are quick off the mark!

Just watched the video. Its hard to see what they have done ??

I put a restrained comment on the youtube post lol

Maybe everything is in that bag with an umbilical chord ?

We will no doubt see. Weights will be interesting. Any sensible conversion will need to be in two parts i.e. bike and bag if the whole ethos of portable is to remain.

Jerry

 

[flecc]

I am 72 and would quite likely die of old age if I waited for Brompton to do anything innovative, why don't they ask the original designer to have a go (if he's still available)

He's around, Andrew Ritchie is still the technical director of Brompton at 70 years old, having stepped down in 2005 from being El Supremo. I don't think he's interested in too much involvement these days though, under Will Butler-Adams they're now over three times the size they were in 2005.
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[jerrysimon]

Yes Flecc though I heard that the expansion to the new premises did cause a slight dip in profits, maybe just rumour I don't know.

Will Butler-Adams has certainly taken the company forward in terms of expansion and moving into the foreign market. I am not keen on their practises in terms of strict control and treatment of shops that sell their product. I guess its all about profit and maintaining their brand and certainly no one can deny that they have achieved that.

Its a great product and they have a sellers market. I paid £400 for my first Brompton in 2009, I think my model retais at £1000 now.

Jerry

 

[flecc]

I am not keen on their practises in terms of strict control and treatment of shops that sell their product. I guess its all about profit and maintaining their brand and certainly no one can deny that they have achieved that.

Yes, they've always taken a tough line, and dealers have to be satisfied with a below par profit markup. They can't really protest though, any bike shop worthy of the name has to have the Brompton brand.

That's long been common practice in selling quality items though. I remember decades ago during the resale price maintenance era how lesser names in cameras had to offer substantially more margin to dealers to get them to stock.
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[Deleted member 4366]

Hi Dave

I totally agree with you. I wish you would come up something rather than front hub motor.

On the other hand, have you seen q83 motor? It is on BMSB but you need to buy 100 to place the order. It seems a good fit for brompton as the width is 73mm

Pat


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Only a front or middle motor is possible because of the hub gears. I guess that derailleur gears would get knocked out of line too much when folding and carrying.

I was sort of expecting that it would have had one of those flat middle motors that go behind the chainwheel.

I don't think there's anything wrong with a front hub-motor on a bike like the Brompton. The Gocycle has one that's brilliant. I converted a Brompton a while ago with a Q85 front motor. It was OK during normal riding, but on very steep hills (>14%) you could hear it struggling for traction due to the massive torque it gets in a small wheel. Hill-climbing certainly wasn't a problem as far as torque was concerned.

The motor in the video looks pretty big. I'm pretty sure it's a direct drive one, otherwise there would be no need to have one that big. The small Crystalyte Brompton one is 3.5kg, so nearly double that of the Q85. I can't understand why they'd want one so big.

 

[Mal69]

They only make one bike, they have no plans to make any others the article says, does that not limit their potential market?

I personally do not like these small bikes, in traffic I wouldn't feel safe and they remind me of children's toys but to each their own.

 

[flecc]

They only make one bike, they have no plans to make any others the article says, does that not limit their potential market?

I personally do not like these small bikes, in traffic I wouldn't feel safe and they remind me of children's toys but to each their own.

It's the one folder that can easily be carried onto buses, trains and even on planes as hand luggage, while still having good rideability. That's their expertise, if trying to make full size bikes they wouldn't be able to offer anything worthwhile against the established brands.
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