I'd still question whether there are actually fewer cyclists on the road this year than last, even if there are fewer new bikes...
Cycling hostility and decline
- Thread starter Marwood Hill
- Start date
Agreed, and why I gave an agree to your earlier post, the exceptionally fine weather will have been a great influence.
As said, statements need to be clarified. A very large reduction in sales undoubtedly means a decline in those taking up cycling, whilst those who bought bikes last year but had more limited use then could have been very evident in this year's sunshine.
The decline in those taking up cycling I've been forecasting for some three or four years now. This is a car driving nation and car drivers in Britain mostly don't like cyclists and certainly wouldn't join them.
It follows that the pool of people who might take up cycling is limited and will continually reduce as more cycle. There will come the point in cycling expansion where there's hardly any more willing to.
After that recent huge surge in bike sales, almost doubling some years, we'll are much closer to that point now.
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But tbf you are a glass half empty type of guy.
You have to admit that. Your posts certainly reflect a pessimistic view on life. This isn’t meant as an insult btw.
I personally think cycling can only expand. The building of cycling lanes across our major cities indicate this.
Certainly agree that with so many initiatives encouraging cycling across the country, cycling participation can only grow. To suggest that cycling is in decline is ridiculous. We also have a number of bike rental schemes going on, which will have had some effect on bike ownership. When I see a statistically significant poll, I just might start to take such statements seriously...
Down here in our little old towns there is no such thing as a cycle lane. History freaks are so determined to keep the place in the 19th century that nothing gets done. Most of the roads once used by just horses & carts and bicycles are much the same width today. They were not upgraded for cycling safety when the motor vehicles took them over. And you should hear them if we ride on the pavement.
This looks like one of our North Devon roads. It’s actually a cyclepath in Canada where they’ve got 100s of miles of them.
That looks amazing. We can only dream of such infrastructure.
It's all the money they've got from legalised cannabis sales 
Looks like the bloke fell off his bike too
Looks like the bloke fell off his bike too
I cycle with local road club most Sunday mornings, and I must say that over the past couple of years I have noticed a general increase in the hostility shown towards cyclists. Mid week, I can’t say I’ve noticed much change.
The Sunday morning ranters usually take the form of a type two diabetic timebomb family making their way to a car boot sale. It’s usually fat purple headed dad who displays the greatest amount of anger, but sometimes Mum will join in and treat us to a display of distorted tattoos on her “bingo winged” upper arms as she shouts and gestures. We usually smile and give a friendly wave, safe in the knowledge that statistically, they’re not going to live very long.
Quite ironically, the other group of angry motorists we encounter, is caravan towers. Seemingly frustrated at being held up by slow-moving road users! These people, who seem to find it acceptable to take a $h!t in a wardrobe, separated from the rest of the family by only a thin veneer of teak, blast their car horns, drive inches off our back wheels and deliberately “buzz” us as they overtake.
In some people’s minds, there does not seem to exist the faintest glimmer of the concept of shared road usage. I think it’s a British thing.
The Sunday morning ranters usually take the form of a type two diabetic timebomb family making their way to a car boot sale. It’s usually fat purple headed dad who displays the greatest amount of anger, but sometimes Mum will join in and treat us to a display of distorted tattoos on her “bingo winged” upper arms as she shouts and gestures. We usually smile and give a friendly wave, safe in the knowledge that statistically, they’re not going to live very long.
Quite ironically, the other group of angry motorists we encounter, is caravan towers. Seemingly frustrated at being held up by slow-moving road users! These people, who seem to find it acceptable to take a $h!t in a wardrobe, separated from the rest of the family by only a thin veneer of teak, blast their car horns, drive inches off our back wheels and deliberately “buzz” us as they overtake.
In some people’s minds, there does not seem to exist the faintest glimmer of the concept of shared road usage. I think it’s a British thing.
I can understand why you post that but it's very far from the truth, I'm very much the opposite. I've just demonstrated that to a local organisation, the council and a water company who'd all given up on something due to predicted high costs. I refused to accept that and solved the problem to everyone's satisfaction at zero cost.
But I am a realist and take note of facts, hence my accurate forecasting. When sales of bikes slump by 36% from their peak as they've done, that is undeniably a decline in people taking up cycling. On the other hand I did acknowledge that overall bike sales and cycling have increased over the longer term, and have posted many times in this forum about these huge increases since year 2000. Being a relative newcomer to the forum you perhaps won't have seen that.
Agreed, but as I've explained with a primary cause, at an ever slower rate. I believe that some of the current reduction in bike sales is due to the early effects of that cause.
Only punitive legislation against motorists and motoring can correct that, but that depends on what is politically possible.
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This is my equivalent nearby. We've got a couple of hundred metres!
Further back it fizzles out into a path too narrow to walk a bike along, just wide enough to ride through, except it's too ridiculously steep to cycle.
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This is exactly how a foot / cycle path should be marked. Our miles of Tarka Trail should be done this way. And the tree roots which are breaking through the surface need removing.This is my equivalent nearby. We've got a couple of hundred metres!
Further back it fizzles out into a path too narrow to walk a bike along, just wide enough to ride through, except it's too ridiculously steep to cycle.
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That's a widespread problem. Trouble is that cutting such major roots can kill trees, provoking local protest. We've had these battles in my area.
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Have you ever driven a car? You will probably know the feeling. Motorists just hate to be the one directly behind a bicycle. They feel like the guilty one. They feel that they are the one holding up the traffic. Just listen to that impatient driver behind honking his horn. First driver behind just has to get past this bicycle. Take a chance maybe.
Couple days ago i am coming down our road on Big Bear. I am doing 20mph. Car comes up behind me and overtakes. Then pulls in, right in front of me, and enters a filling station. I have to brake hard and near enough stop.
Couple days ago i am coming down our road on Big Bear. I am doing 20mph. Car comes up behind me and overtakes. Then pulls in, right in front of me, and enters a filling station. I have to brake hard and near enough stop.
Yes, but I refuse to be intimidated or feel guilty. In my car I'm perfectly happy to crawl along behind a cyclist for as long as it takes, and I also hang back some way so the cyclist doesn't feel harassed by my presence.
It's even better now I have an electric car since I switch off the low speed pedestrian warning sound so the cyclist doesn't hear any car noise behind and often won't even know I'm there.
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I’d be so interested in 2nd hand figures of bikes. Just seems to me that a “decent" new bike costs a far higher percentage of the average pay packet than it used too.
What you can in the second hand full suss market for 800 is astonishing , often serisoluy upgraded and cared for with love
essentially I'd like to see the graph that shows new bike sales vs 2nd hand . My theory being they are inversely linked
But what 2nd hand stats there may be are not worth much is suggest
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What you can in the second hand full suss market for 800 is astonishing , often serisoluy upgraded and cared for with love
essentially I'd like to see the graph that shows new bike sales vs 2nd hand . My theory being they are inversely linked
But what 2nd hand stats there may be are not worth much is suggest
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There's no doubt that the second hand bike market has incredible bargains, for two reasons:
First the fact that new bikes are available from £49.95 and e-bikes at times from £299 tends to severely limit second hand prices.
Second that we are not in the hand-me-down age of yesteryear, second hand being deeply unfashionable. That makes the used market small and small markets mean low prices due to fewer customers.
We've seen it in here with bikes costing over £2k going at less than a year old for well under £500 and even as low as £350 just to shift them.
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It's not bikes where I live that are the problem. It's horses. Like the wild west, creating a mess everywhere and holding traffic up much worse than bikes. They are unpredictable and need a wide berth, and I believe they do not have to be insured, but not totally sure about that.
Loads near my parents in Hertfordshire , it’s defo not a legal requirement though strongly recommend and any responsible owner should have it
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[QUOTE="flecc, post: 458608,
Second that we are not in the hand-me-down age of yesteryear, second hand being deeply unfashionable. That makes the used market small and small markets mean low prices due to fewer customers.
.[/QUOTE]
It’s this bit I’m not sure about. It too big a leap for me albeit logical
Access to second hand market is vastly simpler than a decade ago , eBay, gumtree , schpock and Facebook give fantastic access and communication possibilities country wide (and indeed beyond )
That’s why I’d like (but won’t be able to see) actual evidence to support this “small market”
I’m afraid I don’t quite buy the statement (well not without supporting evidence anyways) .
With respect you also take no account of the trend for unique , bespoke , custom and vintage that second hand market offers . All bang on trend and arguable buzz words for “hand me down” !
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Second that we are not in the hand-me-down age of yesteryear, second hand being deeply unfashionable. That makes the used market small and small markets mean low prices due to fewer customers.
.[/QUOTE]
It’s this bit I’m not sure about. It too big a leap for me albeit logical
Access to second hand market is vastly simpler than a decade ago , eBay, gumtree , schpock and Facebook give fantastic access and communication possibilities country wide (and indeed beyond )
That’s why I’d like (but won’t be able to see) actual evidence to support this “small market”
I’m afraid I don’t quite buy the statement (well not without supporting evidence anyways) .
With respect you also take no account of the trend for unique , bespoke , custom and vintage that second hand market offers . All bang on trend and arguable buzz words for “hand me down” !
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