Close Pass: Cardiff drivers warned give cyclists more room

[oyster]

Close Pass: Cardiff drivers warned give cyclists more room
Police are getting on their bikes to catch drivers who pass dangerously close to cyclists as they overtake them.

Six motorists - including one lorry driver - were stopped and given information on overtaking safely, in the pilot of a scheme in Cardiff.

A plain-clothes officer spent three hours cycling in the city and filming those who failed to give enough room.

Many drivers simply "don't realise they are driving too close," police said.

South Wales Police worked with Cardiff Council and South Wales Fire and Rescue to pilot Operation Close Pass on 31 July.

It involves the plain-clothes officer on a bicycle wearing a camera to film drivers who overtake them.

If the driver does not give the bike 5ft (1.5m) of room as recommended by the Highway Code, nearby colleagues flag them down and offer training on how to pass cyclists safely.

Those who refuse the training can be prosecuted - leading to penalty points and a fine.

During a late-morning pilot in Whitchurch, officers stopped six vehicles and also seized one after discovering it was being driven without insurance.

Wayne Tucker, road safety manager at South Wales Police, said the response from drivers was generally positive.

"A lot of people don't realise that they are driving too close," he said.

Operation Close Pass was originally developed by West Midlands Police in September 2016.

Officers say it led to a 20% reduction in cyclists being killed or seriously injured on the roads in just one year.

The scheme is now being piloted for the first time on Welsh roads - where 115 cyclists were killed or seriously injured in 2016.

More operations are planned "in the near future," police said.
officer on a bicycle wearing a camera to film drivers who overtake them.

If the driver does not give the bike 5ft (1.5m) of room as recommended by the Highway Code, nearby colleagues flag them down and offer training on how to pass cyclists safely.

Those who refuse the training can be prosecuted - leading to penalty points and a fine.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-45112892

Sadly, I have my doubts that sufficient impact will be achieved with the limited resources that will be available for this.

 

[TZC]

Good stuff. I'd be so over the moon with 5ft. I often find myself either cussing overtakers for being so close or being so ridiculously safe they're on the opposite curb

 

[anotherkiwi]

Buy a trike, they change lanes for me OK I exaggerate a little because we are in holiday season and the low lifes have gotten the car out of the shitholes they live in usually...

 

[Benjahmin]

On a two lane road I ride half way between curb and the middle of the lane. Drivers are left in no doubt that they have to go over the white line to get past me. Most go completely into the other lane. Some, however, still manage to get between me and oncoming traffic but at least I've left myself some wiggle room. A few months ago I banged on the side panel of a van and got a reaction. I pointed out that, as nose to finger tips is considered to be roughly 1 metre, he was a hell of a lot closer than 1.5. I think the hollow bang scared the **** out of him - well good, hope he learned the lesson.
It seems to me that there are an increasing number of drivers around who are uncomfortable with the size of their vehicles, particularly posh SUV owners . I see this driving round the narrow lanes here when having to use passing places. Many can't seem to judge how far their nearside is from the bank, also the ability to reverse seems to be a dying art.

 

[flecc]

I think 5' is unrealistic though, one metre is plenty. If everyone stuck to 5' or more in London, few vehicles could ever pass. I'm happy with a foot or two.

How about quid pro quo?

London commuting cyclists routinely fly past slower moving vehicles on the nearside with only inches to spare. How can that be safe if the other is not?

As ever, cyclists need to look to their own behaviour before getting so snotty about others.
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[oyster]

I think 5' is unrealistic though, one metre is plenty. If everyone stuck to 5' or more in London, few vehicles could ever pass. I'm happy with a foot or two.

How about quid pro quo?

London commuting cyclists routinely fly past slower moving vehicles on the nearside with only inches to spare. How can that be safe if the other is not?

As ever, cyclists need to look to their own behaviour before getting so snotty about others.
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On Tuesday evening, I had to follow a bike on a main road at, I guess, less than 10 mph for towards a mile. Reason? There are several. I am even more careful now about ensuring there is plenty of safe space and on the particular road there is a significant right bend. Given the good quality surface oncoming traffic is often very fast. But the fundamental was that the cyclist did not use the very fine shared use pathway that runs down the entire road. No idea if he didn't know it was there or didn't want to use it - for whatever reason.

So, yes, there can be behaviour which exposes cyclists to more danger than necessary.

 

[flecc]

On Tuesday evening, I had to follow a bike on a main road at, I guess, less than 10 mph for towards a mile.

I often get this on one long, narrow, twisty climb from the Weald to the top of the North Downs. It's a very popular route for race cyclists in training, some of them are professionals in this area, but the climb is a tough one and they are often very slow. I'm entirely happy to trickle along behind, but it's often obvious they are somewhat embarrassed by holding me up for a long time. I hate that and wish there was some way of saying, "please take your time, it's not a problem". All I can do is hang well back so as to not make my presence too obvious.

When driving I'm all for taking great care with cyclists, but would appreciate a bit more tolerance on their part. Too many of them are arrogantly anti motor vehicles and just looking for trouble, sometimes having a camera expressly for that purpose. That includes some members of this forum.

the cyclist did not use the very fine shared use pathway that runs down the entire road. No idea if he didn't know it was there or didn't want to use it - for whatever reason.

There's a widespread view among cyclists that such paths are the thin edge of the wedge in which their use might be made compulsory, so they deliberately refuse to use them.

They have a point, many of them are so badly maintained that riding a thin tyred roadie bike on them is impractical, and there has even been at least one prosecution and fine for not using a cyclepath. Information link
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[Fat Rat]

one metre is plenty.
I'm happy with a foot or two
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I would not be happy at all
Maybe ok in London but most of the roads I ride are national speed limit so if someone based me with a foot or two at 60mph I probably wouldn’t be here to talk about it
5 ft is great as far as I’m concerned
But there lies the problem
London speeds are next to nothing in comparison so you can get away with a bit less room allthou a lot of drivers have problems judging 5 foot let alone 1-2ft
but they can’t have a rule of one distance there and another somewhere else as it just wouldn’t work so 5 foot it has to be

 

[flecc]

I would not be happy at all
Maybe ok in London but most of the roads I ride are national speed limit so if someone based me with a foot or two at 60mph I probably wouldn’t be here to talk about it
5 ft is great as far as I’m concerned
But there lies the problem
London speeds are next to nothing in comparison so you can get away with a bit less room allthou a lot of drivers have problems judging 5 foot let alone 1-2ft
but they can’t have a rule of one distance there and another somewhere else as it just wouldn’t work so 5 foot it has to be

Of course the gap has to be speed dependent, no argument there. My objection is to the cyclists who start screaming hysterically at a driver who passes with a 2 foot or even 3 foot gap at 30 mph.

A little earlier I went out to collect an item and was driving in a line of traffic along Selsdon Park Road, all of us at between 30 to 35 mph in a single vehicle width marked lane. On the left was a painted line cycle lane with one cyclist riding at about 10/12 mph, it being very slightly uphill.

There was no possibility of crossing the centre of the road since there was continuous traffic in the opposite direction, so we were all passing the cyclist with around 2 foot gap. Despite our speed being almost three times his, he showed no concern at all since there was no danger.

Since we have the highest intensity of cycling in the country, your 5' gap would quickly bring the whole of London to a standstill, completely bonkers and unnecessary.

And here's another example of why the universal 5' insistence is silly. I'm on the edge of London so much of our cycling is away from London on country lanes which are often very narrow, sometimes not allowing two vehicles to pass at all points. Being typical country lanes we can't cycle in the verge since the surface is often broken and potholed there and littered with thorns etc, so the cycling is two or three feet out.

Obviously we regularly meet vehicles coming the other way, often abruptly due to tight bends with high hedges, and there just isn't anything like 5' available to leave, especially when it's a large van or truck. Those passes of course are at opposing speeds, a large differential, yet we never seem to hear any cyclist complaining about that. It's always about similar distance passes in the same direction with much smaller speed differentials. Not very rational, is it?

And even more irrational when cyclists themselves regularly fly past moving vehicles going in either direction with only inches to spare, skimming them very close.
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[daveboy]

If you look at the paniers on my bike you can see the blue and silver stickers.
(the right one is peeling off) cars give you a lot more room if they think you are
a PCSO

 

[Fat Rat]

Of course the gap has to be speed dependent, no argument there. My objection is to the cyclists who start screaming hysterically at a driver who passes with a 2 foot or even 3 foot gap at 30 mph.

A little earlier I went out to collect an item and was driving in a line of traffic along Selsdon Park Road, all of us at between 30 to 35 mph in a single vehicle width marked lane. On the left was a painted line cycle lane with one cyclist riding at about 10/12 mph, it being very slightly uphill.

There was no possibility of crossing the centre of the road since there was continuous traffic in the opposite direction, so we were all passing the cyclist with around 2 foot gap. Despite our speed being almost three times his, he showed no concern at all since there was no danger.

Since we have the highest intensity of cycling in the country, your 5' gap would quickly bring the whole of London to a standstill, completely bonkers and unnecessary.

And here's another example of why the universal 5' insistence is silly. I'm on the edge of London so much of our cycling is away from London on country lanes which are often very narrow, sometimes not allowing two vehicles to pass at all points. Being typical country lanes we can't cycle in the verge since the surface is often broken and potholed there and littered with thorns etc, so the cycling is two or three feet out.

Obviously we regularly meet vehicles coming the other way, often abruptly due to tight bends with high hedges, and there just isn't anything like 5' available to leave, especially when it's a large van or truck. Those passes of course are at opposing speeds, a large differential, yet we never seem to hear any cyclist complaining about that. It's always about similar distance passes in the same direction with much smaller speed differentials. Not very rational, is it?

And even more irrational when cyclists themselves regularly fly past moving vehicles going in either direction with only inches to spare, skimming them very close.
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What a shock you disagreed with my opinion lol

The roads are not perfect but I’m afraid there has to be rules laid down somewhere they can’t accommodate everyone perfectly but thats life we all have to make sacrifices
but having vehicles skimming past me is not one I need in my life
you may not value your life but I do value mine

What I will agree with is irrational people in any walk of life on the road or not there’s just no need for it .

As for lanes there are different rules for single track lanes with no white lines for quite a few different things and common sense dictates you can’t give 5 ft clearance for passing when the lanes only 6 ft wide
And by the way you don’t know what narrow lanes are you should live in S w Wales

 

[flecc]

By the way you don’t know what narrow lanes are you should live in S w Wales

Don't kid yourself, I've got a couple near me in Surrey where I have stop on my bike and lean into the hedge for a Range Rover or similar to squeeze past.

I think some lanes like this exist in every part of Britain once one starts to explore, just old tracks that eventually got hard cored and tarmacked.
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[Fat Rat]

Don't kid yourself, I've got a couple near me in Surrey where I have stop on my bike and lean into the hedge for a Range Rover or similar to squeeze past.

I think some lanes like this exist in every part of Britain once one starts to explore, just old tracks that eventually got hard cored and tarmacked.
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Range rovers can’t even get down ours lol

 

[oyster]

I think some lanes like this exist in every part of Britain once one starts to explore, just old tracks that eventually got hard cored and tarmacked.

I'd sum up the difference in south west Wales (and, at least to some extent, some other parts) to much of the rest of at least England is that some of the extremely narrow, windy roads are signposted as major routes - because they are! And, of course, satnav guides you down many of them.

 

[flecc]

Range rovers can’t even get down ours lol

Didn't know they could afford them in Wales. The benefits level must be higher than I thought.
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[flecc]

I'd sum up the difference in south west Wales (and, at least to some extent, some other parts) to much of the rest of at least England is that some of the extremely narrow, windy roads are signposted as major routes - because they are! And, of course, satnav guides you down many of them.

Indeed, I met some like that when I was up in North Lancashire four weeks ago.
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[oyster]

Didn't know they could afford them in Wales. The benefits level must be higher than I thought.
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Visitors, dear boy. Locals are born knowing every road.

 

[oyster]

London speeds are next to nothing in comparison so you can get away with a bit less room allthou a lot of drivers have problems judging 5 foot let alone 1-2ft
but they can’t have a rule of one distance there and another somewhere else as it just wouldn’t work so 5 foot it has to be

Rather agree.

Also, round here there are several 20mph zones through which I can easily achieve anything from 20 to 30 mph. I'd like to suggest that motor vehicles make sure they keep well over to the left so I can overtake them...

 

[flecc]

Visitors, dear boy. Locals are born knowing every road.

I meant Range Rovers!
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[flecc]

I'd like to suggest that motor vehicles make sure they keep well over to the left so I can overtake them...

With you leaving a 5' gap I hope?

Some hope. That'll be the day when cyclists stop passing inches away. Strange how that's ok but they want 5' left for them.
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