Carrera Vengeance ebike battery charger clicking

[rajeshtailor]

will the batt not come apart easy ? all you need to do is get to the bms balance cable and check the voltage of each cell bank like in the vid i posted but some batts are a bitch to get open and done or purpose.

if its a 36v batt then flat should read 30v i think all it takes is for 1 cell bank to go out of whack and the bms can stop charging the hole pack because of this.

eBike Batteries

ebikebatteries.co.uk

Re-celling
We are able to have your battery collected, re-cell it with our brand cells and class-leading copper interconnects and have your battery re-delivered back to you

he will find out what is wrong and give you a price to sort it one way or another and the best there is and wont use crap cells or bms.

Ok I’ll take the battery apart tomorrow and rest like the video and pray I can put it back together again.

 

[rajeshtailor]

The pic in post #25 is the original charger port for a late model Vengeance. Buyers kept breaking the tiny plug pins, so Suntour concocted the adaptor in post #12 to allow charging through the discharge port.

I'd suggest the OP re-reads his manual here regarding checking the battery. If still in doubt, I'd take both battery and charger into Halfords, and ask them to try his battery with their charger, and his charger with their battery. That'll give a definitive answer as to what's not working.

The older style batteries and chargers were already a nightmare to fault-find because comms on both input and output of the battery plus the charger's own pre-charge self-test routine made it really difficult to determine anything: These new model batteries and chargers IMHO are even worse.

Yeah I checked the manual and the battery SOH (State Of Health) returns 3 solid bars and a 4th blinking one which implies it’s got 80-90% life left in it.

 

[Nealh]

I may just bite the bullet and spend the £20 on a 3 pin charger just to rule out the whole charger issue.

Plug the charger in to the wall and switch on, the two pins at a 3 oclock & 9 oclock are the v+ & v- on the charge jack. Carefully put your meter probes on them and tell us the voltage, just don't short the two jack ins together.

 

[Nealh]

If the voltage on the jack reads 42v then there is nothing wrong with it.

Read the battery manual to see if the battery is in sleep mode as it hasn't been charged for a while, some batteries with sleep mode need a long depress of the on button for 10 - 30 odd secs to wake them up. The wake up is to reactivate the BMS from hibernation.

 

[cyclebuddy]

Yeah I checked the manual and the battery SOH (State Of Health) returns 3 solid bars and a 4th blinking one which implies it’s got 80-90% life left in it.

SOH is different to SOC. What about the SOC on page 15?

 

[Nealh]

SOH is different to SOC. What about the SOC on page 15?

A good spot.

A battery at 80% SOH, one could declare it is waning and and not far from recycling. One at 90% is half way to being at end of life.

 

[rajeshtailor]

So I have taken the battery cover off see attached photo but the bms connections are tiny I can’t seem to get any result using the multi meter I don’t even think I can touch the connectors

 

[rajeshtailor]

SOH is different to SOC. What about the SOC on page 15?

so if I follow the instructions I get 3 lights on and then a 4th blinking light for the SOC but I’m not sure if this is the SOC or the SOH

 

[cyclebuddy]

so if I follow the instructions I get 3 lights on and then a 4th blinking light for the SOC but I’m not sure if this is the SOC or the SOH

What you're reading is SOH.

SOH on Page 8 (state of health) is an assessment on how many charge and discharge cycles you've done to give an indication of how much life (not charge) is left in the cells. 80% shows your battery is partially worn but not totally knackered.

SOC on Page 15 (state of charge) is the energy remaining in the battery. At the two extremes, all LEDs lit means it's fully charged. One solitary flashing LED means it's totally empty. No LEDs at all could be a problem (below LVC).

You can have 80% SOH and still have a 100% SOC (i.e. your battery is already fully charged which is why your charger now won't charge), or 80% SOH and SOC empty.

SOC is what you need to know.

 

[rajeshtailor]

What you're reading is SOH.

SOH on Page 8 (state of health) is an assessment on how many charge and discharge cycles you've done to give an indication of how much life (not charge) is left in the cells. 80% shows your battery is partially worn but not totally knackered.

SOC on Page 15 (state of charge) is the energy remaining in the battery. At the two extremes, all LEDs lit means it's fully charged. One solitary flashing LED means it's totally empty. No LEDs at all could be a problem (below LVC).

You can have 80% SOH and still have a 100% SOC (i.e. your battery is already fully charged which is why your charger now won't charge), or 80% SOH and SOC empty.

SOC is what you need to know.

This is tricky as it says press for 5 seconds for SOH and press for a few seconds for SOC, whats the definition of a 'few seconds'? Each time I try this i get the same results 3 solid lights and 1 blinking light.

Also I tried another test I plugged the charger into the mains and connected the battery. I could hear the clicking sounds from the charging block I then used the multi meter to test the voltage at the black and red connectors inside the battery and it was returning 41v then dropping to 0 then up again to 41v then dropping to 0, repeatedly.

 

[cyclebuddy]

This is tricky as it says press for 5 seconds for SOH and press for a few seconds for SOC, whats the definition of a 'few seconds'? Each time I try this i get the same results 3 solid lights and 1 blinking light.

On the old batteries, it was a quick button press for SOC. Long press for SOH. If you're getting nothing with a quick press, it suggests the voltage has fallen to a very low maybe unrecoverable state.

Also I tried another test I plugged the charger into the mains and connected the battery. I could hear the clicking sounds from the charging block I then used the multi meter to test the voltage at the black and red connectors inside the battery and it was returning 41v then dropping to 0 then up again to 41v then dropping to 0, repeatedly.

On the old batteries, the charger would ramp up voltage briefly to first test the battery before applying full/constant voltage. This sounds the same and supports the view that the voltage is too low for charging. But it suggests your charger is likely okay.

 

[rajeshtailor]

On the old batteries, it was a quick button press for SOC. Long press for SOH. If you're getting nothing with a quick press, it suggests the voltage has fallen to a very low maybe unrecoverable state.

On the old batteries, the charger would ramp up voltage briefly to first test the battery before applying full/constant voltage. This sounds the same and supports the view that the voltage is too low for charging. But it suggests your charger is likely okay.

I agree, I suspect I have 2 options:

1. Get the battery re-celled or
2. Get a new battery.

I'll get a quote for re-celling as I know a new battery is approx £350, and then decide on the best options.

I am also interested in upgrading the e-spec maybe to a faster kit so any recommendations will be great.

 

[Nealh]

In the pic in #47 one has to pull out the white JST connector with the one Red wire and 11 White wires, then take individual cell readings via the pin outs on the connector.
Unusually there are 12 sense wires for 10s , its is common to see 11. So I assume the first White is b0/b- and the Red may be supplying BMS power, the other 10 Whites will be cell balance wires.
Use two pins or needles and place one in the first White wire pin out and another in the second pin out, carefully touch the needles with the meter probes insuring nothing shorts across so use a bit of stiff card placed between the needles.
Set the meter to 20v dc and write down the 1st voltage, For cell #2 move the 2nd needle a long one hole and do the same and then do the same for all the White wires, one then should have 10 voltage readings. Write them down and show us the results.

Did you carry out the jack plug voltage reading I mentioned in #43 ?

 

[egroover]

cheapish 2nd hand battery on ebay if you're quick at £145 del.

carrera crossfire e bike battery e spec | eBay

<p>carrera crossfire e bike battery e spec. </p><br /><p>Mechanically sound </p><br /><p>Battery has green paint on it which is not affecting use</p><br /><p>For the 2nd version of the crossfire model </p><br /><p>May fit others please check if unsure </p><br /><p>Please check out my other items...

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[rajeshtailor]

In the pic in #47 one has to pull out the white JST connector with the one Red wire and 11 White wires, then take individual cell readings via the pin outs on the connector.
Unusually there are 12 sense wires for 10s , its is common to see 11. So I assume the first White is b0/b- and the Red may be supplying BMS power, the other 10 Whites will be cell balance wires.
Use two pins or needles and place one in the first White wire pin out and another in the second pin out, carefully touch the needles with the meter probes insuring nothing shorts across so use a bit of stiff card placed between the needles.
Set the meter to 20v dc and write down the 1st voltage, For cell #2 move the 2nd needle a long one hole and do the same and then do the same for all the White wires, one then should have 10 voltage readings. Write them down and show us the results.

Did you carry out the jack plug voltage reading I mentioned in #43 ?

So I have tried this and I only got readings from 4 connectors 12v each time.

 

[rajeshtailor]

cheapish 2nd hand battery on ebay if you're quick at £145 del.

carrera crossfire e bike battery e spec | eBay

<p>carrera crossfire e bike battery e spec. </p><br /><p>Mechanically sound </p><br /><p>Battery has green paint on it which is not affecting use</p><br /><p>For the 2nd version of the crossfire model </p><br /><p>May fit others please check if unsure </p><br /><p>Please check out my other items...

www.ebay.co.uk

Will that fit on my Carrera Vengeance without making any mods?

 

[egroover]

Will that fit on my Carrera Vengeance without making any mods?

compare the pics with your battery and if they are the same then yes

 

[RupertH]

It clicks when your battery will take no more charge
perfectly normal

 

[rajeshtailor]

It clicks when your battery will take no more charge
perfectly normal

It’s never done that before and also the controller won’t power on when the battery is attached to the bike.

 

[rajeshtailor]

I’ve also got in touch with the re-cell company and they quoted me £400. I think I need a 3rd option. Thinking of maybe refitting the bike with a new conversion kit.