Cadence Sensor, Torque Sensor or Throttle?

A little more info.

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/guides/electric-bike-motors-sensors/

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/torque-or-speed-sensor.18536/

https://www.electricbike.com/torque-sensors/

Where is the no preference option?

I'm saying torque, but in reality I just get on and ride.

If wanted an easy leisurely ride, I'd opt for speed/cadence.

If I wanted a work out, and to feel that I am putting in the effort to help propel the bike forward, and to also feel that I am in control of the bike, not the other way around, then torque it is.

Throttles are of zero interest to me personally, but I do feel that they have a legitimate place within the pedelec market.

Edited December 6, 201510 yr by EddiePJ

In my experience, only those bikes with assistance provided via a torque sensor manage to replicate the act of cycling but with a little assistance on each pedal stroke, making things just a little easier.

All other forms tend to offer something akin to the moped method of travel to one degree or another.

Tom

I have voted for torque and throttle. This was a wishful thinking choice given the situation with new EU regs coming. Otherwise just torque would be my second choice. As for the other choices, we as an industry need to have a variety of systems always available to meet the needs and preferences of our customer base. I feel the new EU regs regarding throttles is a giant step backwards as does anyone else I have discussed this with.

The elimination of 15mph throttle control, I feel, has greatly disadvantaged people with physical limitations. People that may even be helped in improving their health once they got more active. Now their only choice is a mobility scooter and they may not qualify because their condition is not bad enough to warrant it. Mobility scooters are a great thing for people that have the genuine need of. For those that would benifit from a 15mph throttled ebike, being stuck in a mobility scooter would be the beginning of the end for what is left of their remaining physical ability. Sorry for being long winded, this throttle business winds me up.

Thumb throttle only for me as I cycle without power as much as possible and only need short bursts of help, often just for a few seconds to get me up a steep bit or top off a hill.

Maybe when I need help all the time I will fit some form of sensor but at the moment I don't think it would suit my needs.

Dave.

I've voted torque only. Although well used to motorcycle throttles, the Hall sensor throttles on e-bikes are such rubbish in the crude almost on/off way they work that they have very limited usefulness.

So the control relaxation that a good torque sensor gives wins.

.

Just noticed 12 votes but only 6 reasons why!

Dave.

I have voted for torque and throttle. This was a wishful thinking choice given the situation with new EU regs coming. Otherwise just torque would be my second choice. As for the other choices, we as an industry need to have a variety of systems always available to meet the needs and preferences of our customer base. I feel the new EU regs regarding throttles is a giant step backwards as does anyone else I have discussed this with.

 

The elimination of 15mph throttle control, I feel, has greatly disadvantaged people with physical limitations. People that may even be helped in improving their health once they got more active. Now their only choice is a mobility scooter and they may not qualify because their condition is not bad enough to warrant it. Mobility scooters are a great thing for people that have the genuine need of. For those that would benifit from a 15mph throttled ebike, being stuck in a mobility scooter would be the beginning of the end for what is left of their remaining physical ability. Sorry for being long winded, this throttle business winds me up.

Can not agree more! And from within the BA (Bicycle Association) a few of us in the industry have turned their opinion around to support your exact view ER, in their lobbying.

As a cost and ease-of-maintenance sensitive manufacturer my preference is for a Speed or Cadence sensor and throttle (or rather "start assist device").

Nice Poll John!

I've voted torque only. Although well used to motorcycle throttles, the Hall sensor throttles on e-bikes are such rubbish in the crude almost on/off way they work that they have very limited usefulness.

 

So the control relaxation that a good torque sensor gives wins.

.

The thumb throttle i have certainly doesn't work in an on/off way..... the graduation of power is smooth and very controllable.

Its for this reason i'll be keeping it and will carry on fitting throttles.

The thumb throttle i have certainly doesn't work in an on/off way..... the graduation of power is smooth and very controllable.

Its for this reason i'll be keeping it and will carry on fitting throttles.

I find the same, maybe if you use the throttle a lot you get a feel for it, I remember at first I did tend to use it as an on/off control but with use found it easier to be more subtle with it.

Come to think of it when I first started driving a car I found the accelerator and brakes a bit on/off, 50 years later I'm just getting the hang of it:)

Dave.

The Kudos Arriba was originally available only with torque sensor but many customers wanted this bike with speed sensor, now the speed sensor outsells the torque sensor by 4:1.

When customers understand with the torque sensor that to get power out it is necessary to put some power in .....if your legs are tired this can be a big negative. Obviously if you can use a full speed throttle to always have access to peak power irrespective of rider input then this overcomes that negative but the new regs will delete that.

The difference between speed and torque sensors is one of the most popular and misunderstood subjects at bike shows.

A good torque sensor can add £50 to a bike cost.

KudosDave

Just noticed 12 votes but only 6 reasons why!

Dave.

Hi Dave,

It's up to members to simply vote or give their opinions if they have the time and inclination to do so.

The poll will last for a month so over Christmas and into the New Year when people may have more time on their hands.

There is also the option to change your vote should change your mind.

Response so far has been good for a Sunday morning, the outcome will be interesting.

The outcome will be 100% in favor of a throttle:

OED

Definition of throttle in English:

noun

A device controlling the flow of fuel or power to an engine.

Edited December 6, 201510 yr by shemozzle999

Voted for cadence plus throttle simply because this is, as it were, as 'failing health' proof as you can get with a bike.

On a 'good day' I enjoy my torque sensor bike best, as I feel it represents a much closer riding experience to a non-assisted bike, with the reward of assistance being proportionate to the effort applied.

However, for me, not all days are 'good days', hence my cadence plus throttle vote ..... if I'm only allowed one or the other

The thumb throttle i have certainly doesn't work in an on/off way..... the graduation of power is smooth and very controllable.

Its for this reason i'll be keeping it and will carry on fitting throttles.

I don't like thumb throttles, since I don't find them comfortable in use, hence my answer which was for the usual twistgrip ones.

Regardless though, I still ultimately prefer the relaxation of a torque sensor looking after power levels while giving me some exercise, but that too has to be a good one.

Of course motorists would prefer all of us to be throttled.

.

My vote was throttle only.

I am not all that fit and find walking over 100 yards a bit of a challenge now.

On one of my bikes, the crank driver, I have removed the magnet ring and it is throttle only which suits me fine.

On my folder, which has a hub motor, I still use the magnet ring, but often override it with the throttle.

A torque sensor would be no use to me at all.

I like simplicity in things, motor, throttle, controller and battery is all that I want.

There is no real need to build in German type complexity, with mini computers etc.Look at all their trouble you see reported on here.

'What you ain't got, don't need no fixing' (Mark Twain)

There is no real need to build in German type complexity, )

The Japanese complexity from Panasonic is ok though. And judging from Yamaha's last decade's e-bike reliability, their new one will be ok too.

.

Flecc,

I see your point, but I recently replaced my 2 stroke outboard motor with a new 4 stroke, which also has electronics.

Probably runs better, but at sea, reliability is a matter of life and death. The simplicity of a 2 stroke wins hands down over a complex 4 stroke.

As I say, I prefer simplicity, even if it is a bit rougher.

In my experience, only those bikes with assistance provided via a torque sensor manage to replicate the act of cycling but with a little assistance on each pedal stroke, making things just a little easier.

 

All other forms tend to offer something akin to the moped method of travel to one degree or another.

 

Tom

YAWN!!!

Flecc,

I see your point, but I recently replaced my 2 stroke outboard motor with a new 4 stroke, which also has electronics.

Probably runs better, but at sea, reliability is a matter of life and death. The simplicity of a 2 stroke wins hands down over a complex 4 stroke.

As I say, I prefer simplicity, even if it is a bit rougher.

I agree, my seagoing motor boat with two outboard motors was in the almost two stroke only days (only Honda doing different), and they suited me well, even though they were a make no-one had heard of.

Best bet in e-bikes for sheer simplicity and reliability though is a direct-drive hub motor with simple throttle control. Almost nothing to go wrong, so long as a DD motor can handle the territory.

.

My kit is cadence sensor and throttle and gets my vote. However I may build another with a torque sensor to get more exercise on good days. I think there's a place for all. It would be great if commercial suppliers could supply the basic bike and power unit, then be able to tailor the control to a customers particular needs.

I find that the cadence sensor on mine is much more of an on/off switch than the throttle, and can catch you out in some tight manoeuvre's. Hence the argument for the throttle being a limiter.

Best bet in e-bikes for sheer simplicity and reliability though is a direct-drive hub motor with simple throttle control. Almost nothing to go wrong, so long as a DD motor can handle the territory.

.

Heinzmann have this very option......but only until New Years day.