Confusing two different things? The protection from suffering given by the vaccines if Covid-19 caught, and protection against acquiring Omicron.
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Brexit, for once some facts.
- Thread starter flecc
- Start date
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Hmmm. Someone replied to my post regarding Ivermectin (I believe it was you - apologies if not) but they now seem to have deleted it.
Anyway ...
In that posting, the comment was basically made that Ivermectin is an anti-parasitic treatment only.
For whatever reason, this is unfortunately a misconception that is widely propagated by the media, and unless you step outside the mainstream narrative, its easy to fall victim of this false notion.
Fortunately, there are hundreds of published articles and medical papers out there that can be found if you look, showing that Ivermectin is anti-viral as WELL as anti-parasitic.
I'll just cut and paste one section from one such paper to give you an example. Lots and lots of others out there:
" Ivermectin has played a critical role in prophylaxis and elimination of River blindness, lymphatic filariasis and low-intensity Loa[6], [10].
This broad-spectrum anti-parasitic drug has exhibited potent antiviral effects against several ribonucleic acid (RNA) viruses, such as Zika virus, influenza A virus, Venezuelan equine encephalitis virus, West Nile virus, porcine reproductive and respiratory syndrome virus, Newcastle disease virus, chikungunya virus, human immunodeficiency virus (HIV-1), yellow fever virus, dengue virus, Japanese encephalitis virus, and tick-borne encephalitis virus[11]-[19]. Ivermectin has also exhibited antiviral activity against deoxyribonucleic acid (DNA) viruses, such as the pseudorabies virus, porcine circovirus 2, parvoviruses and bovine herpesvirus..."
Conspiracy theories are all about attributing to some others usually unnamed .." They , " or in your choice "Mainstream narrative " , who are suppressing some truth. You are engaging in that. Nobody on this forum has any of the medical expertise ( possible exception Oyster), to evaluate whether any chemical compound is likely to have any antiviral or any antibiotic or any anti fungal or any anti parasitic effect. We are dependent on peer reviewed medical science ,published and validated in the medical journals ,and then ...and this is very important .... Transferred into Standard Operating Practice by the National Regulatory Bodies.
The fact that you quote a journal article shows that there is no suppression. The date on that abstract is relevant, since it dates when no vaccines had been released.
Not at all convinced. That could even be an accurate assessment for the population. But we, as individuals, care about our individual protection - and for those close to us.
Prior infection will, I strongly suspect, provide varying degrees of future protection, against Omicron as one example, depending on precise variant, individual make-up, previous infections with other viruses, and goodness knows what else.
We can easily fall into traps by using population statistics and applying them to individuals.
I absolutely and definitively DO NOT have the medical expertise, indeed I don't have any medical expertise except what I have picked up over the past twenty years from reading and personal experiences.
However, I do think that many are pushing that there is Ivermectin "suppression" without adequate grounds. And, to echo the above, I have well and truly lost count of the number of times I have read about things not published in the MSM - and done so within the MSM.
Early in the pandemic, we saw hydroxychloroquine being pushed by the chap in France, the orange idiot, and many others.
Since then, the Cochrane group has done some assessment and have published this:
Key messages
- Hydroxychloroquine does not reduce deaths from COVID-19, and probably does not reduce the number of people needing mechanical ventilation.
- Hydroxychloroquine caused more unwanted effects than a placebo treatment, though it did not appear to increase the number of serious unwanted effects.
- The authors do not think new studies of hydroxychloroquine should be started for treatment of COVID-19.
Is chloroquine or hydroxychloroquine useful in treating people with COVID-19, or in preventing infection in people who have been exposed to the virus?
"Hydroxychloroquine does not reduce deaths from COVID-19, and probably does not reduce the number of people needing mechanical ventilation."
www.cochrane.org
Cochrane have also published an Ivermectin report (sadly, needs updating as it is from May 2021).
Ivermectin for preventing and treating COVID-19
www.cochrane.org
Alan Bennett dedicates Kipling poem A Dead Statesman to Boris Johnson
The playwright’s annual diary excerpt criticises the prime minister and Donald Trump and recalls an encounter with Philip Roth
www.theguardian.com
The playwright’s annual diary excerpt criticises the prime minister and Donald Trump and recalls an encounter with Philip Roth
I could not dig: I dared not rob:
Therefore I lied to please the mob.
Now all my lies are proved untrue
And I must face the men I slew
What tale shall serve me here among
Mine angry and defrauded young?
Alan Bennett dedicates Kipling poem A Dead Statesman to Boris Johnson
The playwright’s annual diary excerpt criticises the prime minister and Donald Trump and recalls an encounter with Philip Roth
www.theguardian.com
Flecc.. I came across a few references today, possibly explaining the anomalies in the London infection and vaccine rates. The kernel of your argument is that the vaccine rates for London were lower than elsewhere based on official government statistics. , Yet infection rates were not worse.
In these references , . the vaccine statistics for London were accurate. However the population statistics are skewed. The discrepancy is that vaccination rates are calculated based on GP registration records, which in London are unusually poor. The amount of churning between GPs , changing flats,and moving in and out being higher in London than elsewhere .,means that there are multiple instances of people being on two or more GP lists . But both names will be included in the population to be vaccinated. There is a difference of 1.6 Million between the ONS data and the GP figures ...and the assumption is both are incorrect , and the most probable population is about half way.
Obviously ,I don't know London,
The reference is UK in a changing EU.. ukandeu.ac.uk
In these references , . the vaccine statistics for London were accurate. However the population statistics are skewed. The discrepancy is that vaccination rates are calculated based on GP registration records, which in London are unusually poor. The amount of churning between GPs , changing flats,and moving in and out being higher in London than elsewhere .,means that there are multiple instances of people being on two or more GP lists . But both names will be included in the population to be vaccinated. There is a difference of 1.6 Million between the ONS data and the GP figures ...and the assumption is both are incorrect , and the most probable population is about half way.
Obviously ,I don't know London,
The reference is UK in a changing EU.. ukandeu.ac.uk
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it was me who replied to you about Ivermectin.
I still maintain that Ivermectin is not good enough to be used as Covid treatment.
About 440 antivirals have been tested in hospitals against covid as possible repurposed drugs (including Ivermectin), only 4 were successful enough and Ivermectin was one one of them. They were duly licensed for emergency use.
COVID-19: People with Omicron less likely to be hospitalised than those with Delta, study in England suggests
The Imperial College research suggests people with Omicron are 15-20% less likely to need hospital treatment compared with Delta - and 40-45% less likely to stay in hospital for one night or more.
Thanks for that link. I'll try and work my way through the report tomorrow if I get a chance. Not sure I'll have time though ... so...
I'm assuming you've already read it though, so can I ask - do they discuss in detail the fact that its now emerged the dosages given to people in many (all?) trials were far higher than normal, and actually in the toxic range! hence the strange finding (as has indeed been noted in your quote above) that patients on the trial taking Hydroxychloroquine ended up worse off than people taking nothing!!
Oh - and one last thing. I'm afraid I don't really know much about background of the Cochrane group. Any idea on how independent are they? Any conflicts of interest etc??
They are often held up as one of the foremost groups that collect papers and produce reviews. Sometimes widely accepted; sometimes not.
Is suppression of the anti-gout medication Probenecid, killing the Illuminati?
Gout drug effective at treating Covid-19
A new study from the University of Georgia (UGA) has found that Probenecid, a medication that is typically given to patients suffering from gout, is
www.imt.ie
Probenecid inhibits SARS-CoV-2 replication in vivo and in vitro - Scientific Reports
Effective vaccines are slowing the COVID-19 pandemic, but SARS-CoV-2 will likely remain an issue in the future making it important to have therapeutics to treat patients. There are few options for treating patients with COVID-19. We show probenecid potently blocks SARS-CoV-2 replication in...
www.nature.com
You can call it whatever you want, but the are now countless journalists, doctors and scientists that are pointing out information is being suppressed. You yourself may be ignorant of that fact, but that doesn't mean it isn't happening.
You seem to be naively assuming that things like "National Regulatory Bodies" operate solely on science, have only the individuals best interest at heart, and in no way are influenced by things like governmental policies, or institutions that directly or indirectly fund them.
Fair play. You are surpassing even your previous attempts at incompetence with a statement like that. Just pause for a moment and consider how stupid it is.
Ok ta, but what about my questions on the toxicity issue and their independence?
It's not like the goulish Sackler family and the Oxycontin outrage across the pond
Sackler family wins immunity from further opioid litigation
A US judge has approved a bankruptcy plan for the maker of OxyContin painkillers.
www.bbc.co.uk
If the people conducting the trials were causing toxicity by choice of dose, it could mean there is insufficient experimental evidence.
Independence? I don't think it matters what I think - you need to be convinced for yourself.
Ok, ta again. I'll see if I can dig into things myself a bit more tomorrow.
Cheers
The National Regulatory Bodies are the Government Departments or the State Boards set up by legislation to oversee activites. They are not trade associations .. And I know ,having served on many over the years.. I know how seriously they take their roles. . In those I have served on, the State funds their activities. Of course they are instruments of Public Policy. ..not political or commercial interests.
