Brexit, for once some facts.

[Jesus H Christ]

I'm sure it does not come as a surprise to anyone reading this forum that daily CV cases are up to nearly 50,000. Hospitalizations and deaths due to the virus are also increasing and yet BJ and Co seem to avoid any blame for this mess.

Someone posted a graph the other day on here comparing the UK with some of the other larger countries in the EU, were are by far the worse on all counts. How on earth does BJ get away with all this?
UK Covid cases near 50,000 in one day as No 10 warns of ‘challenging’ winter | Coronavirus | The Guardian

I’m not sure what else the government can do. The information regarding how to reduce the likelihood of catching Covid is out there. People will either follow the advice or they won’t.

I think the disparity between EU countries and the U.K. is driven by a sense of responsibility. Within the EU the population is probably more compliant and ready to follow official advice. Here, we have a high number of idiots who want to kick back and not put a tissue over their mouth because no one is going make it like North Korea and tell them what to do.

I think people just need to get on with it now and either kill themselves or an elderly relative. Some people are so stupid it isn’t possible to help them and we have a large number amongst us. Let Covid eat them I say.

 

[Zlatan]

And you really should stop being so naive, claiming the motives of these thieves conspirators and liars has other than the purpose of subverting the democratic process is plain stupid.
calling Tories "fascist" is dehumanising and generalising.?

Not at all it is simply describing their Political motivation.
I don't find denying the so obvious truth as you do anything other than silly

OK, OG. Normal service resumed. Tories are fascists.
Ahwell. I tried.

 

[Woosh]

It's all rather depressing, but that could be hypothyroidism.

guerney, that was the part that I found funny, if you felt offended by my smilie, I am sorry.

 

[Woosh]

I’m a bit concerned about all of this heat-pump in homes nonsense and the drive to be carbon zero. I think it’s going to hasten the country’s slide into bankruptcy and ruin whilst at the same time achieving virtually nothing on a global scale. We are continuing to buy from China unabated, thus supplying a healthy market for their industry, which is very dirty.

I think the Fuck_Jar is pulling Johnson’s strings on this subject. He never sounds very enthusiastic about it. More like he’s pretending to be all eco and green. It’s pathetic really.

I agree with most of what you said.
Heat pump would work in sparsely inhabited areas but I can't see heat pumps doing well in cities. Air of different temperature won't mix. Taking large amount of heat from the surrounding air in winter will create a lot of mini domes within a large dome of heavier cold air, trapping pollution and decreasing efficiency.

 

[Woosh]

Tories are fascists.
Ahwell. I tried.

you should drop it. Most of us don't think all tories, not even BJ, are fascists. Only some ministers like Raab and Patel. Do you want to defend their points of view?

 

[oldgroaner]

Calling Johnson a liar is not what I, mm discussing. If he has lied, fine. Call him out. What I, m talking about is the general scattergun insults and generalisations. I, ve mentioned exactly enough times what I, m on about.. Brexidiots. Tory Scum. Fascists. Traitors and liars. All based not on specific complaints but in who you supported, voted for or opinions held.
You know exactly what I, m talking about.
The lot of us need to have a good think. (apart from perhaps Flecc, who in my time in here I, ve probably disagreed with more than anyone. but he has never resorted to insults, hate speech or generalisations. Fair play Flecc. Rest of us... Must try harder.)

I don't understand why what are obviously well educated, quite knowledgeable posters have to be told there is a relationship between the hate speech terms used and the general decline in socially acceptable behaviour.
I don't get how justifying calling politicians scum/fascists is acceptable. Those same people can't then be shocked when idiots go to next level of poor behaviour.

like this idiot for example?

Words carry hidden meanings and there are buried insults in those.
Unless the reader is too dim to notice

 

[oyster]

It's all rather depressing, but that could be hypothyroidism.

Hypothyroidism most certainly can have a massive impact on mental well-being.

Europe PMC

Europe PMC is an archive of life sciences journal literature.

europepmc.org

 

[oldgroaner]

The so called Government are abusing the memory of a colleague by using his name to launch a bill called "Daves Law" suppressing "on line hate" meaning criticism
And when a member of the opposition suffered the same fate, what was the PM's response?

They are exactly as I described them

 

[oldgroaner]

I’m not sure what else the government can do. The information regarding how to reduce the likelihood of catching Covid is out there. People will either follow the advice or they won’t.

I think the disparity between EU countries and the U.K. is driven by a sense of responsibility. Within the EU the population is probably more compliant and ready to follow official advice. Here, we have a high number of idiots who want to kick back and not put a tissue over their mouth because no one is going make it like North Korea and tell them what to do.

I think people just need to get on with it now and either kill themselves or an elderly relative. Some people are so stupid it isn’t possible to help them and we have a large number amongst us. Let Covid eat them I say.

In other words the Government you voted for has no responsibility to mount a defensive strategy to save the lives of the public

So tell me , just what exactly do we need a Government for?
I'll answer that
To organise the most profitable smash and grab in our history and suppress Human Rights to produce a cowed and complaint class of serfs at the bottom of society

 

[oyster]

like this idiot for example?

Words carry hidden meanings and there are buried insults in those.
Unless the reader is too dim to notice

Delivering brexit honouring Jo Cox, and now Southend's encitification honouring Amess' murder, is a deeply unsettling approach to government. (Of course, this also follows several laws around the world being based on specific, usually horrific, cases.)

The obvious lesson we could take is they do nothing until someone suffers appallingly. And all too often, not even then.

 

[Danidl]

I’m a bit concerned about all of this heat-pump in homes nonsense and the drive to be carbon zero. I think it’s going to hasten the country’s slide into bankruptcy and ruin whilst at the same time achieving virtually nothing on a global scale. We are continuing to buy from China unabated, thus supplying a healthy market for their industry, which is very dirty.

I think the Fuck_Jar is pulling Johnson’s strings on this subject. He never sounds very enthusiastic about it. More like he’s pretending to be all eco and green. It’s pathetic really.

May I disagree about the substance. I will not be referring to the personalities...
A lot of housing stock in the UK is very old and even the attempts by the Luftwaffe to encourage rebuilding to modern standards was a failure. Regrettably concrete boxes without insulation was the modern choice. . While the UK was sitting on a mountain of coal, this did not matter , but since getting coal is no longer feasible, options are limited.
By preference the first option must be insulation, and then followed by heatpumps. The objective is that the electrical power will be nuclear or wind ..which is why despite their Brexit credentials the UK is linking into the wider EU Energy nets with the Norway interconnection as well as the French, Irish ,Dutch links.
There are in fact multiple UK and EU manufactured Heat pumps . They may use Korean , Chinese or Japanese parts as well as European castings and design. I have Danfoss kit.

 

[Danidl]

I agree with most of what you said.
Heat pump would work in sparsely inhabited areas but I can't see heat pumps doing well in cities. Air of different temperature won't mix. Taking large amount of heat from the surrounding air in winter will create a lot of mini domes within a large dome of heavier cold air, trapping pollution and decreasing efficiency.

Sorry Woosh.. but not really relevant. Remember that cities are hotter than elsewhere , so if anything the Heat pumps are better placed. The only requirement is that they don't get placed in very low lying areas inside enclosed courtyards. . At the macro scale all the multiple heat pumps in a city will be to mix air All the energy they extract and pump into the houses will escape 12 hours later ..at even a slightly higher temperature to keep the circulation going.

 

[oyster]

May I disagree about the substance. I will not be referring to the personalities...
A lot of housing stock in the UK is very old and even the attempts by the Luftwaffe to encourage rebuilding to modern standards was a failure. Regrettably concrete boxes without insulation was the modern choice. . While the UK was sitting on a mountain of coal, this did not matter , but since getting coal is no longer feasible, options are limited.
By preference the first option must be insulation, and then followed by heatpumps. The objective is that the electrical power will be nuclear or wind ..which is why despite their Brexit credentials the UK is linking into the wider EU Energy nets with the Norway interconnection as well as the French, Irish ,Dutch links.
There are in fact multiple UK and EU manufactured Heat pumps . They may use Korean , Chinese or Japanese parts as well as European castings and design. I have Danfoss kit.

I find it very disappointing that the new development currently being built nearby (about 150 houses) is entirely gas heated.

I might have hoped at least a percentage would be required to use a heatpump (or whatever other approach). If nothing else, to get real world experience of installing such technology into new-build houses. The developer needs to get experience for the future - might as well start asap.

Things like adjustments to the detailed design of the houses. Trades needed to install. Changes to order of building processes. Testing.

Far better to do it to ten houses on this development now than 150 houses on another development next year (or whenever). Because handling problems with ten houses is a much less difficult than handling 150 all at once.

 

[oldgroaner]

May I disagree about the substance. I will not be referring to the personalities...
A lot of housing stock in the UK is very old and even the attempts by the Luftwaffe to encourage rebuilding to modern standards was a failure. Regrettably concrete boxes without insulation was the modern choice. . While the UK was sitting on a mountain of coal, this did not matter , but since getting coal is no longer feasible, options are limited.
By preference the first option must be insulation, and then followed by heatpumps. The objective is that the electrical power will be nuclear or wind ..which is why despite their Brexit credentials the UK is linking into the wider EU Energy nets with the Norway interconnection as well as the French, Irish ,Dutch links.
There are in fact multiple UK and EU manufactured Heat pumps . They may use Korean , Chinese or Japanese parts as well as European castings and design. I have Danfoss kit.

I must take issue with that disparaging remark about the town planning carried out by the Luftwaffe
Over the course of the war, around 95% of houses in Hull were damaged or destroyed,
Here is a handy map of bombed areas

After one of the raids a local comedian remarked in a mock BBC war report at the Tivoli Music Hall.
"Last night the Luftwaffe visited a North Easter port and did £10Million pounds worth of improvements.
"North Eastern Port" was the named used for Hull by the BBC intended to fool the Germans (who soon figured out if they heard it used they had hit the intended target!

 

[Jesus H Christ]

May I disagree about the substance. I will not be referring to the personalities...
A lot of housing stock in the UK is very old and even the attempts by the Luftwaffe to encourage rebuilding to modern standards was a failure. Regrettably concrete boxes without insulation was the modern choice. . While the UK was sitting on a mountain of coal, this did not matter , but since getting coal is no longer feasible, options are limited.
By preference the first option must be insulation, and then followed by heatpumps. The objective is that the electrical power will be nuclear or wind ..which is why despite their Brexit credentials the UK is linking into the wider EU Energy nets with the Norway interconnection as well as the French, Irish ,Dutch links.
There are in fact multiple UK and EU manufactured Heat pumps . They may use Korean , Chinese or Japanese parts as well as European castings and design. I have Danfoss kit.

I don’t doubt a great deal of what you say. The big problem is going to be the cost / supply of electricity to power the heat pumps and the growing number of electric cars. There has been decades of insufficient investment in nuclear power.

Before embarking on this transition to heat pumps (the easy bit), the government needs to sort out the difficult bit, sufficient supply of electricity at a price people can afford. Until that happens, we are going to be burning gas to create heat to generate electricity which we will then turn back into heat. Interesting that China are a large scale manufacturer of the kit. No doubt the factories in China are powered by their growing number of coal fired power stations.

U.K. gas fired domestic boilers contribute 1/10th of 2/5ths of a quarter of fuckall carbon on a global scale. Whilst ever we are still buying from Chinese industry at our current scale, we may as well not bother with domestic heating boilers.

This is a pipe dream of the wealthy.

There was no need for the people of Dresden to put the heating on after the Royal Airforce paid them a visit

 

[Jesus H Christ]

I’ve just seen a chart on the BBC. Of all global carbon emissions, the U.K. contributes 0.9%. Domestic boilers contribute 20% of the UK’s carbon emissions.

All of the upheaval, expense and hardship the conversion to heat pumps will cause, it will only save 0.18% on global carbon emissions.

Meanwhile we keep buying from China who contribute 28% of all global carbon emissions. That’s where the savings can be made. Wean people off cheap s^!t from China.

 

[oyster]

I’ve just seen a chart on the BBC. Of all global carbon emissions, the U.K. contributes 0.9%. Domestic boilers contribute 20% of the UK’s carbon emissions.

All of the upheaval, expense and hardship the conversion to heat pumps will cause, it will only save 0.18% on global carbon emissions.

Meanwhile we keep buying from China who contribute 28% of all global carbon emissions. That’s where the savings can be made. Wean people off cheap s^!t from China.

However, it appears likely that heat pump heating would also reduce various forms of pollution ranging from methane (from pipes), through particulates.

Seems banning bitcoin is helping China - though mining appears to have shifted to the USA rather than stopped.

 

[Woosh]

All of the upheaval, expense and hardship the conversion to heat pumps will cause, it will only save 0.18% on global carbon emissions.

that saving is only possible if all the electricity is produced from renewable.
We currently get only 43% of our electricity from renewable sources, transport and factories should be prioritised over gas boilers for going electric.

 

[Woosh]

Meanwhile we keep buying from China who contribute 28% of all global carbon emissions. That’s where the savings can be made. Wean people off cheap s^!t from China.

Much of their emission is from goods they produce for the whole world.
If we add up all the emissions produced by goods we import*, our total carbon footprint would be at least doubled (2%).
I agree we should buy more durable, higher quality goods.

*estimated to be 449 million tonnes in 2007.

 

[Jesus H Christ]

that saving is only possible if all the electricity is produced from renewable.
We currently get only 43% of our electricity from renewable sources, transport and factories should be prioritised over gas boilers for going electric.

It’s an even more pointless exercise then. JHC where do they recruit these muppets from.