Brexit, for once some facts.

[oyster]

Doesn't a city need a cathedral to qualify? Or am I recalling incorrectly?

Sir David Amess: Southend to become a city in honour of MP

Boris Johnson announces the town will be awarded the coveted status that the MP campaigned for.

www.bbc.co.uk

Incorrect.

List of cities in the United Kingdom - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Just adding:

Nor does having a cathedral make somewhere a city. And you need to consider the meaning of "cathedral" - I suspect it would usually mean a cathedral within the C of E. But that definition wouldn't only rule out Catholic and Traditional Church of England, but also Church in Wales, Church of Scotland and Church of Ireland. So there would be no non-English cities.

 

[guerney]

Or...

Dennis or Denise, she swings both ways. Good girl

 

[oyster]

Couldn't be bothered to reply.

Good Law Project has successfully forced the Government to reveal the names of the 47 companies in the PPE VIP lane.

The Information Commissioner has ordered the Department of Health and Social Care (DHSC) to disclose the names of these 47 companies to us within 35 calendar days.

The Information Commissioner wrote in her decision earlier today:

“The DHSC has not disclosed the requested information, nor advised the Commissioner that it considers it is otherwise exempt by virtue of another exemption. The DHSC has therefore failed to comply with its obligations under FOIA.”

She also warned that “failure to comply may result in the Commissioner making written certification of this fact to the High Court pursuant to section 54 of the Act and may be dealt with as a contempt of court”.

The Immensa scandal – in which the UK Health Security Agency (UKHSA) found at least 43,000 people may have wrongly been given a negative Covid test result – is a powerful further reminder of the harm that can result to public health from opaque contracting arrangements with unsuitable counterparties.

As soon as the company names are shared with us, we will publish them.

 

[Zlatan]

Are you claiming that Johnson is NOT a liar?

I can think of no other reason I should not call him a liar. It really is, or by now was, his choice entirely as to whether I consider him a liar to be called out or not. The odd exaggeration or economy with the truth might have ranked him alongside others.

Calling Johnson a liar is not what I, mm discussing. If he has lied, fine. Call him out. What I, m talking about is the general scattergun insults and generalisations. I, ve mentioned exactly enough times what I, m on about.. Brexidiots. Tory Scum. Fascists. Traitors and liars. All based not on specific complaints but in who you supported, voted for or opinions held.
You know exactly what I, m talking about.
The lot of us need to have a good think. (apart from perhaps Flecc, who in my time in here I, ve probably disagreed with more than anyone. but he has never resorted to insults, hate speech or generalisations. Fair play Flecc. Rest of us... Must try harder.)

I don't understand why what are obviously well educated, quite knowledgeable posters have to be told there is a relationship between the hate speech terms used and the general decline in socially acceptable behaviour.
I don't get how justifying calling politicians scum/fascists is acceptable. Those same people can't then be shocked when idiots go to next level of poor behaviour.

 

[oyster]

Calling Johnson a liar is not what I, mm discussing. If he has lied, fine. Call him out. What I, m talking about is the general scattergun insults and generalisations. I, ve mentioned exactly enough times what I, m on about.. Brexidiots. Tory Scum. Tory Fascists. Traitors and liars. All based not on specific complaints but in who you supported, voted for or opinions held.
You know exactly what I, m talking about.
The lot of us need to have a good think. (apart from perhaps Flecc, who in my time in here I, ve probably disagreed with more than anyone. but he has never resorted to insults, hate speech or generalisations. Fair play Flecc. Rest of us... Must try harder.)

You say that "Calling Johnson a liar is not what I, mm discussing."

Then you say "What I, m talking about is the general scattergun insults and generalisations. I, ve mentioned exactly enough times what I, m on about.. Brexidiots. Tory Scum. Tory Fascists. Traitors and liars."

Are you, or are you not, discussing the issue of calling Johnson a liar?

I am not clear as to your meaning in this specific regard.

 

[oyster]

Well, saves the need for the government to make a decision:

The Valneva Covid vaccine that the UK cancelled a 100m dose order for last month, works well at priming the immune system to fight coronavirus, phase three trial results suggest.
Blood results from volunteers who received the jab had high levels of neutralising antibodies against the pandemic virus.
It outperformed the AstraZeneca vaccine on this measure in head-to-head tests.
Valneva is seeking regulatory approval for its jab, manufactured in Scotland.
It is an inactivated whole virus vaccine, meaning it contains a dead version of coronavirus that cannot cause disease. This is the same way that flu and polio vaccines are made.

 

[flecc]

Nor does having a cathedral make somewhere a city. And you need to consider the meaning of "cathedral" - I suspect it would usually mean a cathedral within the C of E. But that definition wouldn't only rule out Catholic and Traditional Church of England, but also Church in Wales, Church of Scotland and Church of Ireland. So there would be no non-English cities.

They could have Russian Orthodox Cathedrals, we have one in London, the Russian Orthodox Cathedral of the Dormition of the Mother of God and All Saints is the cathedral of the Russian Orthodox Diocese of Sourozh.

And the Scots are OK since they have the Greek Orthodox Cathedral of St. Luke in Glasgow.
.

 

[Zlatan]

You say that "Calling Johnson a liar is not what I, mm discussing."

Then you say "What I, m talking about is the general scattergun insults and generalisations. I, ve mentioned exactly enough times what I, m on about.. Brexidiots. Tory Scum. Tory Fascists. Traitors and liars."

Are you, or are you not, discussing the issue of calling Johnson a liar?

I am not clear as to your meaning in this specific regard.

The word I used was liars.. Plural. As I said calling an individual out as telling a lie... ie) he is a liar... is completely different to saying "they are liars, or fascists, or scum"
One is a generalisation and dehumanising to the group involved. All Tories are neither liars, scum or fascists.
Calling Johnson a liar on here is not the issue, and you know full well it isn't.
Defending Rayner's outburst, calling folk scum,Describing tories as fascists, remainers as traitors or leavers as idiots is almost normal in here. That's the language I, m referring to.

 

[jonathan.agnew]

The word I used was liars.. Plural. As I said calling an individual out as telling a lie... ie) he is a liar... is completely different to saying "they are liars, or fascists, or scum"
One is a generalisation and dehumanising to the group involved. All Tories are neither liars, scum or fascists.
Calling Johnson a liar on here is not the issue, and you know full well it isn't.
Defending Rayner's outburst, calling folk scum,Describing tories as fascists, remainers as traitors or leavers as idiots is almost normal in here. That's the language I, m referring to.

you have been getting on this very high horse for several pages to deflect attention from the fact that there is indeed something very and unusually rotten about this present (johnson) state of Denmark. Why not just acknowledge it instead of trying to censor nonexistent discourse (none of us have really been insulting each other for ages)

 

[Zlatan]

you have been getting on this very high horse for several pages to deflect attention from the fact that there is indeed something very and unusually rotten about this present (johnson) state of Denmark. Why not just acknowledge it instead of trying to censor nonexistent discourse (none of us have really been insulting each other for ages)

Yep agreed. I think you, ll find I, ve been answering replies... Folk dont insult on here as once they did. It started with folk refusing to criticise Rayner and generally defending hate speech.
The issue isn't about the merits or faults of Johnson and present government. It's the general attitude amongst many thinking it's OK to insult . Hence comments about Brexidiots/remoaners/traitors.
Perhaps you should also have a go at the ones defending hate speech rather than a poster pointing out damage it does.
I, ve not seen you saying Rayner shouldn't have had her outburst.

 

[oyster]

They could have Russian Orthodox Cathedrals, we have one in London, the Russian Orthodox Cathedral of the Dormition of the Mother of God and All Saints is the cathedral of the Russian Orthodox Diocese of Sourozh.

And the Scots are OK since they have the Greek Orthodox Cathedral of St. Luke in Glasgow.
.

There's a host of such establishments and denominations. I specifically included one, Traditional Church of England, as an example of an oddity.

 

[Danidl]

They could have Russian Orthodox Cathedrals, we have one in London, the Russian Orthodox Cathedral of the Dormition of the Mother of God and All Saints is the cathedral of the Russian Orthodox Diocese of Sourozh.

And the Scots are OK since they have the Greek Orthodox Cathedral of St. Luke in Glasgow.
.

My tuppence worth is that the Inclusion of a Cathedral under Norman rule allowed a location be termed a City.. This was because Cathedral, irrespective of the population, implied a Bishopric ,and Bishops were Princes . However a large urban area even without a Cathedral could be a city, if it was under the patronage of a senior Royal figure .. Duke, Earl, Baron or even a free city with a Lord Mayor. .. One could have a city or citie without a Cathedral..eg Barcelona ..(see the book Cathedral of the Sea ..great storytelling)

 

[guerney]

My tuppence worth is that the Inclusion of a Cathedral under Norman rule allowed a location be termed a City.. This was because Cathedral, irrespective of the population, implied a Bishopric ,and Bishops were Princes . However a large urban area even without a Cathedral could be a city, if it was under the patronage of a senior Royal figure .. Duke, Earl, Baron or even a free city with a Lord Mayor. .. One could have a city or citie without a Cathedral..eg Barcelona ..(see the book Cathedral of the Sea ..great storytelling)

Yes, that sounds familiar... I was asleep during most of that geography lesson, long long ago.

 

[oyster]

Immensa misleading information (not a lie, no-one lied, just untrue):

The private laboratory that is under investigation for potentially issuing more than 40,000 false negative Covid tests was not fully accredited to perform the work, contrary to assurances made by health officials.

The UK’s independent accreditation service, Ukas, told the Guardian on Monday that neither Immensa Health Clinics Ltd nor its sister company, Dante Labs, had ever been accredited by the service, and that it had informed the Department of Health that statements suggesting otherwise were incorrect.

The UK Health Security Agency announced on Friday that it was suspending operations at Immensa’s laboratory in Wolverhampton pending an investigation into concerns that at least 43,000 people with coronavirus had been wrongly told their swabs tested negative for the virus.

 

[Nev]

I'm sure it does not come as a surprise to anyone reading this forum that daily CV cases are up to nearly 50,000. Hospitalizations and deaths due to the virus are also increasing and yet BJ and Co seem to avoid any blame for this mess.

Someone posted a graph the other day on here comparing the UK with some of the other larger countries in the EU, were are by far the worse on all counts. How on earth does BJ get away with all this?
UK Covid cases near 50,000 in one day as No 10 warns of ‘challenging’ winter | Coronavirus | The Guardian

 

[guerney]

They're only worried about hospitalisations, and that's still lower than it was at the last peak:




I expect their focus groups have told them messages (sensible precautions) about mask wearing and social distancing worries voters, and will only more strongly associate "Covid" with "Tory", and counter their new "Build Back Better!" media narrative. In the meantime, they are using Brexit as an opportunity to inject as much rapid ideological change as possible into our (normally) slow changing laws- under these exceptional circumstances, the form of our nation is suddenly more fluid than it has been for a long time - and with their large majority, gained through lies, clever mass-media manipulation and meathead populism... there's nothing that can stop them. Our democratic system, is designed such that this kind of mob insurgency isn't normally possible. It's all rather depressing, but that could be hypothyroidism.

 

[guerney]

There is some medical support for the theory that running improves knee condition, not damages it. So far no problems for me.

I think there's something to this - I slow jogged again last night, it was just 1 mile uphill and I mostly did it to ease some of the aches associated with the muscle replacement activity which the body undertakes, when you exercise differently than one does usually... and my knees don't hurt anymore. My knees have been killing me ever since I re-started cycling. I won't point out that as one gets older, it takes longer and longer for the body to heal and adjust, but I will say that it'll take a month or two before I develop the physical condition to enable a 3 mile slow jog every other day - it did about 18 months ago. Is this thread my new exercise diary? No. I'll spare you all the onerous task of viewing such unnecessary detail. But it felt wonderful afterwards, my body loves exercise. It's great that there are a couple of (faster) joggers here.

 

[Jesus H Christ]

I think there's something to this - I slow jogged again last night, it was just 1 mile uphill and I mostly did it to ease some of the aches associated with the muscle replacement activity which the body undertakes, when you exercise differently than one does usually... and my knees don't hurt anymore. My knees have been killing me ever since I re-started cycling. I won't point out that as one gets older, it takes longer and longer for the body to heal and adjust, but I will say that it'll take a month or two before I develop the physical condition to enable a 3 mile slow jog every other day - it did about 18 months ago. Is this thread my new exercise diary? No. I'll spare you all the onerous task of viewing such unnecessary detail. But it felt great, my body loves exercise. It's great that there are a couple of (faster) joggers here.

Great that you are feeling the benefits of exercising.

 

[Jesus H Christ]

I’m a bit concerned about all of this heat-pump in homes nonsense and the drive to be carbon zero. I think it’s going to hasten the country’s slide into bankruptcy and ruin whilst at the same time achieving virtually nothing on a global scale. We are continuing to buy from China unabated, thus supplying a healthy market for their industry, which is very dirty.

I think the Fuck_Jar is pulling Johnson’s strings on this subject. He never sounds very enthusiastic about it. More like he’s pretending to be all eco and green. It’s pathetic really.

 

[oldgroaner]

Raab is only carrying out pledges in Tory manifesto. Your opinion that those changes warrant a fascist label is purely that, your subjective opinion.
By all means explain the planned changes you dislike and what they mean. The devil is in the detail. Simple fact is you have no idea what Raab or BJ plans to do with changes, who they will affect and why,so you label the whole group fascist.
Its exactly the attitude than spirals out of control and can lead to violence. Just labelling Tories "fascist" is dehumanising and generalising. It's just as bad as scum and equally provocative.
To be honest I, ve been amazed last few days.
A decent Tory MP was stabbed to death on Friday and people on here on Monday are calling Tories scum, fascists and liars. And defending hateful language from MPs (actually deputy Labour leader) who should know better.
Give it a rest Woosh.
We don't have a fascist government, tories are not scum. Yep, no way perfect and plenty of faults.
Brexiteers are not idiots. Remainers are not traitors. BJ didn't light a cigar with a fiver.
And contrary to OG's claims I am capable of understanding. He can't post without insult can he.
This place is a microcosm of society. Everybody thinks everyone else should change but refuse to change in slightest way themselves.
We really all should leave out generalisations, insults and hate speech. Seems many can't.

And you really should stop being so naive, claiming the motives of these thieves conspirators and liars has other than the purpose of subverting the democratic process is plain stupid.
calling Tories "fascist" is dehumanising and generalising.?

Not at all it is simply describing their Political motivation.
I don't find denying the so obvious truth as you do anything other than silly