Brexit, for once some facts.

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,197
30,602
Your support for McCluskey suggests to me Marxists leanings. Unionism, collective block voting. That is beyond socialism irrespective of past voting.
I don't support McCluskey. I do support his human and political rights when they are threatened.
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Zlatan

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 26, 2016
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As I have already pointed out, the party is scum, not the entire membership.
Don't be ridiculous.
And I suppose you see it as helpful for either party with the label?
In my mind label is more appropriate for folk willing to use it.
 

jonathan.agnew

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 27, 2018
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Here, we go again. Labour shouting to the world how desperate they are. Nobody cares about decorating flats or free holidays. Havent results just shown that?
So, let me get this straight, you do not care about undue influence on elected officials? You do not want to know about what whoever gave boris the 200k (that we know off) got in return ito overcharged government contracts, non existent ferry companies, g4 etc etc? You do not care how your tax is misspent or the resulting lack of services?
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,197
30,602
I, m understanding it perfectly thanks Flecc. In this case you are wrong.
By your definition please describe a Conservative.
A Conservative is someone who believes in the tenets of the Conservative Party.

That's not necessarily (that phrase you don't understand again) anything to do with voting, since a Conservative is still a Conservative even if they don't bother to vote.

Many people vote for the Conservatives without being Conservative, for example when they vote against the alternative or vote only for some aspects of their policy. I know that for a fact since I'm one of the latter.

So don't try to tell me I don't exist.
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oyster

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 7, 2017
10,422
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So, let me get this straight, you do not care about undue influence on elected officials? You do not want to know about what whoever gave boris the 200k (that we know off) got in return ito overcharged government contracts, non existent ferry companies, g4 etc etc? You do not care how your tax is misspent or the resulting lack of services?
From what we have seen elsewhere, one of the next steps after ignoring the relatively straightforward rules/laws concerning such relatively minor issues is to progress onto massaging the voting system. And then claiming any elections they lose as having been stolen.

Oh yes - they are massaging the voting system for mayors...

And requiring photographic ID to vote.

Anyone know how photo ID to vote works for postal voting?
 
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Zlatan

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 26, 2016
8,086
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So, let me get this straight, you do not care about undue influence on elected officials? You do not want to know about what whoever gave boris the 200k (that we know off) got in return ito overcharged government contracts, non existent ferry companies, g4 etc etc? You do not care how your tax is misspent or the resulting lack of services?
No, not really I don't. I suspect its simple mud slinging at a time Labour should be sorting themselves out rather than lashing out. Especially so with a likely GE coming up next year.
Most of country are rather more concerned, interested in effects vaccine has had and is having.
I visited my Consultant recently preassessment for forthcoming heart Op 28th May. He asked had I had Covid, when told yes he became animated asked when, it's effects etc. Have you had vaccine? "Yes, 12th Feb"
His reply
"It probably saved your life".
I couldn't care less if Boris has nicked 200k from treasury, which I don't think he has. I couldn't care less if he, s had a free holiday. He deserves it. So what if donors have paid. The entire system, including the labour side, is corrupt. McCluskey and Liverpool mayor? Labour MPs lying in court to protect their kids. Expense scandal. All of them are as bad.
What we are now witnessing is Labour strategy. Throw some mud, call people scum, insult and make rash claims to hide their own inadequacy. And then lose next GE by a bigger amount, then start same recriminations again. Blame Starmer, Blame Media, blame Corbyn, blame Unite, Blame Blair, Blame Tories even blame electorate for being daft, misled or thick but for God's sake don't change anything.
Just more of same please. Tories must be quaking in their boots when best Labour can come up with is Boris has spent too much on his curtains and had a jolly to Caribbean.
Campbell was right this morning. Time to look to future, stop harking to past and offer something positive. But they won't, they resort to "scum" insults and rubbish like you, ve got worked up about.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,197
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Campbell was right this morning. Time to look to future, stop harking to past and offer something positive.
Alastair Campbell, the man who's advice led to Blair's New Labour no longer existing..

Since his work for Blair, Campbell has continued to act as a freelance advisor to a number of governments and political parties, including the Prime Minister of Albania.

"Prime Minister Edi Rama of the governing Socialists who are seeking their third consecutive mandate, wants to turn Albania into a “champion” in tourism, energy, agriculture and digital projects.

Pre-election survey polls showed Rama’s left-wing Socialist Party likely to place first.

Lulzim Basha of the Democratic Party accuses the government of corruption and links to organized crime, and pledges lower taxes, higher salaries and more social financial support.

Though officially impartial, President Ilir Meta has turned into a firebrand government opponent, accusing Rama of concentrating all legislative, administrative and judicial powers in his hands and running a “kleptocratic regime” that has bungled pandemic response and delayed the country’s EU integration. "


So Campbell says our Left wing Socialist Labour must change, while supporting the Left wing and corrupt Socialists of Albania to stay the same.
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Zlatan

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 26, 2016
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4,290
Alastair Campbell, the man who's advice led to Blair's New Labour no longer existing..

Since his work for Blair, Campbell has continued to act as a freelance advisor to a number of governments and political parties, including the Prime Minister of Albania.

"Prime Minister Edi Rama of the governing Socialists who are seeking their third consecutive mandate, wants to turn Albania into a “champion” in tourism, energy, agriculture and digital projects.

Pre-election survey polls showed Rama’s left-wing Socialist Party likely to place first.

Lulzim Basha of the Democratic Party accuses the government of corruption and links to organized crime, and pledges lower taxes, higher salaries and more social financial support.

Though officially impartial, President Ilir Meta has turned into a firebrand government opponent, accusing Rama of concentrating all legislative, administrative and judicial powers in his hands and running a “kleptocratic regime” that has bungled pandemic response and delayed the country’s EU integration. "


So Campbell says our Left wing Socialist Labour must change, while supporting the Left wing and corrupt Socialists of Albania to stay the same.
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He talked sense this morning, a very rare attribute for anyone with anything to do with Labour at the moment. He didn't mention his views about some third world banana Republic Junta. But I don't suppose he thought it relevant. I can't imagine why.
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
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Here comes one of the so called "Brexit Bonuses"
"Hull Freeport application for separation-processing plant 4,500 tons a year of neodymium and praseodymium (Rare Earth) oxides, low levels of thorium among toxic waste byproducts, now approved under delegated powers without being referred to elected Planning Committee!
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,197
30,602
New Yorkshire Mayor is Tracy Brabin. So that will force a by-election. If Labour lose
the seat is it the end for Keir Starmer?
Could do, things are running very badly for him now. I don't think he ever really understood what he was taking on when he accepted the job, a poisoned chalice if ever there was one.
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
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You are way out, as are Labour. UK is predominantly centrist and probably right leaning. Didn't you catch the last election or recent by elections.
And your comments re gullible electorate only add to problem. Merely serves to reinforce the decisions people have made. People just think "thank goodness that type didn't get in".
Thank you for proving my point!
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,197
30,602
He talked sense this morning, a very rare attribute for anyone with anything to do with Labour at the moment. He didn't mention his views about some third world banana Republic Junta. But I don't suppose he thought it relevant. I can't imagine why.
Actually Len McCluskey was interviewed by Nick Robinson for half an hour on Saturday at 5.30 pm and he made a lot sense too, from Labour's and the trade union's point of view. It's not what I stand for, but it was a fascinating listen.

Sadly the Beeb won't make it available on the i-player at present, but here's the link
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Zlatan

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 26, 2016
8,086
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Actually Len McCluskey was interviewed by Nick Robinson for half an hour on Saturday at 5.30 pm and he made a lot sense too, from Labour's and the trade union's point of view. It's not what I stand for, but it was a fascinating listen.

Sadly the Beeb won't make it available on the i-player at present, but here's the link
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I, ve heard him a few times and fully agree he often speaks sense. (not sure he is doing at moment with regards way forward for Labour, he agrees with you with regards moving away from Starmer and to the left)
My issue is with the system where McCluskey holds so much sway over Party, and despite what both you and your link suggest, he can be extremely influential towards choosing Party leader with his control of purse strings towards elements he prefers.
It is fairly well accepted without his support Ed Milliband or Corbyn would not have made Party leader. He is tantamount to the king makers of old. Its wrong.
 

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