Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldgroaner]

Oh how the mighty fall. You end up on here...talking the same tosh.

Was it the model T you discussed with Ford or perhaps the Edsel.?

Besides earlier you said you worked removing stuff from fans in a boiler factory, probably the stuff you put there I,d guess. Make your mind up OG. What were you ?

Even you could work out that "Fan Cleaner" is a Euphemism for a person who solves problems , go on look up euphemism...problems too..
Ford's interest was the obvious one of wanting an insight into the sort of vehicles that people in the year 2000 would be likely to be interested in.
I realise that an interest in the Future could be pretty heavy for a Brexit voter to grapple with, but there are people out there with that capability , and there were some back then too!

 

[oldgroaner]

Garbage as usual.

Self Praise is no flattery, though your comment does fit the description exactly. You are one of the most consistent where Garbage is required.

 

[Woosh]

there-is-no-moderate-centre-ground-when.html

when oldtom is around.
of course there has always been.
otherwise the world would be continually at war if left to oldtom and the fascists alone.

 

[Woosh]

I realise that an interest in the Future could be pretty heavy for a Brexit voter to grapple with, but there are people out there with that capability , and there were some back then too!

I was quite content watching star trek.

 

[oldgroaner]

when oldtom is around.
of course there has always been.
otherwise the world would be continually at war if left to oldtom and the fascists alone.

Pss't it actually is at war all the time somewhere, right now, but we're not supposed to notice, especially if we are waging it on the sly so to speak for the money as it were. or oil or mineral wealth...
Shhhh!

 

[oldgroaner]

I was quite content watching star trek.

Noted!

 

[oldgroaner]

We vote for Political Parties having listened to what they say and hopefully judging them by their earlier actions. Somewhat naively, I feel, in the hope that they mean what they say.

Good grief if you do that how do you explain Cameron after being publicly proved a liar still got elected?

 

[PeterL]

American Standard as if that helps
And quite frankly a very great deal of what you see around you was first mooted there, including for instance an energy independent home using heat pump technology, solar and wind power applications, recycled heat from the houses own septic tank, which would process and purify the waste and output compressed waste pellets that could be collected and used either as fuel or fertiliser.
All services such was washing Machines and refrigerators built in to into a duct to be maintained from outside the building, food and other supplies to be ordered remotely.

We were fortunate to have access (this would be 1979) to two of the French Minitel system terminals to play with and thought it had great potential (every home should have one)
And the use of holograms to provide virtual windows in internal rooms. where there had been developments of multi storey blocks where external faces were at a premium
We also foresaw the large lCD screens and their applications long before they existed.
A4 sized panels that could be used as books....wonder what became of that?
Great fun back then, imagining you could have the full wall of your living room looking out to a real time full colour moving hologram of a tropical beach with sound and smells to match.
Remember how small TV's were back then?

There were Projects too, one I took part in was for a Charity called Earth Stewards who were interested in developing packaging for Disaster aid that was modular and could, once emptied be assembled into emergency shelters, it was made from a waterproof grade of papier mache, and included conductive tapes that could be connected to low voltage emergency lighting.

Still waiting for the Living room wall Tropical Beach hologram so I can watch the waves break on the beach and feel the Breeze as it ruffles the leaves in the Palm trees.

So many ideas, so much enthusiasm at the time, and when it was all over, we never heard another word.
But over the years many of the things we spoke of appeared.

Co incidence? that some ideas came to fruition? quite possibly, but you have to ask why major companies went to such a considerable expense for no return.
Perhaps they wanted to explore where the imaginations of their Boffins would take them if they were let loose?
See just how mad they really are?
And I have to say all of us that took part loved every minute!

Many thanks for sharing and much appreciated - I might begin to look on you through new eyes albeit I reserve the right to react to current events and indeed comments. I was in the military at the time, seconded to industry saw many of the ideas including the ability to walk around a chess board in 3D projected on to a table - couldn't do much with it of course.

 

[Woosh]

Good grief if you do that how do you explain Cameron after being publicly proved a liar still got elected?

women liked his cuddly pudgy face?

 

[PeterL]

Good grief if you do that how do you explain Cameron after being publicly proved a liar still got elected?

We like them to be human and more like us. In some cases, not all of course and that generally applies to the so-called Left.

 

[oldgroaner]

Many thanks for sharing and much appreciated - I might begin to look on you through new eyes albeit I reserve the right to react to current events and indeed comments. I was in the military at the time, seconded to industry saw many of the ideas including the ability to walk around a chess board in 3D projected on to a table - couldn't do much with it of course.

I assure you that I really am as mad as I appear (Zlatan will be happy to give me a Character reference on that)
Feel free to treat me with the Contempt he assures me I deserve,
And it sounds as if you have had the misfortune to cross paths with mad boffins in the past.
Just a word to the wise... tread warily with Zlatan he has an extraordinary talent (which I admire "Bigly" as the Donald might say)
of not remembering which side he isn't on
I find that oddly refreshing

 

[oldgroaner]

women liked his cuddly pudgy face?

That's enormously reassuring, could there be hope for me yet, then?

 

[oldgroaner]

We like them to be human and more like us. In some cases, not all of course and that generally applies to the so-called Left.

I'm not really "left" you know, more in the nature of not having been "Brought" in the first place.

 

[Zlatan]

That's enormously reassuring, could there be hope for me yet, then?

Agreed , I can modify my opinions and even perform the occasional u turn.. Pity some politicians and Captain EJ Smith couldn't do same..

Believe it or not OG I do respect many of your opinions , you are just plain wrong on a few. Cant fault your attitude and tenacity. Think you should be rather more choosy with those you support, you are quite selective on who to be critical with...but then again nobody is perfect..

 

[oldgroaner]

Agreed , I can modify my opinions and even perform the occasional u turn.. Pity some politicians and Captain EJ Smith couldn't do same..

U turn? U TURN? Zlatan my friend, you don't do U turns...
You do a Victory Roll, wing over and low level upside down high speed pass.
Quite Exhilirating!

Don't be so Modest.

 

[Zlatan]

U turn? U TURN? Zlatan my friend, you don't do U turns...
You do a Victory Roll, wing over and low level upside down high speed pass.
Quite Exhilirating!

Don't be so Modest.

You,ve been speaking to my wife...!!!
Nice one...

 

[oldgroaner]

Agreed , I can modify my opinions and even perform the occasional u turn.. Pity some politicians and Captain EJ Smith couldn't do same..

Believe it or not OG I do respect many of your opinions , you are just plain wrong on a few. Cant fault your attitude and tenacity. Think you should be rather more choosy with those you support, you are quite selective on who to be critical with...but then again nobody is perfect..

Lets try to get this into perspective,a person like myself doesn't view things in a conventional way and therefore is more shall we say "Elastic" before judging character. Tom is very forthright in his condemnation of all things he regards as Fascist, a term which in itself has changed from it's original intent, which was that a bundle of sticks fastened together (Fasces) is clearly stronger than a single stick.
Definition of fascism

1. 1often capitalized : a political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

Quite clearly one can perceive some parallels with the present situation, and Government attitude and perceived intent, where we have propaganda exalting the virtues of being "British" and a Government condemned by the United Nations no less for it's excesses on the surveillance levels which equate to a Police State, and campaigns to vilify groups of the populace, and suppress them, and the ECHR unhappy with treatment of the Disabled.
Tom Quite simply may be extreme, but there is a BIG element of TRUTH on his side.

As to my opposition to Conservative principles they are based on the fact that in the long term, they just don't work, but that doesn't imply that I naturally support the labour Party either, because quite simply there isn't really sufficient difference between them on the one important point that matters.

Neither party works towards a better future with a clear vision, they simply do a "Dog Paddle" to stay in place and take longer to drown hopefully than they are doing.

Our future will not come to us from the Palace of Westminster, it simply lacks the will, means and talent to do the job.
The Question of the Future of the Nation is beyond the talents of the inmates of that particular asylum.
When all is said and done, what are the proponents of Brexit offering?
Suffer now and perhaps in 10 years or so we will get back to or hopefully surpass where we are now
Financially.

1. This poses questions such as Why Bother, who is going to be the winner, who the loser?
2. How can this possibly compare with being an important part of a United States of Europe?
3. Why are we willingly relegating ourselves from being a big Fish in a Big pond to being a Tiddler in a Goldfish Bowl?

Humans historically have always formed themselves into larger federations, the UK is a classic example as is Germany.
Why are we going against the Natural Flow of Progress?

 

[oldtom]

when oldtom is around.
of course there has always been.
otherwise the world would be continually at war if left to oldtom and the fascists alone.

Well, of course, you are entitled to voice your opinion, even if it's usually wrong as in your premise contained in the post I placed in quotes.

Being an apologist for a fascist regime attempting to bully its way through 'negotiations' in Brussels, doesn't make you some kind of centrist member of the British electorate; it simply means you are anti-socialist and your frequent rants condemning the qualities and abilities of Jeremy Corbyn serve only to reinforce that view.

I could accept your earlier praise for Tony B-liar, describing him as the best Labour PM in living memory if you were only 20 years old but you are wrong in terms of my living memory. To use him as an example of Labour politics in action is totally wrong - he was hugely backed by Rupert Murdoch and the other tory press and media Barons for the simple reason that he offered tory policies only slightly modified which allowed Murdoch and Co to demonstrate to the 1922 committee and the tory Party grandees just how powerful the billionaire-owned fourth estate really is. The billionaire class don't support socialism!

Through all your posts in this thread, you have demonstrated no interest in people or their problems, particularly the poor and those disenfranchised by this government. You seem to have a hatred for all things EU and your only concern as I see it is that you judge everything on money; wealth creation, allied to an unambiguous support of the inverted 'trickle-down' effect which causes you to back the politicians who do most to remove money, rights and privileges from the many and transfer it to the few.

Your mother country's people made a valiant though not wholly successful attempt to escape from the oppressive regime enforced upon them by the nobility. I'm sure you don't need me to tell you the story. Sadly, the elimination of the elite was never quite completed and there remains even today, remnants of that privileged elite. It may be in the future that the job will need to finished. The UK will have to face up to this class domination also before much longer but when the common folk finally realise that there is one rule for the elite and another very harsh law for the commoners, the British elite will get its comeuppance.

I'm sure you are somehow in denial that fascism exists in this 21st century, judging from your clear affection for the very individuals responsible for furthering their evil cause. Perhaps you would benefit from embarking upon some charitable activities concerning the homeless or the disabled? A few shifts at a food bank or in a soup kitchen might just make you realise how pathetic the lives of some human beings really are in this, one of the wealthiest countries on the planet, apparently.

Tom

 

[oldgroaner]

Many thanks for sharing and much appreciated - I might begin to look on you through new eyes albeit I reserve the right to react to current events and indeed comments. I was in the military at the time, seconded to industry saw many of the ideas including the ability to walk around a chess board in 3D projected on to a table - couldn't do much with it of course.

Those were heady days, Peter, imagine how surprised the people back then would be if we had a way to reveal what has happened since to them?

There were some ideas like mobile phones that never occurred to us,the nearest I got was to imagine a radio connected pocket gadget in contact with ones your family members carried that could show with coloured lights if they were well or in need of help, and you needed to go to them.

At the time I thought that a very bright idea, but it sure looks silly compared to a Mobile Phone, doesn't it?

 

[Woosh]

'there-is-no-moderate-centre-ground-when. oldtom is around'.
that's a simple observation. you see too much into that, oldtom.
You see fascists everywhere. For someone precise in the use of the language like yourself, your last post comes through with an implied insult for the stupid electorate that voted for a 'fascist regime'. How about the possibility that the way they see things is more accurate than yours?
As for your opinion of me, I don't work at foodbanks but I do useful work, fixing broken bikes. It may be not as noble in your eyes as a few shifts in a foodbank but to me, it's just as courageous if not more so. It's the putting your back in to the job, the hours, the days, the weeks, the years, the paying your taxes that count. Not big words like socialism. Sorry my friend, I will not agree with you on this. To me, paying your taxes is the foremost proof that you care for your compatriots.