Brexit, for once some facts.

jonathan.agnew

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 27, 2018
2,400
3,381
I have seen Labour under Michael Foot, Neil Kinnock, John Smith, then Tony Blair breaking the cycle, Gordon Brown, Ed Miliband, Jeremy Corbyn and now Keir Starmer. Each time, I said to myself, that this Labour team is still too far left, it cannot win without occupying the centre. Even now with Kier Starmer. Rachel Reeve has no better strategy than Sunak and Hunt. It's not that I agree with zlatan that there is no alternative to the conservatives, I simply think that the conservatives will lose the next election.
The centre ground became the only viable option because successive conservative governments have bankrupted the state through corruption, mis-spending, brexit. Where zlatan is correct is that that has always been the crux of tory policy, alternating episodes of plunder, corruption with getting the workers in the economy to bear the brunt of the damage, to try to repair the hole left by what they've stuffed offshore. It was the primary motive behind brexit. Were essentially being asset stripped, destroyed as a country by a fundamentally corrupt conservative movement with too limited a mentality to care about thefact that it's doing this. I cannot see that changing, or that what labour is or isnt will stop it. It will probably only stop once the pound has devalued enough to make our GDP comparatively worthless, to make us not worth asset stripping
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,265
30,652
The job of the government is to govern for all people, that means to occupy the centre of politics.
I have seen Labour under Michael Foot, Neil Kinnock, John Smith, then Tony Blair breaking the cycle, Gordon Brown, Ed Miliband, Jeremy Corbyn and now Keir Starmer. Each time, I said to myself, that this Labour team is still too far left, it cannot win without occupying the centre. Even now with Kier Starmer. Rachel Reeve has no better strategy than Sunak and Hunt. It's not that I agree with zlatan that there is no alternative to the conservatives, I simply think that the conservatives will lose the next election by sleaze.
Socialism is the centre of politics, governing for almost all the people by consent.

Communism is the left and the far right of Conservatism is the right, both ultimately relying on police style militaristic compulsion to enforce their policies.

Whether the Tories lose the next election and how is immaterial, the real issue is the despairing people's lack of a choice they can believe in. All they really know is that the mess we are in will remain a mess, whoever and whatever they vote.
.
 

guerney

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 7, 2021
11,531
3,277
Photograph me next to munchkins only

 

guerney

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 7, 2021
11,531
3,277

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,453
16,917
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
Socialism is the centre of politics, governing for almost all the people by consent.
that almost applies to the LibDems.
Occupying the centre does not mean you have to be at the centre. You can be left or right leaning, as long as the distribution of your policies keep most people happy.
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,265
30,652
that almost applies to the LibDems.
Occupying the centre does not mean you have to be at the centre. You can be left or right leaning, as long as the distribution of your policies keep most people happy.
Failure on all counts.

The Lib Dems certainly aren't by popular consent.

No distribution of policies since 1950 has kept our majority happy. It's why we are consistently near the bottom of the happiness league table with socialist Sweden always around the top.

In truth to be fairly assessed, we need a Dissatisfaction table. We'd do well in that.
.
 
  • :D
Reactions: tillson

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,453
16,917
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
The main reason for dissatisfaction is the first pass the post voting system that reduces the choice of policy to just the two largest parties. When the second party does not look like government in waiting, the first party becomes complacent and corrupt.
The main issues for the centre are public services, the economy, borrowing, tax and spend. The problem with Labour is they are usually obsessed with whose party it is, so much so that the shadow cabinet forget what they are paid to work on. When the polls go against them, they simply dismiss the polls.
 
Last edited:

Zlatan

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 26, 2016
8,086
4,290
The main reason for dissatisfaction is the first pass the post voting system that reduces the choice of policy to just the two largest parties. When the second party does not look like government in waiting, the first party becomes complacent and corrupt.
The main issues for the centre are public services, the economy, borrowing, tax and spend. The problem with Labour is they are usually obsessed with whose party it is, so much so that the shadow cabinet forget what they are paid to work on. When the polls go against them, they simply dismiss the polls.
Good Post Woosh.
 

wheeler

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 4, 2016
893
1,776
Scotland
@jonathan.agnew - another reason why walking and running, are better excercise than cycling

‘Cycling on the road causes a decline in bone density’ - study
The lack of impact placed on the bones during ordinary cycling reduces bone density, especially in the hip area.

Easily remedied, don't cycle on the road and do what many cyclists do, use the pavement.

Denser bones aren't of much use if you've smashed your joints by running.
 
  • :D
Reactions: flecc and Woosh

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,265
30,652
@jonathan.agnew - another reason why walking and running, are better excercise than cycling

‘Cycling on the road causes a decline in bone density’ - study
The lack of impact placed on the bones during ordinary cycling reduces bone density, especially in the hip area.

There's a huge flaw in this study:

70% of the Dutch cycle, 48% of them daily, the highest rates in the world.

They are famously among the tallest of all European people.

The longevity of Dutch males is two years higher than the EU average, the longevity of their females as long as the EU average.

So much for loss of bone density, more bunkum.
.
 

jonathan.agnew

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 27, 2018
2,400
3,381
The main reason for dissatisfaction is the first pass the post voting system that reduces the choice of policy to just the two largest parties. When the second party does not look like government in waiting, the first party becomes complacent and corrupt.
The main issues for the centre are public services, the economy, borrowing, tax and spend. The problem with Labour is they are usually obsessed with whose party it is, so much so that the shadow cabinet forget what they are paid to work on. When the polls go against them, they simply dismiss the polls.
Same for tories. Heard a moment ago that hunt plans to lift restriction on bankers bonuses. Its a curious thing to do. Euphemistically, giving short sellers free reign while our currency, economy collapse and workers struggle to survive. Its odd, it will cost them politically. Even the xenophobic twats that read the Daily Mail don't like it. What possible motive could he have for this own goal?
 

guerney

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 7, 2021
11,531
3,277
Denser bones aren't of much use if you've smashed your joints by running.
True. That's why I slow run - lower impact, and walk fast. This chap is slow running too fast, likely embarassed, or under pressure to show off for the cameras:

 

guerney

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 7, 2021
11,531
3,277
Denser bones aren't of much use if you've smashed your joints by running.
There's little bone damage if one slow jogs no faster than treacle - something I'm working down to.
 

Zlatan

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 26, 2016
8,086
4,290
There's little bone damage if one slow jogs no faster than treacle - something I'm working down to.
Bones need impact to offset osteoporosis. That's the dilemna we face growing older. Those impacts toughen and keep bone density up but damage joints with diminishing cartilage. There must be a happy medium somewhere? EMTB?
I had quite extensive arthrtitus in knee, 10 years down line from cruciate ligament replacement. Had stem cell on knee around 7years ago. Surgeon's advice. Regular cycling, low but regular impact. Knee is great if I stick to cycling regime. (emtb). No way I, m jogging on it. But each to his own. Whatever works for you... Keep doing it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: guerney

guerney

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 7, 2021
11,531
3,277
Bones need impact to offset osteoporosis. That's the dilemna we face growing older. Those impacts toughen and keep bone density up but damage joints with diminishing cartilage. There must be a happy medium somewhere? EMTB?
I had quite extensive arthrtitus in knee, 10 years down line from cruciate ligament replacement. Had stem cell on knee around 7years ago. Surgeon's advice. Regular cycling, low but regular impact. Knee is great if I stick to cycling regime. (emtb). No way I, m jogging on it. But each to his own. Whatever works for you... Keep doing it.
EMTB is far too extreme for me to contemplate these days - I'd need to get a bike much more suited to it, and my days of throwing myself down the sides of hills are well over. My knees aren't completely knackered quite yet, and weirdly - slow jogging seems to make them less painful, after cycling has increased their pain. Treacle is far too slow flowing to match - slow jogging is always going to cause more impact on joints than walking. You use more muscles due to having to balance while slow jogging, than one would use walking - there's more muscle actuation and despite jogging slower than I walk fast, I end up sweating much more. After a summer of mostly cycling, my right hip in particular feels stiff and I'm getting twinges... also my big toes are getting painful again...which means I'd be well advised to walk and slow jog far more and soon. My hip twinges disappear with walking and slow jogging, pain in big toes reduces.

Switching the final 30 seconds of a shower to ice cold has been shown to reduce sick days by 30% - supposedly suppresses body-wide inflammation, accelerates healing - might work a bit for arthritis?
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Zlatan

guerney

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 7, 2021
11,531
3,277
Had stem cell on knee
Organ harvesting from our brainless clones as a service, is well worth looking forward to IMHO. If anyone, it'll be offered by Bezos and procedures carried out in amazon warehouses.
 
  • :D
Reactions: Zlatan

Zlatan

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 26, 2016
8,086
4,290
EMTB is far too extreme for me to contemplate these days - I'd need to get a bike much more suited to it, and my days of throwing myself down the sides of hills are well over. My knees aren't completely knackered quite yet, and weirdly - slow jogging seems to make them less painful, after cycling has increased their pain. Treacle is far too slow flowing to match - slow jogging is always going to cause more impact on joints than walking. You use more muscles due to having to balance while slow jogging, than one would use walking - there's more muscle actuation and despite jogging slower than I walk fast, I end up sweating much more. After a summer of mostly cycling, my right hip in particular feels stiff and I'm getting twinges... also my big toes are getting painful again...which means I'd be well advised to walk and slow jog far more and soon. My hip twinges disappear with walking and slow jogging, pain in big toes reduces.

Switching the final 30 seconds of a shower to ice cold has been shown to reduce sick days by 30% - supposedly suppresses body-wide inflammation, accelerates healing - might work a bit for arthritis?
My emtb ing is anything but extreme. Gravel paths, wood land tracks and nice wide (dual use) national forest tracks.
I have found emtb gives a much wider workout than mtb. With legs getting the electric help rides are longer /faster with arms, shoulders etc getting more exercise.
I also enjoy it which in itself is beneficial. Always found jogging (when I could) a chore.
Just had my second heart ablation so resting up for 10 days or so, but will be hitting Lady Bower ASAP.Hopefully with a bit more energy.
I, ve actually hot a regular pulse now, first time in 8 years.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: guerney

Advertisers