Brexit, for once some facts.

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
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I wonder how long he's going to last in his new head of comms post.
Well Dame Cressida Dick followed Boris's example, saying "I have no intention of resigning. I intend to stay and correct the problems in the force".

Hours later after meeting Mayor Sadiq Khan face to face she resigned!

So that's the current trend for Guto Hari to follow, since it appears only Boris is a stayer - - - - - - - - - - so far!
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flecc

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Oct 25, 2006
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Triumph are making steady progress with their electric motorcycle, I think it looks quite nice. I suspect however that if they do eventually bring it to market it would cost more than double what I paid for my Street Triple.
Triumph's TE-1 Electric Motorcycle Prototype: 8 Things You NEED To Know! - YouTube
Yes, certain to be at least double the price, but at present sales of new petrol motorcycles will be permitted until 2035, so many years before being forced onto these.

Of course all electric two wheelers still have a big range problem due to battery size and weight limitations, compared to e-cars which have largely overcome this problem on today's models. Ultra-rapid charging is the obvious answer so Triumph are wise to plan for that option, especially now that ultra-rapid chargers from 100 to 175 kW rates are being widely installed in ever larger numbers now. There's even 350 kW rates on the way.
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Mrs Honeyman

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Dec 29, 2021
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Yes, certain to be at least double the price, but at present sales of new petrol motorcycles will be permitted until 2035, so many years before being forced onto these.

Of course all electric two wheelers still have a big range problem due to battery size and weight limitations, compared to e-cars which have largely overcome this problem on today's models. Ultra-rapid charging is the obvious answer so Triumph are wise to plan for that option, especially now that ultra-rapid chargers from 100 to 175 kW rates are being widely installed in ever larger numbers now. There's even 350 kW rates on the way.
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350 kWh! That would charge a new Leafe in about 10 minutes? A good network of charging facilities like that would make e-cars appeal to a wider market.

I just know the likes of BP will be charging about £1 / kWh though. These outfits can’t help themselves. Ten thousand million pounds unexpected profit off the back of a pandemic that’s killed so many people simply isn’t enough money for them.
 
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oyster

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Nov 7, 2017
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350 kWh! That would charge a new Leafe in about 10 minutes? A good network of charging facilities like that would make e-cars appeal to a wider market.

I just know the likes of BP will be charging about £1 / kWh though. These outfits can’t help themselves. Ten thousand million pounds unexpected profit off the back of a pandemic that’s killed so many people simply isn’t enough money for them.
Don't worry. Ofgem will come along in ten or twenty years and admit that if they had regulated better, there wouldn't have been wholesale and massive fleecing of EV drivers.

Where I am, the range of prices at main pumps is pretty small. But if I go about ten miles, they are usually around 5p a litre less expensive. I keep totting up whether it is worth going that far to save what sounds a lot, but even on a full tank isn't that huge a discount. Most of the time, I end up waiting until I need to go there anyway.

But with EVs the opportunity for FUD being used to encourage those not familiar with an area to pay anything rather than risk going flat is even greater.
 

oyster

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Nov 7, 2017
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If you predicted that UK exports to the EU would go up after brexit, you were wrong.
If you predicted that UK exports to the EU would be more or less stable after brexit, you were wrong.
If you predicted that UK exports to the EU would fall considerably after brexit, you were right.

UK exports to EU fell by £20bn last year, new ONS data shows
Figures show Brexit compounding Covid disruption, with clothing exports plunging 60%, vegetables down 40% and cars 25%
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,152
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350 kWh! That would charge a new Leafe in about 10 minutes? A good network of charging facilities like that would make e-cars appeal to a wider market.

I just know the likes of BP will be charging about £1 / kWh though. These outfits can’t help themselves. Ten thousand million pounds unexpected profit off the back of a pandemic that’s killed so many people simply isn’t enough money for them.
Not so, the competition is too great for that, particularly since they came far too late to the party. This must be the most widely misunderstood subject of our times.

The toughest competition is from home fast charging since most e-car buyers for a very long time will mainly be those who can have a home charger, about 60% of all car owners. That will be at least 8 years of e-car production from 2030 after allowing for the e-car sales between now and 2030.

Since the average range of all UK e-cars sold from now is circa 200 miles and the average annual mileage of UK motorists is 7300, 20 miles per day, most owners like me will only have to charge once a week at most and only be paying minimal electricity rates at off peak times.

My Leaf has just had its second MOT, and in that 4 years of ownership I've only used a public charger twice. They were both Instavolt rapid chargers and I was agreeably surprised to only be charged 22 p per kW at a time when I was paying 15p at home for daytime electricity. Given that Instavolt had the high cost of these charging units and their installation and they have to pay rental on two parking bays to Starbucks, there's little profit if any. It's more an investment for the long term.

For many years the charging companies are going to have to rely on the small minority of longer distance drivers to make money and it's only on the busier routes that there will be the traffic to make money.

Trouble is that they are already smothered with charger conpetition.. For example, on the 130 miles from my South London to my brother's last home in Dorset, there's now 22 rapid chargers either on or almost on the roads and many more if I count those only a few minutes off route. But I only need the one at the other end since I do the trip on my home charge with 20% to spare.

Just look at this Zap Map and you'll see all the discs with any purple on them, indicating a rapid charge point. All the busier routes have lots of then from many different charger companies and the areas where there aren't many of those charger are where there's little traffic so little profit to be made.

Here's a prediction I guarantee will come true. At least half of all the numerous charger companies will go bankrupt since they've all made the same mistake of not understanding the subject well enough before jumping onto the bandwagon.

Meanwhile here's a pic of Shell's new all electric charging hub in Fulham, London, open now. This was a fuel station but its had all the pumps ripped out and become a solely electric car hub. It features nine high-powered, ultra-rapid 175kW charge points, which can charge most EVs from 0-80% in around 10 minutes and has solar panel roofing featuring environmentally friendly timber use in place of steel. It has a Little Waitrose and a Costa Coffee to occupy drivers for the ten minutes. There's many more like it elsewhere in the country already:

 
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wheeler

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 4, 2016
893
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Scotland
If you predicted that UK exports to the EU would go up after brexit, you were wrong.
If you predicted that UK exports to the EU would be more or less stable after brexit, you were wrong.
If you predicted that UK exports to the EU would fall considerably after brexit, you were right.

UK exports to EU fell by £20bn last year, new ONS data shows
Figures show Brexit compounding Covid disruption, with clothing exports plunging 60%, vegetables down 40% and cars 25%
We need wider roads around Dover and to do away withthe EU's red tape and bureaucracy.
 
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Mrs Honeyman

Pedelecer
Dec 29, 2021
101
255
Not so, the competition is too great for that, particularly since they came far too late to the party. This must be the most widely misunderstood subject of our times.

The toughest competition is from home fast charging since most e-car buyers for a very long time will mainly be those who can have a home charger, about 60% of all car owners. That will be at least 8 years of e-car production from 2030 after allowing for the e-car sales between now and 2030.

Since the average range of all UK e-cars sold from now is circa 200 miles and the average annual mileage of UK motorists is 7300, 20 miles per day, most owners like me will only have to charge once a week at most and only be paying minimal electricity rates at off peak times.

My Leaf has just had its second MOT, and in that 4 years of ownership I've only used a public charger twice. They were both Instavolt rapid chargers and I was agreeably surprised to only be charged 22 p per kW at a time when I was paying 15p at home for daytime electricity. Given that Instavolt had the high cost of these charging units and their installation and they have to pay rental on two parking bays to Starbucks, there's little profit if any. It's more an investment for the long term.

For many years the charging companies are going to have to rely on the small minority of longer distance drivers to make money and it's only on the busier routes that there will be the traffic to make money.

Trouble is that they are already smothered with charger conpetition.. For example, on the 130 miles from my South London to my brother's last home in Dorset, there's now 22 rapid chargers either on or almost on the roads and many more if I count those only a few minutes off route. But I only need the one at the other end since I do the trip on my home charge with 20% to spare.

Just look at this Zap Map and you'll see all the discs with any purple on them, indicating a rapid charge point. All the busier routes have lots of then from many different charger companies and the areas where there aren't many of those charger are where there's little traffic so little profit to be made.

Here's a prediction I guarantee will come true. At least half of all the numerous charger companies will go bankrupt since they've all made the same mistake of not understanding the subject well enough before jumping onto the bandwagon.

Meanwhile here's a pic of Shell's new all electric charging hub in Fulham, London, open now. This was a fuel station but its had all the pumps ripped out and become a solely electric car hub. It features nine high-powered, ultra-rapid 175kW charge points, which can charge most EVs from 0-80% in around 10 minutes and has solar panel roofing featuring environmentally friendly timber use in place of steel. It has a Little Waitrose and a Costa Coffee to occupy drivers for the ten minutes. There's many more like it elsewhere in the country already:

Thanks for that. I didn’t realise there were so many charging points.

When I get my first electric car, most of my charging will be at home. I’ve got a garage in the garden with a large surface area south facing roof. The garage has a meter / supply separate to the house. I’m thinking it will be worth investing in solar panels to charge the car (s) when I make the switch.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,152
30,567
I’m thinking it will be worth investing in solar panels to charge the car (s) when I make the switch.
If you will be charging overnight at home using the car's built in charge timers to get the lowest price period, it may not be worth buying solar panels.

People don't realise just how much surplus electricity we have at night. Some of it is sold at negative pricing to larger users to get rid of it. Yes really, the energy companies pay some users per unit to take it from them then, to be able to keep to their amounts they've promised to buy from generators.
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,152
30,567
Figures show Brexit compounding Covid disruption, with clothing exports plunging 60%, vegetables down 40% and cars 25%
In fairness the cars are down due to lack of production, in turn from the severe chip shortgages. Car production is at record lows now. Waiting lists are long and second hand car prices have risen by as much as 30% due to the severe shortage of new cars.
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Danidl

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 29, 2016
8,611
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Thanks for that. I didn’t realise there were so many charging points.

When I get my first electric car, most of my charging will be at home. I’ve got a garage in the garden with a large surface area south facing roof. The garage has a meter / supply separate to the house. I’m thinking it will be worth investing in solar panels to charge the car (s) when I make the switch.
If the roof is not very high, and you are still agile, it is very much a DIY exercise panels are now abut 150 quid +Vat for 350 Peak watts , an invertor controller about 1K , but the Batteries are expensive still. . Now you wont need batteries if the car can charge during the day, but for some obscure reason , there is precious little PV generated overnight.
 

oyster

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 7, 2017
10,422
14,609
West West Wales
I've already said that going into a potential conflict is far from ideal as a time to change PM. But it is massively better than leaving Johnson in the job.

Pack up your roubles in your old kit bag
And smile, smile, smile.
Just pucker up and whistle (Whistle)
(Whistling)
What's the use of worrying


More or less the same applied to Cressida Dick.

Timing is always bad for top level changes.
 
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