Brexit, for once some facts.

[flecc]

There may therefore be a number of people who have tested positive for antibodies, are now being coded as part of sample C did not feel particularly ill , and may have no worthwhile immunity.

And who repeat this behaviour at each contact?

Honestly you guys all amuse me, any argument, excuse or possibility to continue the hysteria.

Why not relax and accept that life has positives as well as negatives. After over 4 million years we are still here and living longer than ever before!
.

 

[oyster]

That's the baskets in stacks that NEVER have their handles disinfected

Not quite true. I carry a sanitiser spray containing (mostly) alcohol - and I regularly spray basket handles - indeed whole baskets. Some shops do spray theirs - but all too many don't.

Supermarkets and other food shops should put a lot more effort into keeping baskets and trolleys clean all the time. Some are absolutely disgusting. Which is ridiculous when you consider the better ones do put quite a bit of effort into hygiene in other areas.

 

[Wicky]

Yes, either can't catch it or who can only suffer vestigial symptoms.

What proportion of folk do you believe can't get infected? - how do you know folk haven't caught it and aren't asymptomatic spreaders as most folk only get tested when showing symptoms. Are you calling these folk immune?

This case came up on a farm presumably with relatively healthy adults - farm workers isolating after 73 cases

"I understand although a few of the workers had symptoms, most were asymptomatic and the positive results of 73 people came as a surprise to them."

Somehow even though they weren't aware they were infected it was being spread.

Coronavirus: Mathon farm workers isolating after 73 cases

Up to 200 vegetable pickers and packers will remain on the farm in Herefordshire while isolating.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[flecc]

Supermarket baskets ... you can't touch one in my neck of the woods without it being sanitized,

I don't believe that. None of all the major supermarkets I've used sanitise them here in South London or North Surrey. Trolleys handles sometimes yes, but basket handles never, they just get cycled through the stacks continuously.
.

 

[flecc]

What proportion of folk do you believe can't get infected? - how do you know folk haven't caught it and aren't asymptomatic spreaders as most folk only get tested when showing symptoms. Are you calling these folk immune?

This case came up on a farm presumably with relatively healthy adults - farm workers isolating after 73 cases

"I understand although a few of the workers had symptoms, most were asymptomatic and the positive results of 73 people came as a surprise to them."

Somehow even though they weren't aware they were infected it was being spread.

Coronavirus: Mathon farm workers isolating after 73 cases

Up to 200 vegetable pickers and packers will remain on the farm in Herefordshire while isolating.

www.bbc.co.uk

See this answer.
.

 

[Wicky]

You amuse me, like so many as soon as anything positive is posted you'll clutch at anything to try to prove Covid-19 is far worse than it really is. A lot less panic and a lot more reflection could have save us a fortune and a seriously damaged future, but that's difficult f or a government to do when there's still so much hysteria about.

So Brazil that let it rip through is a model we should have followed? Same as America with govt prioritising economy over public health.

I find it sad that needless and preventable death amuses you.

 

[Nev]

Trolleys handles sometimes yes, but basket handles never, they just get cycled through the stacks continuously.

I think your right. I visit a large super market twice a week and they are always cleaning the trolley handles, but I have never seen them cleaning the baskets. I always use a trolley.

 

[flecc]

So Brazil that let it rip through is a model we should have followed? Same as America with govt prioritising economy over public health.

I find it sad that needless and preventable death amuses you.

We are not Brazil or the USA, that is your imagination and not what I've posted. Every government balances economic cost against Covid because they have to and where that is set is a matter of opinion. It always costs lives. I'm not amused by deaths but by all your predictions of doom and gloom.

Our experts haven't got it right to date, so what make you think they'll magically be so now?

I don't believe there will be an Autumn/Winter surge and you'll know soon enough if that is right. I've been right about London's progress through the pandemic to the annoyance of some of you so why shouldn't my related conjecture continue to be?
.

 

[Danidl]

In the case of Britain and many other countries, they aren't thinking again. They really ought to get out into the real world more. Almost a third of our households are single person, you can spot them easily since they predominantly shop using a supermarket basket rather than a trolley. That's also true of others at times when they are only collecting a smaller shop. That's the baskets in stacks that NEVER have their handles disinfected and constantly cycle through the stacks and multiple hands throughout up to 12 hours a day, seven days a week.

Yet we are told people who live alone are far less liable to catch Covid-19 !
.

my strategy when shopping like that is to bring my own bag. I put the things into it and then empty it out on the conveyor, pay by card .. contactless of course. stuff the things back in the bag and trot out to the bike. stuff the bag in the pannier remove the rubber glove and leave it in the pannier for the next time.. probably 2 days later.
incidentally during the lock down period, the local supermarket was sanitiszing baskets.

 

[RossG]

So Brazil that let it rip through is a model we should have followed? Same as America with govt prioritising economy over public health.

I find it sad that needless and preventable death amuses you.

It's like this Wicky, everybody thinks their immune because they haven't got it ... until they get it
If you think you won't get it then go chew a few Supermarket basket handles, you won't be giving it to me that's for sure

 

[Nev]

Sweden is mentioned fairly often on this forum, so I think the following post made by someone today on a financial forum I visit may be of interest.

"The UK vs. Sweden argument frustrates me in that we still have this narrative that “Sweden didn’t do a lockdown and is doing just as well”. People frame the concept of lockdown in terms of only the explicit govt response. That completely ignores the implicit lockdown from population level behavioural changes. Factors like mass transit usage, satellite data on car park usage at offices/retail parks, internet vs. physical retail credit card activity etc. If you look at an index of those activity signals and look at the time it took to reach say 50% of normal levels, Sweden was well ahead of the UK. Sweden hit 50% of many activity signals at around 1250 infections/million; the UK hit the same levels at around 3000 infection/million, two weeks later. The UK didn’t overtake Sweden in the intensity of it’s lockdown until late March. That was caused partially by Swedish activity levels rising sharply in late Mar/early Apr. They didn’t fall back till mid April.

Two weeks actually can make a massive difference in outcomes if R is 1-3 and the doubling rate is say 6 days. If you build a simple multi-variate model (say a Bayesian network type approach) you find that 70-80% of excess death rates per capita is predicted by two factors: quarantines/border closure and the activity index dropping to 50% of normal. It can capture the bulk of even extreme excess death variations such as UK vs. Australia. What’s interesting is that the predictive capacity of an activity index dropping to say 20% of normal isn’t really any better than 50%. It seems that you need to cut behavioural activity quickly/persistently but not necessarily drastically. Perhaps that makes intuitive sense."

 

[jonathan.agnew]

It's like this Wicky, everybody thinks their immune because they haven't got it ... until they get it
If you think you won't get it then go chew a few Supermarket basket handles, you won't be giving it to me that's for sure

speaking of immunity

Immunity to Covid-19 could be lost in months, UK study suggests

Exclusive: King’s College London team found steep drops in antibody levels three months after infection

www.theguardian.com

i find everyone say why don't we follow the Swedish model until the "coughing on glass" sets in or they are told to say goodbye to family members

 

[vfr400]

Maybe. Maybe not...

Immunity to Covid-19 could be lost in months, UK study suggests

Exclusive: King’s College London team found steep drops in patients’ antibody levels three months after infection

People who have recovered from Covid-19 may lose their immunity to the disease within months, according to research suggesting the virus could reinfect people year after year, like common colds.

In the first longitudinal study of its kind, scientists analysed the immune response of more than 90 patients and healthcare workers at Guy’s and St Thomas’ NHS foundation trust and found levels of antibodies that can destroy the virus peaked about three weeks after the onset of symptoms then swiftly declined.

Blood tests revealed that while 60% of people marshalled a “potent” antibody response at the height of their battle with the virus, only 17% retained the same potency three months later. Antibody levels fell as much as 23-fold over the period. In some cases, they became undetectable.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jul/12/immunity-to-covid-19-could-be-lost-in-months-uk-study-suggests

Of course, what we really don't know - at all - is how someone with massively reduced antibodies will react to subsequent re-infection.

Don't you ever think about what you read? That's bloody obvious. You only make anti-bodies when you have the virus. How many chicken pox anti-bodies do you think are running around your bloodstream right now?

That's typical Guardian fake news. They take something that's sort of fact out of context and put a spin on it to suit their agenda, whatever that is. Use your brain and logic instead of accepting that sort of crap. You've really let yourself down on that one. We expect that sort of thing from Danidl, who gets everything wrong, and the others that are incapable of thinking, but you should do better.

 

[flecc]

my strategy when shopping like that is to bring my own bag. I put the things into it and then empty it out on the conveyor, pay by card .. contactless of course. stuff the things back in the bag and trot out to the bike. stuff the bag in the pannier remove the rubber glove and leave it in the pannier for the next time.. probably 2 days later.
incidentally during the lock down period, the local supermarket was sanitiszing baskets.

I can assure you that none of that happens anywhere here as some others have confirmed on baskets, and security here would take a very dim view of you putting things into your shopping bag before the checkout.
.

 

[jonathan.agnew]

Don't you ever think about what you read? That's bloody obvious. You only make anti-bodies when you have the virus. How many chicken pox anti-bodies do you think are running around your bloodstream right now?

That's typical Guardian fake news. They take something that's sort of fact out of context and put a spin on it to suit their agenda, whatever that is. Use your brain and logic instead of accepting that sort of crap. You've really let yourself down on that one. We expect that sort of thing from Danidl, who gets everything wrong, but you should do better.

Now that (you posting about fake news and lack of context) is ironic. Even more ironic than trump wearing a mask. Or govy telling us to go to work and consume. My post crossed his, have a look at Liu,wu, Tao et al and Long, Tang et al (both in June), lack of immunity against covid is a very real issue.

 

[Danidl]

Don't you ever think about what you read? That's bloody obvious. You only make anti-bodies when you have the virus. How many chicken pox anti-bodies do you think are running around your bloodstreamr part ... right now?

That's typical Guardian fake news. They take something that's sort of fact out of context and put a spin on it to suit their agenda, whatever that is. Use your brain and logic instead of accepting that sort of crap. You've really let yourself down on that one. We expect that sort of thing from Danidl, who gets everything wrong, and the others that are incapable of thinking, but you should do better.

Surprise , I get very little wrong that I publish. . ... in some cases it is an error in understanding on your part.
1.the Celtic / irish calendar has Feb 1st as first day of spring. ... see Wiki for confirmation. ,
2. My arguement with Flecc, last Christmas about illiterates being excluded from the workforce, is a matter of opinion and interpretation. I had never said they were unemployable or unintelligent, just excluded from the decision making processes.
3. My statement of 150K deaths in the USA within a time period when the published figure was at 60K, was laughed at by yourself . Now I contend that the figure was reached at the time I had suggested, as figures lag reality in the rising edge. But it is certainly likely to happen within a few days, even with these conservative figures.
So withdraw or elucidate.

 

[vfr400]

More good news. somebody has faith in UK:

Work starts on 4.5 million square foot SSI site to create 9,000 jobs - Tees Business

The South Tees Development Corporation has submitted game-changing plans for a 4.5million sq ft of state-of-the-art manufacturing space on the site of the former SSI [...]

teesbusiness.co.uk

 

[vfr400]

3. My statement of 150K deaths in the USA within a time period when the published figure was at 60K, was laughed at by yourself . Now I contend that the figure was reached at the time I had suggested, as figures lag reality in the rising edge. But it is certainly likely to happen within a few days, even with these conservative figures.
So withdraw or elucidate.

You said on 15th May that USA deaths would reach 150k in three weeks. That was 8 1/2 weeks ago. since then, it has increased from 90K to 135k - still 15K to go. The present death rate is hovering around 2 per million per day and decreasing, or about 650 per day, so at least another 4 weeks yet. I'll let you know when they get there, if they do.

You can't spin facts like the Guardian. It was 90K when you said that:

 

[RossG]

More good news. somebody has faith in UK:

Work starts on 4.5 million square foot SSI site to create 9,000 jobs - Tees Business

The South Tees Development Corporation has submitted game-changing plans for a 4.5million sq ft of state-of-the-art manufacturing space on the site of the former SSI [...]

teesbusiness.co.uk

Now that's what I like to see, a woman on a construction site all that swearing spitting & farting the men are just as bad !

 

[vfr400]

Now that (you posting about fake news and lack of context) is ironic. Even more ironic than trump wearing a mask. Or govy telling us to go to work and consume. My post crossed his, have a look at trusted resources, lack of immunity against covid is a very real issue.

Your posts are just random rants, lacking in any sort of coherency.