Brexit, for once some facts.

[Barry Shittpeas]

I’m watching the briefing on the BBC. There is a chart showing that tens of thousands of people have lost their lives to Coronavirus, but along the bottom is a banner congratulating Johnson. Fantastic news, one banner read, whilst just above it, the graph showed tens of thousands dead! The Tories have done a good job on the BBC. They must have got to them via the license fee.

 

[oyster]

OK folks, let's do it the European way. Oh, hang on there a mo...

Prof Jonathan Van-Tam, the deputy chief medical officer for England, says the new death figures out today are an improvement.

But ultimately the government will be able to look at excess death figures, which show all the excess deaths about average. There is a standardised European way of doing this, he says.

 

[RossG]

I go out about 05:00 hrs for my runs and usually stay rural. The newdoers aren’t around in their pristine running shoes and Lycra until after 08:00 hrs. They will lose their motivation and crumble in a few weeks, so won’t be a problem. I did run towards town on a 8 mile loop this morning, but apart from busy roads, didn’t see many others on foot. I think the first wet day for a while has kept people inside.

Best way to do it Barry, avoid everyone like the err.....plague.

 

[flecc]

Changing the subject slightly I must admire you guys who go out and jog, run, bike and walk around regardless, I must admit I haven't got the bottle. It's not so much the lockdown that would concern me, I would argue the toss if stopped anyway, I'm more worried about others getting in my way.

My position has improved a lot round here. As you know from our previous posts my surroundings make perfect separation impossible unless everyone very actively co-operates, so I was driving a short distance to where it was safe to walk. Now the CPS guidance has confirmed that is acceptable I know I won't have a problem with the police.

But I've also found a huge improvement in the behaviour of everyone in my home area in the last two weeks. Not only is everyone making a real effort to maintain a safe distance, but it's being done in the most courteous way possible with smiles and thank you's acknowledging when others give way. Obviously the message has really got through and this normally quite polite area has gone over the top with courtesy, making it possible for me to go for some walks locally at less busy times.

I hope the change becomes permanent, makes life out walking very pleasant.
.

 

[Barry Shittpeas]

The government are constantly reminding us that they are “being guided by the science” so that means SAGE. If SAGE is effectively running the country, who is SAGE? Who are the members of SAGE? How many members does SAGE have? Where are the minutes of the meetings?

It seems incredible to me. I think “the science” is BS. The government are just using it to by-pass their responsibilities.

If “the science“ is so good, why do we have the worst virus death rate in the world? Other countries are now refusing to let UK residents in, so bad is our handling of the virus.

 

[oyster]

We could easily have reached 100,000 tests a day. And reduced PPE usage. And staff time.

UK turned down offer of 10,000 tests a day four weeks ago

Government declined ‘game-changing’ US-approved coronavirus saliva tests

 

[oyster]

The government are constantly reminding us that they are “being guided by the science” so that means SAGE. If SAGE is effectively running the country, who is SAGE? Who are the members of SAGE? How many members does SAGE have? Where are the minutes of the meetings?

It seems incredible to me. I think “the science” is BS. The government are just using it to by-pass their responsibilities.

If “the science“ is so good, why do we have the worst virus death rate in the world? Other countries are now refusing to let UK residents in, so bad is our handling of the virus.

Today:

Raab says there are always things to learn in a situation like this. But the government has acted on the basis of the best medical advice, he says.

But just how does he know it is the best medical advice? Does he have a valid comparison?

 

[oldgroaner]

After todays PMQ's Raab must be desperate for Boris to step up and do the job he's paid for Starmer was like a spider inviting a fly into it's parlour for dinner

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255498026342383617

And equally Boris must be hoping to find someone to shake hands with

 

[oyster]

After todays PMQ's Raab must be desperate for Boris to step up and do the job he's paid for Starmer was like a spider inviting a fly into it's parlour for dinner

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1255498026342383617

There is an opposition. Now. And this development is totally unacceptable.

Perhaps if the government accepted lack of PPE as a universal cause, each case would not need to investigate the issue. Otherwise, it must be properly and fully considered in each and every case in which it is brought up.

Exclusive: inquests into NHS staff coronavirus deaths told not to look at PPE shortages

Guidance to avoid examining systemic failures is ‘very worrying’, says Labour

 

[flecc]

who is SAGE? Who are the members of SAGE? How many members does SAGE have?

The Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (SAGE) provides scientific and technical advice to support government decision makers during emergencies.

SAGE advice on Covid-19

Toddbrook reservoir, 2019

In 2019 SAGE was activated in response to the potential breach of Toddbrook reservoir in August.

• 6 August 2019: meeting summary (PDF, 48.3KB, 2 pages)

Zika outbreak, 2016

In 2016, a Precautionary SAGE (Pre-SAGE) was activated to advise on the Zika virus outbreak. A Pre-SAGE can forms to look at emerging hazards and assess risks when COBR has not been activated.

• 2 August 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 36.3KB, 4 pages)
• 8 June 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 40.9KB, 5 pages)
• 7 March 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 62.3KB, 6 pages)
• 23 February 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 59.8KB, 6 pages)
• 3 February 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 82.5KB, 6 pages)

Nepal earthquake, 2015

In 2015 SAGE was activated to advise on the Nepal earthquake.

• 27 April 2015: teleconference summary (PDF, 235KB, 5 pages)

Ebola outbreak, 2014

In 2014 SAGE was activated in response to the Ebola outbreak in West Africa.

• 8 December 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 98.9KB, 5 pages)
• 29 October 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 157KB, 5 pages)
• 16 October 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 102KB, 5 pages)

Winter flooding, 2013

In 2013 SAGE was activated in response to the UK winter flooding event between December 2013 and March 2014.

• 25 February 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 36.7KB, 2 pages)
• 19 February 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 26KB, 3 pages)
• 19 February 2014: maps showing most likely and worst case scenarios (PDF, 1.3MB, 2 pages)
• 19 February 2014: sinkhole advice for local authorities (PDF, 37KB, 1 page)
• 14 February 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 38.2KB, 4 pages)

Japan nuclear incident, 2011

In 2011 SAGE was activated to advise on the Fukushima nuclear emergency.

See the National Archives website for minutes

Volcanic Ash emergency, 2010

In 2010 SAGE was activated following the eruption of the Eyjafjallajökull volcano in Iceland.

See the National Archives website for minutes

Swine Flu pandemic, 2009

In 2009 SAGE was activated to provide scientific advice on the H1N1 (Swine Flu) pandemic between May 2009 and January 2010.

See the National Archives website for minutes
.

 

[RossG]

When I look out of my window from the crow's nest up here I can see absolutely no difference whatsoever in the way people are behaving...non at all. Since this whole thing kicked off I must have seen maybe three or four individuals wearing face masks, vehicle traffic is maybe a tad down but not by much. Kids play on bikes scooters etc. or just kick a ball around much as always.

It's the way some individuals handle it that I find quite fascinating, take a relative of my partner's for example.
She works in a Supermarket and doesn't wear a mask or gloves except if she's handling frozen food obviously.
She walks to work and now and again buses in and after work she's out and about visiting friends old and new, she regularly parties and has a great time all round...good for her. It does make me wonder though if it's a case of denial like the chap who said to me this whole virus thing was made up by the BBC ? I guess it's like living in a bubble, what ever goes on outside that bubble doesn't matter to you because you're inside in your own world where viruses can't get to you. Then you have those who feel the need to give their partners a good lamping because they can't get to the pub and let rip, psychologists will have a field day with their theories in the months and years ahead.

 

[Nev]

I was watching an American news channel this afternoon. Seems like there is a little bit of good news about one of the drugs that they are trialing. Remdesivir has provided a small improvement for patients with the virus. It is still early days and the improvement is only slight but Dr Fauci (seems to know what he is talking about) said that it appears to be showing that we can produce treatments to combat the virus.

He worked on HIV treatment years ago, and back then when they started they eventually found something that seemed to provide a little benefit and then progressed to improve upon that. He thought something similar could well happen with this virus.

 

[oldgroaner]

The Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (SAGE) provides scientific and technical advice to support government decision makers during emergencies.

SAGE advice on Covid-19

Toddbrook reservoir, 2019

In 2019 SAGE was activated in response to the potential breach of Toddbrook reservoir in August.

• 6 August 2019: meeting summary (PDF, 48.3KB, 2 pages)

Zika outbreak, 2016

In 2016, a Precautionary SAGE (Pre-SAGE) was activated to advise on the Zika virus outbreak. A Pre-SAGE can forms to look at emerging hazards and assess risks when COBR has not been activated.

• 2 August 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 36.3KB, 4 pages)
• 8 June 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 40.9KB, 5 pages)
• 7 March 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 62.3KB, 6 pages)
• 23 February 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 59.8KB, 6 pages)
• 3 February 2016: meeting summary (PDF, 82.5KB, 6 pages)

Nepal earthquake, 2015

In 2015 SAGE was activated to advise on the Nepal earthquake.

• 27 April 2015: teleconference summary (PDF, 235KB, 5 pages)

Ebola outbreak, 2014

In 2014 SAGE was activated in response to the Ebola outbreak in West Africa.

• 8 December 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 98.9KB, 5 pages)
• 29 October 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 157KB, 5 pages)
• 16 October 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 102KB, 5 pages)

Winter flooding, 2013

In 2013 SAGE was activated in response to the UK winter flooding event between December 2013 and March 2014.

• 25 February 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 36.7KB, 2 pages)
• 19 February 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 26KB, 3 pages)
• 19 February 2014: maps showing most likely and worst case scenarios (PDF, 1.3MB, 2 pages)
• 19 February 2014: sinkhole advice for local authorities (PDF, 37KB, 1 page)
• 14 February 2014: meeting summary (PDF, 38.2KB, 4 pages)

Japan nuclear incident, 2011

In 2011 SAGE was activated to advise on the Fukushima nuclear emergency.

See the National Archives website for minutes

Volcanic Ash emergency, 2010

In 2010 SAGE was activated following the eruption of the Eyjafjallajökull volcano in Iceland.

See the National Archives website for minutes

Swine Flu pandemic, 2009

In 2009 SAGE was activated to provide scientific advice on the H1N1 (Swine Flu) pandemic between May 2009 and January 2010.

See the National Archives website for minutes
.

Where is the Data apertaining to the decisions about the timing of the lockdown? I can't find them on the Government link flecc

 

[soundwave]

well my step dad had to go to hospital for a op today and has reported back he is the only person in the hole ward pmsl.

and wants out the place asap

 

[oyster]

I was watching an American news channel this afternoon. Seems like there is a little bit of good news about one of the drugs that they are trialing. Remdesivir has provided a small improvement for patients with the virus. It is still early days and the improvement is only slight but Dr Fauci (seems to know what he is talking about) said that it appears to be showing that we can produce treatments to combat the virus.

He worked on HIV treatment years ago, and back then when they started they eventually found something that seemed to provide a little benefit and then progressed to improve upon that. He thought something similar could well happen with this virus.

I thought Gilead shares had dropped because Remdesivir had proved not useful!

This being just one paper:

In this study of adult patients admitted to hospital for severe COVID-19, remdesivir was not associated with statistically significant clinical benefits.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31022-9/fulltext

 

[oldgroaner]

well my step dad had to go to hospital for a op today and has reported back he is the only person in the hole ward pmsl.

and wants out the place asap

I believe that a course of tablets could well cure your incontinence, as pmsl can prove embarrassing in mixed company

Convey our best wishes for a speedy recovery to your step dad he deserves a little good luck

 

[oldgroaner]

I thought Gilead shares had dropped because Remdesivir had proved not useful!

This being just one paper:

In this study of adult patients admitted to hospital for severe COVID-19, remdesivir was not associated with statistically significant clinical benefits.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31022-9/fulltext

Fauci is probably just trying to head the Bleach drinkers off at the pass so to speak.

 

[Barry Shittpeas]

Where is the Data apertaining to the decisions about the timing of the lockdown? I can't find them on the Government link flecc

SAGE usually publish the minutes of their meetings within two weeks of the meeting taking place. Nothing has been published since the Coronavirus outbreak. This isn’t right, seeing as they are effectively running the country.

What was said about herd immunity? Who proposed it? What science changed to cause them to do an overnight 180 degree turn on herd immunity? Do any members still support it? What are the technical reasons for discouraging the wearing of face masks? Why has PPE criteria changed?

It’s a mysterious, unaccountable and secret organisation running the country. Everything Brexit was supposed to stop.

 

[soundwave]

I believe that a course of tablets could well cure your incontinence, as pmsl can prove embarrassing in mixed company

Convey our best wishes for a speedy recovery to your step dad he deserves a little good luck

but it is still empty even the car park is mostly empty bar staff cars and told to park on the top floor.

he never wanted to go and was sent straight from the doctors.

the ward he is on has space for 45 ppl he is the only one there so there you go

 

[oldgroaner]

but it is still empty even the car park is mostly empty bar staff cars and told to park on the top floor.

he never wanted to go and was sent straight from the doctors.

the ward he is on has space for 45 ppl he is the only one there so there you go

Lets hope you are soon reunited and he is fully recovered. Regards OG