Brexit, for once some facts.

[Fingers]

Why do you have to "Justify" another referendum? the previous one has been outdated by events, and the only reason another one is resisted is the fear of leave voters they will lose.
If the do, or if they win, provided fiddling is excluded this time democracy will have been seen to be done.
Why are you against democracy? why the lack of confidence? it should be a walk over for you if your argument is sound
The truth is you know the game is up, don't you?

A second referendum tramples all over democracy. Just because you didn't like the result doesn't mean anything. Unless of course you don't believe in democracy.

It really is as simple as that.

 

[flecc]

A second referendum tramples all over democracy.

It's no different from general elections, a following one is a vote on whether the previous winner's policies were successful enough to defeat new proposals from others.

Brexit has appeared to have failed even before it's started as you've acknowledged by saying we won't be leaving. Why it's failed is immaterial, what's needed now is to allow the people who voted the problem into existence to resolve it since parliament can't.

That's democratic, the people getting the last word. If they still insist on Brexit they will have overruled parliament and parliament will have to accept it, if necessary with No Deal.
.

 

[Danidl]

The EU isn't heading in a direction I'm comfortable with. It really is as simple as that. They won't change so we need to.

As I've said all along though. We won't be allowed to leave so it's all rather moot. I'm still looking forward to the way they will justify the second referendum and all the chaos and ramifications that will ensue.

The simple fact is the vote should be respected. If it is the disaster the squealers predict then we simply rejoin and take the Euro. That should be the question on the next inevitable referendum. Join the Euro or leave. That will sharpen the senses.

You are" allowed" to leave .That was enshrined in the Lisbon Treaty. This victimhood seeking is tedious.
The referendum vote was respected. A decision was lodged with Brussels A deal was negotiated. The Parliament voted multiple times,and said they will not leave without a deal. In what way did that not "respect the vote"
You of course are entitled not to like the way the EU is going.and had the opportunity to vote. i am not happy with the direction the UK is going, but of course had no such vote.

 

[daveboy]

It's no different from general elections,
.

"Once in a Generation decision" So unless you've only got a few years to live, It's nothing like a general election.

 

[Woosh]

Leave won because Leave meant change.

Remain lost because it was no change.

so you won't be surprised if a campaign to rejoin after brexit succeeds or Scotland leaves the UK at IndyRef2 next year or 2021 then?
if so, then you should support leave and rejoin, Scotland leave and rejoin too.
That means leave first.

 

[Danidl]

It's no different from general elections, a following one is a vote on whether the previous winner's policies were successful enough to defeat new proposals from others.

Brexit has appeared to have failed even before it's started as you've acknowledged by saying we won't be leaving. Why it's failed is immaterial, what's needed now is to allow the people who voted the problem into existence to resolve it since parliament can't.

That's democratic, the people getting the last word. If they still insist on Brexit they will have overruled parliament and parliament will have to accept it, if necessary with No Deal.
.

The continual error being made is that the UK is a normal democracy. The only last word that the public has in the election of their MP.

 

[flecc]

"Once in a Generation decision" So unless you've only got a few years to live, It's nothing like a general election.

Like all the other things said in connection with the referendum, it was meaningless. Saying that was anti democratic anyway.

It is just like a GE, when the public can change their previous decision. We've voted for and tried to Brexit, It hasn't worked and has hit the buffers, so time to decide afresh.
.

 

[flecc]

The continual error being made is that the UK is a normal democracy. The only last word that the public has in the election of their MP.

Parliament passed the democratic decision to the people and the outcome has hit the buffers. So a new referendum is going back to the public to complete the democratic process that parliament approved.
.

 

[daveboy]

Rory Stewart has admitted smoking opium In Iran.....Oh dear..

 

[Woosh]

Like all the other things said in connection with the refendum, it was meaningless. Saying that was anti democratic anyway.

It is just like a GE, when the public can change their previous decision. We've voted for and tried to Brexit, It hasn't worked and has hit the buffers, so time to decide afresh.
.

it hasn't hit anything. Parliament remains undecided after 3 years or haggling.
The correct way is JC's way: new GE.
This time, Labour should campaign for a soft brexit with confirmatory referendum.

 

[daveboy]

A soft Brexit is like me wanting Indian food, the wife wanting Chinese and we end up having beans on toast.

 

[oldgroaner]

Exactly, we can do the same. The problems of EU membership are largely imaginary, such as the claim that we are prevented from trading worldwide. Germany, Sweden, Denmark, France, The Netherlands, Italy and others do so without any problems. Where we don't is because we are just not good enough, nothing to do with EU membership. That's how I know Brexit will fail, leaving the EU won't magically make us good enough,



We won't be able to sell those cars across the world, those mainly Oriental manufacturers have that covered already from cheaper sources, our car factories only came into existance to supply this barrier free EU area. Even the European makers have production facilities in other parts of the world to supply those local markets.

To sell elsewhere we'll need our own home owned successful car brands.
.

We will be more likely to successfully breed racing Unicorns

 

[Fingers]

Rory Stewart has admitted smoking opium In Iran.....Oh dear..

I found it very moreish.

 

[wheeler]

Rory Stewart has admitted smoking opium In Iran.....Oh dear..

Aye, but he didn't inhale.

 

[Fingers]

Parliament passed the democratic decision to the people and the outcome has hit the buffers. So a new referendum is going back to the public to complete the democratic process that parliament approved.
.

No, you are confused. We’ve already had the democratic decision.

We had a vote on it and everything.

 

[oldgroaner]

A second referendum tramples all over democracy. Just because you didn't like the result doesn't mean anything. Unless of course you don't believe in democracy.

It really is as simple as that.

What on Earth leads you to believe that nonsense, by your logic you should never have been offered the SECOND referendum but mistakenly according to you, you were!
Unless of course you don't believe in democracy.
It really is as simple as that.

And that is without the fact that the result was criminally rigged!

 

[Zlatan]

No, they were air guns. There's a Wikipedia article about this. Here's what it says:

"This forward-moving barrel has given rise to the view that the Gat is not an air weapon at all, but simply a spring catapult. This is incorrect. The piston is a leather seal around the outside of the inner barrel, running in a larger concentric cylinder within the receiver. The barrel and piston are driven forward when fired, air passing into the chamber from two small transfer ports drilled at the rear of the barrel, just ahead of the leather seal."

I had one myself in about 1947, made with aluminium and completely useless.
.

That might have been the theory but the things were no more or less powerful if you removed the leather air seal. The air might have helped a bit when new but the things would eject pellets in a catapult action with air ports blocked, which they usually were with bits of the leather seal.. They were utterly crap, new, old worn out or mint..

 

[oldgroaner]

No, you are confused. We’ve already had the democratic decision.

We had a vote on it and everything.

First it wasn't actually democratic as there were too many EU residing UK passport holders excluded, second the whole world outside the Brexit Voter bubble know that it was rigged.
Added to that the vote was only to leave, and based on wild promises that were such Blatant lies Boris is facing trial over them, and it is now clearly no longer the majority view by a long shot.
Time for Brexit voters to show their faith in it but they fear they will lose, don't they?
What have you to lose by another referendum?
The idea that this advisory referendum, which was not legally binding, is a cast in stone unchangeable decision is utter nonsense

 

[oldgroaner]

I found it very moreish.

I think you meant Moorish?

 

[oldgroaner]

it hasn't hit anything. Parliament remains undecided after 3 years or haggling.
The correct way is JC's way: new GE.
This time, Labour should campaign for a soft brexit with confirmatory referendum.

The correct way is another this time binding referendum with a proper margin for victory established
Ask the same question again