Brexit, for once some facts.

Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,338
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Southend on Sea
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But thats barely a 1% margin!

That's not democracy!!

RE RUN THE VOTE!
don't be surprised, they do that all the time, the losing faction will just bring in a new amendment.
In the current scenario, it seems that TM does not mind losing because she has not got much left to lose.
All that means is fewer ERG members will vote against her.
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,157
30,573
"Rates of turnout at European Parliament elections have been nothing short of dire, falling from a respectable 62% at the first contest in 1979 to 43% in 2014.

But look at individual states. Five years ago, turnout slumped below 30% in Hungary, Slovenia and Poland, and to just 13% in Slovakia."
This is inevitable with the present structure since a country's election will be seen as by far the more important than that of a power limited European parliament.

If the EU achieves its aim of becoming a single country of states, that will be immediately corrected. Then it will be more like the USA's national elections where some 60% participate in presidential years and 40% in mid term elections. Not great figures, but reflecting the considerable powers that states retain over the federation.
.
 
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Fingers

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 9, 2016
3,373
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Another of the main reasons I voted leave - and many I am sure did likewise - is because I felt the EU does not represent me. I didn't bother voting in the last EU elections for that very reason. I like my democracy close - the closer the better.

Here's some stats I found today that confirms I was not alone in this thinking:

"Rates of turnout at European Parliament elections have been nothing short of dire, falling from a respectable 62% at the first contest in 1979 to 43% in 2014.

But look at individual states. Five years ago, turnout slumped below 30% in Hungary, Slovenia and Poland, and to just 13% in Slovakia.

Alongside the more recent finding that nearly one in two people do not feel that their voice counts in the EU, 2019 will underline the way in which the EU is struggling from a lack of grassroots democratic engagement."

It's dying. And can you imagine the gangsters and corrupt officials these states will produce as candidates?

Nepotism and cronyism will be the best you can hope for...
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
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This is inevitable with the present structure since a country's election will be seen as by far the more important than that of a power limited European parliament.

If the EU achieves its aim of becoming a single country of states, that will be immediately corrected. Then it will be more like the USA's national elections where some 60% participate in presidential years and 40% in mid term elections. Not great figures, but reflecting the considerable powers that states retain over the federation.
.
What baffles me is that the more extreme Brexit Voters have a preference for being robbed blind by local political hooligans and imagine the EU won't survive, lord knows how they imagine that is logical.
You would have thought that they would have seen through the Tory party for what it is by now, just a bunch of chancers.
 
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Fingers

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 9, 2016
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What baffles me is that the more extreme Brexit Voters have a preference for being robbed blind by local political hooligans and imagine the EU won't survive, lord knows how they imagine that is logical.
You would have thought that they would have seen through the Tory party for what it is by now, just a bunch of chancers.

Why do I get the strong impression a lot of things baffle you G-unit?

Remember old friend. Labour is a party of leave too.
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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Human stupidity is baffling, the surprise comes when you realise how widespread it is ,otherwise how can you explain wanting to leave the EU into the arms of the most incompetent government in the world?
 
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Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,338
16,857
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
What baffles me is that the more extreme Brexit Voters have a preference for being robbed blind by local political hooligans and imagine the EU won't survive, lord knows how they imagine that is logical.
You would have thought that they would have seen through the Tory party for what it is by now, just a bunch of chancers.
they have a different view of what is best: patriotism is their common thread. The latter is translated into the English identity, ruling out any model of the US of E where member states don't speak the same language, therefore do not share the same culture, sense of humour and belonging.
I feel the effect of identity (or confusion in my case) when I watch French TV quizzes. I guess AKW feels that too.
They imagine that the EU won't survive to justify the logic of their rejection.
 
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Fingers

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 9, 2016
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Human stupidity is baffling, the surprise comes when you realise how widespread it is ,otherwise how can you explain wanting to leave the EU into the arms of the most incompetent government in the world?

We're moving to Zimbabwe?

Hang on a minute.....I didn't vote for this!
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
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they have a different view of what is best: patriotism is their common thread. The latter is translated into the English identity, ruling out any model of the US of E where member states don't speak the same language, therefore do not share the same culture, sense of humour and belonging.
I feel the effect of identity (or confusion in my case) when I watch French TV quizzes. I guess AKW feels that too.
They imagine that the EU won't survive to justify the logic of their rejection.
The irony is that to all intents and purposes the culture of this country is remarkably similar to all the other European nations, and had we not had the situation where misgovernment of this country has been rife for many years
Brexit would never have happened, and only did because of the actions of politicians who are afraid of facing the future and want to hide in a now long dead past.
In fact genetically we are all interrelated with the the European nations.

To be honest Brexit isn't important in the long term, as independent small nations, just like the small saxon kingdoms on this island ,inevitably combine into larger units, and the formation of the United States of Europe inevitably will include the United Kingdom, which after all in it's nature is merely a smaller version of what the mainland nations will become.
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
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Some of the targetted adverts used by the leave campaign, only shown to those judged susceptible just days before the referendum


And how was the dataharvested?
Fact check 9: How did Vote Leave find these "missing" voters? With the dodgy data harvesting football quiz app. I really hope @ICOnews investigates this. It was clearly abusive. Football fans vied to win £50m. App harvested their personal data. Not labelled. Covert. Illegal?



wasn' t that cute?
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
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And there is more on the BBC
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44966969
Vote Leave's targeted Brexit ads released by Facebook
The official Vote Leave campaign spent more than £2.7m on targeting ads at specific groups of people on Facebook - helping it to win the 2016 EU referendum.

The US social media giant has now released these ads to a committee of MPs investigating fake news - meaning everyone, not just those they were originally aimed at, can now see them.

The ads, created by Canadian company Aggregate AIQ, often focused on specific issues - such as immigration or animal rights - thought likely to push the buttons of certain groups of people, based on their age, where they lived and other personal data taken from social media and other sources.

The 120 pages of documents appear to back up the findings of the Electoral Commission, which ruled last week that Vote Leave broke electoral law by working jointly with another campaign, BeLeave - something denied by both groups.

A number of BeLeave ads were sent from the Vote Leave Facebook account,


There are 1,433 different messages in the data set released by Facebook, all with one common theme
The adverts contained in the Facebook data set were seen more than 169 million times in total.
 
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Fingers

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 9, 2016
3,373
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Some of the targetted adverts used by the leave campaign, only shown to those judged susceptible just days before the referendum


And how was the dataharvested?
Fact check 9: How did Vote Leave find these "missing" voters? With the dodgy data harvesting football quiz app. I really hope @ICOnews investigates this. It was clearly abusive. Football fans vied to win £50m. App harvested their personal data. Not labelled. Covert. Illegal?



wasn' t that cute?

Rest easy old friend.

The referendum is over. Time the look to the future not the past.
 

oyster

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 7, 2017
10,422
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We have seen many people not happy about chlorinated chicken and hormone-fed beef from the USA possibly coming into the UK. Of course, despite the unpopularity here, it is possible they are reasonably safe. However, it is only possible to know that such standards as exist are being applied if the inspection regime are in place and operating.

Given that the USA is having to reduce or suspend food inspection for their own food, do you think they would do any more to reassure us were we buying more food from them?

I really don't think they would.

The Washington Post reports that the shutdown has led to a significant reduction in food inspections.

[The Food and Drug Administration] which oversees 80 percent of the food supply, has suspended all routine inspections of domestic food-processing facilities, FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb said in an interview. He said he’s working on a plan to bring back inspectors as early as next week to resume inspections of high-risk facilities, which handle foods such as soft cheese or seafood, or have a history of problems.
 

Fingers

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 9, 2016
3,373
1,552
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We have seen many people not happy about chlorinated chicken and hormone-fed beef from the USA possibly coming into the UK. Of course, despite the unpopularity here, it is possible they are reasonably safe. However, it is only possible to know that such standards as exist are being applied if the inspection regime are in place and operating.

Given that the USA is having to reduce or suspend food inspection for their own food, do you think they would do any more to reassure us were we buying more food from them?

I really don't think they would.

The Washington Post reports that the shutdown has led to a significant reduction in food inspections.

[The Food and Drug Administration] which oversees 80 percent of the food supply, has suspended all routine inspections of domestic food-processing facilities, FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb said in an interview. He said he’s working on a plan to bring back inspectors as early as next week to resume inspections of high-risk facilities, which handle foods such as soft cheese or seafood, or have a history of problems.

Could Donald be the unlikely saviour of the remainer?
 

Fingers

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 9, 2016
3,373
1,552
46
And there is more on the BBC
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-44966969
Vote Leave's targeted Brexit ads released by Facebook
The official Vote Leave campaign spent more than £2.7m on targeting ads at specific groups of people on Facebook - helping it to win the 2016 EU referendum.

The US social media giant has now released these ads to a committee of MPs investigating fake news - meaning everyone, not just those they were originally aimed at, can now see them.

The ads, created by Canadian company Aggregate AIQ, often focused on specific issues - such as immigration or animal rights - thought likely to push the buttons of certain groups of people, based on their age, where they lived and other personal data taken from social media and other sources.

The 120 pages of documents appear to back up the findings of the Electoral Commission, which ruled last week that Vote Leave broke electoral law by working jointly with another campaign, BeLeave - something denied by both groups.

A number of BeLeave ads were sent from the Vote Leave Facebook account,


There are 1,433 different messages in the data set released by Facebook, all with one common theme
The adverts contained in the Facebook data set were seen more than 169 million times in total.

It’s hardly breaking news old friend.

This very subject was the main story arc in a docs drama that aired on channel 4 but 4 days ago.

If you’re into Brexit check it out. Was very interesting. Benediction Cumberland was in it.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
32,613
80
Some of the targetted adverts used by the leave campaign, only shown to those judged susceptible just days before the referendum


And how was the dataharvested?
Fact check 9: How did Vote Leave find these "missing" voters? With the dodgy data harvesting football quiz app. I really hope @ICOnews investigates this. It was clearly abusive. Football fans vied to win £50m. App harvested their personal data. Not labelled. Covert. Illegal?





wasn' t that cute?
Fingers regards this criminal activity as funny?
That important decisions that affect the fate of the nature are fair game for cheating and corruption?
Brexit was bought and sold for dodgy gold and apparently this was applauded by people who approve of crime.
Are we supposed to just accept this and carry on as if nothing has happened?
Let's have some legal action taken against the villains behind this to protect democracy
 
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