Brexit, for once some facts.

[Kudoscycles]

The little 5 year old lad who was pulled out of the ruin after a missile hit his house in Aleppo,Syria,wiping blood away from his head wound,said it all to me.
These people from Syria are not economic migrants,they are trying to get away to save their families lives.
Our and the EU politicians should be trying to sort out the war in Syria instead of mucking about with this stupid Brexit,which whether you are a leaver or remainer is going nowhere and a complete waste of effort and money.
By the way where is Tony Blair,isn't he our Peace Envoy?
KudosDave

 

[oldgroaner]

That's just a publicity stunt to get a section in the Daily Fail.

BREXIT is a long term investment for our futures. It's like buying stocks & shares and expecting big returns after just a few days, it won't happen, there will be ups and downs. Hold your nerve, stiff upper lip, show some English spunk, the good times will come.

Gosh I nearly missed the best joke you have come out with so far tillson, I apologise profusely, and admit I have never heard taking a "million to one against success bet" and calling it a "long term investment"
Glory be! that's a terrific joke!
It is nothing more than a group betting against the odds that somehow a balls up will end advantageously, and without even requiring a plan or even knowing what they want (apart form chucking out Johnny Foreigners from the country)
And of course not having to pay anything that can be kept in the collective purse.
Stiff upper lip indeed,not being so tight with the wallet would have been a better idea, and acting like a grown up member of the EU, now we are coming out,you had better put a padlock on your savings.

 

[oldtom]

By the way where is Tony Blair,isn't he our Peace Envoy?
KudosDave

He's serving life with a rec of 40 years after being found guilty at the Hague of crimes against humanity.........oh wait!

Tom

 

[mike killay]

Care to explain the relevance on that, Mike?
What democracy, and what self determination?

Self evident to a thinker.

 

[oldgroaner]

Self evident to a thinker.

Strange, as a thinker it isn't clear to me, or are you claiming you use a different form of Brexiters logic that cannot be understood by other people?
What is self evident is it was a big mistake.
Some sort of "loss of Sovereignty illusion to the EU" and "Defending our Borders" fantasy as it we didn't intend ever to participate in the way it was run?
"Self Determination" meaning the right to avoid responsibility to our friends and renege on treaties in case we face a bill?
Or the lie that the EU ruled us by Fiat rather than with our agreement perhaps.

And now we will have to pay the huge cost of closing our borders to people we rely on to make the economy work, (Which the Government has said it can't do and doesn't want to anyway)
And Britain will be Great again.
No one surely believes jingoistic tripe like that, or do they.

Really, it's just a sort of Unplanned Gamble isn't it?
Hardly smart thinking, not knowing what you actually want, how to get it, or having even the beginning of a plan to deal with the mess you've made.
More like Damn silly.
But lets invoke article 50 now and you will have the chance to prove yourself right, eh?

 

[oldgroaner]

The Daily Mail published this rather odd one today
"
May urged to axe Osborne's £9 living wage: It will cost thousands of jobs and do little to cut poverty, report warns

• Think tank warns Osborne's living wage will cost thousands of jobs
• Institute of Economic Affairs says it will do little to alleviate poverty
• Last year George Osborne announced that minimum wage would be raised to a National Living Wage of more than £9 an hour by 2020"

Only a recommendation of course but why did the Mail publish it?

 

[trex]

apparently Trump wants to be known as Mr 'brexit'.

I wonder what brexiters may think of Mr Trump.

 

[tillson]

apparently Trump wants to be known as Mr 'brexit'.

I wonder what brexiters may think of Mr Trump.

Apparently Gary Glitter wants to be known as Mr Remain. I think I'll go with Mr BREXIT. Thank you.

 

[trex]

Tillson, I am looking for serious answers. Donald Trump does not think political correctness is needed when one runs for the presidency of the USA. Maybe that's the reason that he feels associated with the brexit movement.

 

[oldgroaner]

Apparently Gary Glitter wants to be known as Mr Remain. I think I'll go with Mr BREXIT. Thank you.

Is that an endorsement tillson? surely you speak in jest.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

How do you know that here is no truth in this? You may copy and paste the opinions of others, but what makes their contrary view any more or less truthful than those printed in the Daily Telegraph? Why are you the final arbiter on what is right and what is wrong?

How the Telegraph can suggest that the shock is over, etc etc is nonsense and anyone with an ounce of common sense should be able to see this, even if you don't under stand how supply chains work.

2 more examples for you, from just within the cycle industry.

Fox suspension put their UK prices up to dealers by 12% yesterday.

We distribute a brand of energy products we've been waiting and waiting hoping things would improve... they haven't. We're now out of pre-brexit stock, so our next order is going to cost us a lot more, so our prices will also be also be rising by 12%.

The delay is just caused by stock levels, companies taking a risk etc etc... its only going to get worse, and this is just the exchange rate reacting to worries that we might leave. The are 2 things that are likely to happen...

If we do leave the exchange rate are likely to get worse, and then if you speak to anyone in Switzerland / Norway you'll understand the impact of tariffs on the cost of things. Its not cheap to live in either of those countries for a reason. The advantage they both have is they have exports / services that the rest of the EU need. We don't. So our wages won't rise to cover the current 10/15% price rise we're currently experiencing let alone a 20% rise plus tariffs. The next 6 months will be very interesting.

 

[oldgroaner]

The FT are running a series of articles suggesting the the "City" have rejected the idea of a "Norway" type settlement and prefer a "Switzerland" version, though they are forgetting that Switzerland has to do it's banking in London to get into the EU Markets.
"
A likely obstacle to achieving the type of bespoke trade treaty that many in the City are pushing for could be an EU demand that the UK accepts freedom of movement of people from the bloc as a condition of keeping any single market access.

Given how passionately many Brexit supporters want to control immigration, they are unlikely to accept the type of arrangement that Switzerland and Norway have in effect accepted by joining the Schengen passport-free travel area.
Now how I wonder is Mrs May going to sell that to the Brexiteers?
I can't see her pulling it off, can you?

 

[tillson]

Is that an endorsement tillson? surely you speak in jest.

No, I think it's part of a Remain re-branding. They hope Glitter will improve their image.

 

[oldgroaner]

No, I think it's part of a Remain re-branding. They hope Glitter will improve their image.

I do so like your style!
Actually the "Remain" camp doesn't have to do anything.
Except wait...
Whereas the Leave camp has everything to prove, especially on the "Making a plan that will avert political and economic disaster, yet not upset the Brexit anti immigration voters."
What are the chances of pleasing the Bankers, the City and UKIP at one and the same time?
Long odds against success indeed!
Easier to knit a garment out of FOG.
Not so much
"Give us the tools and we'll finish the job"
as
"Give us enough fools and we'll spend so long to come up with a plan the plebs will forget they voted for it."

 

[tillson]

I do so like your style!
Actually the "Remain" camp doesn't have to do anything.
Except wait...
Whereas the Leave camp has everything to prove, especially on the "Making a plan that will avert political and economic disaster, yet not upset the Brexit anti immigration voters."
What are the chances of pleasing the Bankers, the City and UKIP at one and the same time?
Long odds against success indeed!
Easier to knit a garment out of FOG.
Not so much
"Give us the tools and we'll finish the job"
as
"Give us enough fools and we'll spend so long to come up with a plan the plebs will forget they voted for it."

BREXIT has nothing to prove. BREXIT won.

Anti -immigrant is a lie if course. What I think you meant too say was pro Imigration control, which is something very different.

 

[oldgroaner]

BREXIT has nothing to prove. BREXIT won.

Anti -immigrant is a lie if course. What I think you meant too say was pro Imigration control, which is something very different.

Wrong again tillson, brexit has everything to prove, all it has done so far is cause trouble,and if you imagine the majority of brexit voters only want control of immigration, you need some facts to back that up, it is as you are so fond of saying only an opinion.
Show me a something positive that brexit has achieved.

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

 

[tillson]

How the Telegraph can suggest that the shock is over, etc etc is nonsense and anyone with an ounce of common sense should be able to see this, even if you don't under stand how supply chains work.

2 more examples for you, from just within the cycle industry.

Fox suspension put their UK prices up to dealers by 12% yesterday.

We distribute a brand of energy products we've been waiting and waiting hoping things would improve... they haven't. We're now out of pre-brexit stock, so our next order is going to cost us a lot more, so our prices will also be also be rising by 12%.

The delay is just caused by stock levels, companies taking a risk etc etc... its only going to get worse, and this is just the exchange rate reacting to worries that we might leave. The are 2 things that are likely to happen...

If we do leave the exchange rate are likely to get worse, and then if you speak to anyone in Switzerland / Norway you'll understand the impact of tariffs on the cost of things. Its not cheap to live in either of those countries for a reason. The advantage they both have is they have exports / services that the rest of the EU need. We don't. So our wages won't rise to cover the current 10/15% price rise we're currently experiencing let alone a 20% rise plus tariffs. The next 6 months will be very interesting.

Yeah yeah, and of course between June 2013 and June 2014 when we saw the pound strengthen against the Dollar by approximately 12% we saw prices tumbling. Oh, hang on a minute, no we didn't, the suppliers, "trousered" the extra cheese.

I understand that a worsening exchange rate puts pressure on margins, but have little sympathy because it only seems to work to the disadvantage of the customer, whichever way the pound moves.

Let them continue to put up prices and I will continue to hoard money.

 

[tillson]

Wrong again tillson, brexit has everything to prove, all it has done so far is cause trouble,and if you imagine the majority of brexit voters only want control of immigration, you need some facts to back that up.

Here is a fact. Google "UK EU membership referendum result". The fact that you will be presented with is that the UK voted by a majority to leave the EU.

Right, there is my fact. Where is yours which proves that BREXIT is anti-immigration?

Yes, I thought so.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Let them continue to put up prices and I will continue to hoard money.

and boom - you're finally getting it!

There are some things you can hold back on buying, but considering how much we import that people don't even realise is imported, you can't stop buying everything.

Plus if you're hoarding money, you won't be alone. People reduce spending, economy crashes, jobs lost.

 

[oldgroaner]

Here is a fact. Google "UK EU membership referendum result". The fact that you will be presented with is that the UK voted by a majority to leave the EU.

Right, there is my fact. Where is yours which proves that BREXIT is anti-immigration?

Yes, I thought so.

So you have proof of something we are not arguing about, so what?
Did I disagree?
No, my opinion is that the notion that brexit voters only want control of immigration, not to eliminate it is incorrect, I can no more offer facts to prove that than you can to disprove it.
But there are few positive indications to support your view, and many very strident readers comments in the newspapers insisting not only on ending immigration completely but going so far as to hunt down those already here and send them back.

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