Brexit, for once some facts.

anotherkiwi

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jan 26, 2015
7,845
5,786
The European Union
...its a shame we are a great trading nation ,very innovative and skilful,our government has let us down badly.
KudosDave
I'm sorry Dave, I can't let you say that... :rolleyes:

I don't think that is true. You have innovative corporations and some skilful people but as a trading nation do you hold a candle to Germany?... Don't confuse rape and plunder with trade, that is what England was good in the past at but the days of the tall ships are over. Even last centuries tall ships (a.k.a. financial services) days are numbered on UK soil.

Your skilled and innovative youth will migrate to where there are interesting, well paid jobs.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
32,613
80
The difference between the factions here?
Here's Simple Guide for those lacking the ability to assimilate Factual information

Remainers ...............Lions needing leadership
leavers.......................Donkeys led by Hyenas
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
32,613
80
The only reason why Leavers are against a peoples vote is that they know they will lose a second vote and we will Remain.
Nobody likes to admit they got it wrong.
KudosDave
Especially when these people have played the victim card too often that they were "Being patronised" by anyone pointing out the folly of their choice.,and defended thenselves with "We knew what we were voting for"

And all we have tried to do throughout is to make them face up to ......

What they were voting against... their own interests...
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,215
30,615
I'm sorry Dave, I can't let you say that... :rolleyes:

I don't think that is true. You have innovative corporations and some skilful people but as a trading nation do you hold a candle to Germany?...
Indeed, and not just Germany, Italy is far better than us at trade in a wide variety of areas. In fashion for example, their famous multiple brands are present with retail outlets all over the world, cashing in on the nouveau riche in advancing countries.
.
 

Kudoscycles

Official Trade Member
Apr 15, 2011
5,566
5,048
www.kudoscycles.com
Here for the benefit of those who think someone is being honest with them is an archived speech about the benefits of the EU given by TM when home secretary
https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/home-secretarys-speech-on-the-uk-eu-and-our-place-in-the-world
And now when asked is she sorry we are leaving the EU
She answers NO
I liked this bit....
If we were not in the European Union, however, no such deal could have been agreed. There would be little we could do to stop discriminatory policies being introduced, and London’s position as the world’s leading financial centre would be in danger. The banks may be unpopular, but this is no small risk: financial services account for more than 7% of our economic output, 13% of our exports, a trade surplus of almost £60 billion - and more than one million British jobs.

But this is all about trade with Europe. What about trade with the rest of the world? It is tempting to look at developing countries’ economies, with their high growth rates, and see them as an alternative to trade with Europe. But just look at the reality of our trading relationship with China - with its dumping policies, protective tariffs and industrial-scale industrial espionage. And look at the figures. We export more to Ireland than we do to China, almost twice as much to Belgium as we do to India, and nearly 3 times as much to Sweden as we do to Brazil. It is not realistic to think we could just replace European trade with these new markets.
signed....Theresa May
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
32,613
80
I liked this bit....
If we were not in the European Union, however, no such deal could have been agreed. There would be little we could do to stop discriminatory policies being introduced, and London’s position as the world’s leading financial centre would be in danger. The banks may be unpopular, but this is no small risk: financial services account for more than 7% of our economic output, 13% of our exports, a trade surplus of almost £60 billion - and more than one million British jobs.

But this is all about trade with Europe. What about trade with the rest of the world? It is tempting to look at developing countries’ economies, with their high growth rates, and see them as an alternative to trade with Europe. But just look at the reality of our trading relationship with China - with its dumping policies, protective tariffs and industrial-scale industrial espionage. And look at the figures. We export more to Ireland than we do to China, almost twice as much to Belgium as we do to India, and nearly 3 times as much to Sweden as we do to Brazil. It is not realistic to think we could just replace European trade with these new markets.
signed....Theresa May
And this bit on Sovereignty
"
These institutions invite member states to make a trade-off: to pool and therefore cede some sovereignty in a controlled way, to prevent a greater loss of sovereignty in an uncontrolled way, through for example military conflict or economic decline.

Article 5 of NATO’s Washington Treaty is a good example of how this principle works: NATO member countries, Britain included, have agreed to be bound by the principle of collective defence. An attack on any single member will, according to the treaty, be interpreted as an attack on all members, and collective defence measures - including full military action - can be triggered. Britain could find itself bound to go to war because of a dispute involving a different country - a clear and dramatic loss of control of our foreign policy - but on the other hand, NATO membership means we are far more secure from attack by hostile states - which increases our control of our destiny. This is an institutionalised trade-off that the vast majority of the public - and most political leaders - think is worthwhile.
In other words if America goes to war we have to as well.
Just Dandy!
We would be far better off being part of and trusting to an EU army not to merrily join into reckless wars like Vietnam was than we are as Americas attack dog.
How does Nato membership equate with keeping our Sovereignty, when membership can mean we get involved in someone elses war against the wishes of the public?
Remember Iraq?
 
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Woosh

Trade Member
May 19, 2012
20,387
16,884
Southend on Sea
wooshbikes.co.uk
How does Nato membership equate with keeping our Sovereignty, when membership can mean we get involved in someone elses war against the wishes of the public?
could it be because NATO is led by our American allies (who happens to speak the same language) and we trust them more than the EU's army led by Germans, French and Italians?
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,215
30,615
Here for the benefit of those who think someone is being honest with them is an archived speech about the benefits of the EU given by TM when home secretary
https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/home-secretarys-speech-on-the-uk-eu-and-our-place-in-the-world
Showing clearly just how much she is betraying us now with her Brexit means Brexit rigidity.

Her excellent speech back then clearly demonstrates that we absolutely should remain in the EU and should discount the very marginal advisory referendum result. That didn't amount to any clear directive to parliament, leaving government free to make the best decision, as they always should have done.
.
 

oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
32,613
80
could it be because NATO is led by our American allies (who happens to speak the same language) and we trust them more than the EU's army led by Germans, French and Italians?
Well there has to a some reason for us to trust a nation that made a fortune out of us in both world wars and only came in on our side when it thought ithe money it loaned wouldn't get paid if we lost, and it was so trustworthy it developed Plan Red before the Second World war.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_Plan_Red.
On Balance i think you are right, it's easier for them to order us about using their own language.( and we are easily led)
 
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Fingers

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 9, 2016
3,373
1,552
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The difference between the factions here?
Here's Simple Guide for those lacking the ability to assimilate Factual information

Remainers ...............Lions needing leadership
leavers.......................Donkeys led by Hyenas

Zing!

You really should think about writing for a living when you grow up. You nail it everytime! Funny and good spelling too. Over a million views on here and counting! Lol.

Wait a minute you are 11 years old aren’t you? You’re over 70 you say?

How embarrassing. I’m cringing for you.

The countdown to a hard Brexit has begun I can see why your sh*tting your pants more than usual today.

Nurse!
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
32,613
80
Zing!

You really should think about writing for a livingwhen you grow up. You nail it everytime! Funny and good spelling too. Over a million views on here and counting! Lol.

Wait a minute you are 11 years old aren’t you? You’re over 70 you say?

How embarrassing. I’m cringing for you.

The countdown to a hard Brexit has begun I can see why your shitting your pants more than usual today.

Nurse!
Ah! "the donkey strikes back" Hard Brexit? excellent idea! you have no idea how much I'm looking forward to that, have you?
Imagine how popular people like you are going to be after a no deal Brexit when people are struggling and they realise you voted for it!
 
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Fingers

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 9, 2016
3,373
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Ah! "the donkey strikes back" Hard Brexit? excellent idea! you have no idea how much I'm looking forward to that, have you?
Imagine how popular people like you are going to be after a no deal Brexit when people are struggling and they realise you voted for it!

Page after page, post after post of garbage from you. The difference is you are the opposite of click bait.

Out of the 80 or so bits of drivel you have posted over the weekend I’ve pretty much ignored them all as do most normal folk. Tom the Liar will say he reads all your posts. But you can’t trust him.

You’re just writing this nonsense and children level insults for your own amusement.

It’s a semblance of a life I suppose....

Nurse!
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
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Page after page, post after post of garbage from you. The difference is you are the opposite of click bait.

Out of the 80 or so bits of drivel you have posted over the weekend I’ve pretty much ignored them all as do most normal folk. Tom the Liar will say he reads all your posts. But you can’t trust him.

You’re just writing this nonsense and children level insults for your own amusement.

It’s a semblance of a life I suppose....

Nurse!
Still waiting for your nurse?
Where is your claim that Brexit will be beneficial?
 
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oldgroaner

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 15, 2015
23,461
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My claim?

What are you dribbling on about? I voted out. That’s my claim.
Is that all? so you haven't any reason to come on here as you cant think why you did it.......
And you think it's clever to put a funny icon against a letter telling a woman in America that effectively she has to die for being too poor.

Now what kind of scum would do such a thing as laugh at someone in that situation?

The people you support that offered you Brexit want the same health care system here, are you that thick that you imagine that isn't coming here because people like you voted for Brexit?
Once again, apart from wanting to make yourself look idiotic, why do you come on here?
What are you going to get out of Brexit?
 
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Fingers

Esteemed Pedelecer
Feb 9, 2016
3,373
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Is that all? so you haven't any reason to come on here as you cant think why you did it.......
And you think it's clever to put a funny icon against a letter telling a woman in America that effectively she has to die for being too poor.

Now what kind of scum would do such a thing as laugh at someone in that situation?

The people you support that offered you Brexit want the same health care system here, are you that thick that you imagine that isn't coming here because people like you voted for Brexit?
Once again, apart from wanting to make yourself look idiotic, why do you come on here?
What are you going to get out of Brexit?

The funny was not about some random person you idiot. Although I have no idea if she is real and if she is then I suggest the people that post said image of a private letter containing extremely personal information such as her name, private address and medical condition are the true scum. Or maybe just dangerous idiots. Either way to post something so personal in a public forum is reckless at best. You are just a stupid and ignorant old man and I doubt you gave it a second thought but if that was an address in the UK you could be arrested. Fool. You also leave the owners of this forum up to being arrested had this been a UK address.

If anyone on here was so minded they now have all the details required to create an identity and use it for extremely nefarious purposes. You really are dumb and stupidity isn’t a defence in the eyes of the law.

I hope you have learnt something today.

The lol icon was a chuckle at how muddled your thinking and how despairing and desperate your argument has become.

For shame.
 

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