Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldtom]

So, at the Cabinet meeting, May declared, 'Listen up guys; we're really struggling to carry this 'Brexit charade along now so any idea as to how we can improve our image and get some really positive PR?'

Her Foreign Secretary piped up, 'Look, the NHS lie worked a treat before the referendum so why don't we just get the media to publish an even bigger lie - the more outrageous the better?'

Joseph Goebbels would be proud!

Tom

 

[Woosh]

I'm watching Marr interviewing TM on the 3.4% real term increase for the NHS. TM was asked if this money comes from the brexit dividend.
Her answer is a feeble yes. She subsequently attempted to qualify that yes by 'we haven't left yet'. I can understand the qui pro quo of brexit dividend in 2023 but that is assuming we would leave without a deal to get that dividend and the cost of funding the 40 or so new agencies to replace the EU's ones is nil. That's simply does not add up.

 

[oldtom]

I'm watching Marr interviewing TM on the 3.4% real term increase for the NHS. TM was asked if this money comes from the brexit dividend.
Her answer is a feeble yes. She subsequently attempted to qualify that yes by 'we haven't left yet'. I can understand the qui pro quo of brexit dividend in 2023 but that is assuming we would leave without a deal to get that dividend and the cost of funding the 40 or so new agencies to replace the EU's ones is nil. That's simply does not add up.

Peston has also examined the arithmetic and draws a similar conclusion:



Robert Peston
1 hr ·

Three points on what the prime minister has today revealed on the planned NHS spending increase that she will set out in detail tomorrow.

1) A rise of £20bn “real” over five years implies annual increments of 3.7% - which takes us back roughly to where spending was before the Blair/Brown bonanza from 2002 to 2010. But the pressures of an ageing population were much less then. The extra money is no bonanza for the NHS.

2) The idea of a Brexit dividend, as articulated by the PM today, is dubious. UK growth has slowed significantly since the Brexit vote, at a time when global growth has significantly accelerated. If this does not represent a Brexit drag on growth, it is very difficult to know what it is. And UK growth is forecast, even by the government, to limp along at 1 to 1.5% for years to come, a cut of roughly a third from pre-Brexit forecasts. Lower growth cuts tax revenues more than we pay net to the EU budget.

3) To remind you, our net contribution to the EU budget, after money we get back from the EU in various forms, is nearer £150m a week than the £350m that was on the bus. So even if you believe the reduction in UK economic growth is temporary and that there really will be a Brexit dividend, the PM’s promise of £600m extra in cash for the NHS in 2023/24 still means our taxes and government borrowing are set to rise by £450m a week.

Tom

 

[oldtom]

Vox Political has captured the moment beautifully in their lampoon of Sir Christopher Chope:



The article is here: the-conservatives-are-now-the-party-of-upskirting

Tom

 

[Woosh]

So even if you believe the reduction in UK economic growth is temporary and that there really will be a Brexit dividend, the PM’s promise of £600m extra in cash for the NHS in 2023/24 still means our taxes and government borrowing are set to rise by £450m a week.

it seems that TM is preparing for fresh GE, announcing her plan to spend the money we won't have.

 

[Woosh]

I picked this comment from a Guardian reader today:

"what will come of this reality, in light of the fact that the two overwhelmingly dominant reasons for people voting leave were, second, immigration, and first, a gormless, bottomlessly sad belief in “the principle that decisions about the UK should be taken in the UK" (i.e. that sociopathic government policy is somehow more tolerable - even, unaccountably, acceptable - when the dull-eyed talking head announcing it on the TV has a picture of the Queen behind them instead of a blue flag with stars on)?

What will come is a spiralling descent into squalid patriotic scaremongering, targeting immigrants (and almost certainly the children and grandchildren of immigrants - the ones who can't hide the fact, if you know what I mean). This will emerge as the only way in which even a best-case Brexit scenario can be sold to those whose lives and communities will, as a consequence of Brexit, simply be sucked dry of hope at an even faster rate."

 

[oldtom]

I picked this comment from a Guardian reader today:

"what will come of this reality, in light of the fact that the two overwhelmingly dominant reasons for people voting leave were, second, immigration, and first, a gormless, bottomlessly sad belief in “the principle that decisions about the UK should be taken in the UK" (i.e. that sociopathic government policy is somehow more tolerable - even, unaccountably, acceptable - when the dull-eyed talking head announcing it on the TV has a picture of the Queen behind them instead of a blue flag with stars on)?

What will come is a spiralling descent into squalid patriotic scaremongering, targeting immigrants (and almost certainly the children and grandchildren of immigrants - the ones who can't hide the fact, if you know what I mean). This will emerge as the only way in which even a best-case Brexit scenario can be sold to those whose lives and communities will, as a consequence of Brexit, simply be sucked dry of hope at an even faster rate."

Nicely put by that Guardian reader, I'd say!

Tom

 

[oldtom]

If this is really how the intervention took place, serious questions need to be addressed in parliament in regard to such obstruction, not to mention the filibustering that frequently accompanies the tactic:



Tom

 

[oyster]

If this is really how the intervention took place, serious questions need to be addressed in parliament in regard to such obstruction, not to mention the filibustering that frequently accompanies the tactic:

Tom

As I have mentioned before, one medicine I know of now costs around £253 for 28 tablets - whereas in Greece the same medicine (different make) costs about 1.2 euros, and even in Germany another different make is around 30 euros for 100 tablets.

If I need that medicine and am expected to make a co-payment, is there any reasonable basis for expecting a huge dollop simply because the NHS has repeatedly proved itself unable to procure efficiently and cost-effectively?

Even if the co-payment is limited as a percentage of cost, as a cap on maximum amount, thus perhaps never being more than £10 or whatever, why should I ever actually be asked for more than the cost that the NHS could achieve, if it had the will and political drive?

Further, for this and other related medicines, changes of make should be checked by repeated blood tests because the medicines are not bio-equivalent. Where is the fairness of people possibly having to make co-payments simply because the NHS is unable and/or unwilling to ensure continued receipt of the same make, month after month?

Finally, what if the cost of charging co-payments actually ends up higher than the amount brought in? The only likely upshot of that would to be increase the co-payments from what might appear justifiable to an inflated amount down to the bureaucracy involved.

In years to come, the first call on people's estates will be the cost of their PM. :

 

[Woosh]

Finally, what if the cost of charging co-payments actually ends up higher than the amount brought in? The only likely upshot of that would to be increase the co-payments from what might appear justifiable to an inflated amount down to the bureaucracy involved.

we already have co-payment: the prescription charge for example. We also have partially privatised the NHS. How many of us have to go for private dental treatments? If you need an operation, someone will come along soon enough to whisper in your ears 'can you afford to go private?'
In France, co-payments are usually covered by your health insurance. Their apparent effect is fewer people are treated for obesity related illnesses or ride electric scooters.

 

[oyster]

we already have co-payment: the prescription charge for example.

"We", of course, being those in England.

Ironically, the medicines I referred to are almost 100% prescribed to people eligible for Medex exemption certificates in England because the medicines are for disorders identified for exemption. So any change to a co-payment system could represent a wholesale shift.

 

[tillson]

Theresa May is one of those women who sets aside one of her spare bedrooms and fills it full of dolls and teddybears, each dressed in a carefully selected and individual costume. She goes to the spare room every evening to sit amongst her dolls and teddies to eat chocolate and cry. Gradually, with each mouthful of chocolate, her self loathing and disgust builds until she is consumed by uncontrollable rage. At this point she would normally go out into the street to throw cats passers by and scream obscenities at them, but the police have put a stop to it. As a consequence, May has now focused her anger and frustration on the British people. Driven by spite and vengefulness, she is determined to inflict as much harm as she can on the country and its people. Hosing money that we don’t have down the wide bore NHS drain is just the start of her campaign of hatred.

 

[oldtom]

Theresa May is one of those women who sets aside one of her spare bedrooms and fills it full of dolls and teddybears, each dressed in a carefully selected and individual costume. She goes to the spare room every evening to sit amongst her dolls and teddies to eat chocolate and cry. Gradually, with each mouthful of chocolate, her self loathing and disgust builds until she is consumed by uncontrollable rage. At this point she would normally go out into the street to throw cats passers by and scream obscenities at them, but the police have put a stop to it. As a consequence, May has now focused her anger and frustration on the British people. Driven by spite and vengefulness, she is determined to inflict as much harm as she can on the country and its people. Hosing money that we don’t have down the wide bore NHS drain is just the start of her campaign of hatred.

Very descriptive 'Tillson' - that conjures up some glorious images! I think we have to bear in mind though that Mrs May, in regard to her part-time job, really is doing her very best.......yes, she deserves to be rewarded for services to mediocrity - A* material!

Tom

 

[oldtom]

Loved this image from a disgruntled citizen of East Anglia:


Tom

 

[tommie]

"We", of course, being those in England.

Ironically, the medicines I referred to are almost 100% prescribed to people eligible for Medex exemption certificates in England because the medicines are for disorders identified for exemption. So any change to a co-payment system could represent a wholesale shift.

What`s this `co-payment` `prescription charges` thing??

Never heard of them! No one here has paid for prescriptions for 20 years or more..

What third world country are you living in?? !!

 

[flecc]

We also have partially privatised the NHS. How many of us have to go for private dental treatments?

And cataract surgery if one wants to have excellent eyesight afterwards, something the NHS won't offer. Their decades out of date methods give under average eyesight at best and still the need for reading glasses.
.

 

[flecc]

What`s this `co-payment` `prescription charges` thing??

Never heard of them! No one here has paid for prescriptions for 20 years or more..

Hardly surprising that we still have to pay them in England after all the subsudies we've been giving Northern Ireland and Scotland over the years.

If you like we can stop those and get rid of our prescription charges.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

Hardly surprising that we still have to pay them in England after all the subsudies we've been giving Northern Ireland and Scotland over the years.

If you like we can stop those and get rid of our prescription charges.
.

In fact we could ditch Northern Ireland and give the money to the NHS? that would solve two problems for the Breiteers!

 

[tommie]

Hardly surprising that we still have to pay them in England after all the subsudies we've been giving Northern Ireland and Scotland over the years.
If you like we can stop those and get rid of our prescription charges.
.

Tad condescending that don`t you think?

Care to expand on this `We`ve`?? You`re beginning to sound like the rest of us should be thankful to some charitable institution in london or wherever.

So the rest of us in UK don`t contribute to that same treasury, the rest of us exist tax free do we??

So we don`t contribute,..... so when the next war comes along you`won`t be grovelling around for volunteers from the men and women of Scotland, Wales and N.I. to give their lives then?

Not to mention down on your knees begging the good ole USA to come along and bail you out after you made another international faux pas

Think your debt lies with Scotland, NI, Wales etc not vice-versa

 

[oldgroaner]

So we don`t contribute,..... so when the next war comes along you`won`t be grovelling around for volunteers from the men and women of Scotland, Wales and N.I. to give their lives then?

Interesting logic you have there,

On the one hand if you don't have prescription charges it follows that you must be contributing less.

And on the other no one "grovells for Volunteers" central government asks politely then simply conscripts those they require.

And how many are stupid enough to volunteer to "Give their lives" they expect to come back in one piece, or are they all Kamikazes?

Finally do you really think the Americans would have stepped in at our request in if three things hadn't have happened?

1. Japan attacked Pearl Harour and declared war on them.
   
2. Hitler declared war too
   
3. We were obviously not going to represent a good investment much longer as the money was long gone.

They were quite prepared to let us fight their wars for them till then, and we are stupid enough to still do so even today.