Bosch performance motor error 500 and taking online purchased bike to a local bike shop.

[Mazvol]

I bought a Scott E-Aspect MTB that has the Bosch performance motor online just over a year ago , it was an ex demo from a large chain of bike shops who sell many makes and models.

Until December last year it was totally reliable and fun to use but over the last few weeks the motor has got progressively bad at turning on. Removing the battery and pressing the reset button, cleaning the contacts on the plug points and Intuvia headset for 5 or 10 minutes and it would come back to life and be no problem on a ride but go to use it the next day and the same thing would happen.

This week the Intuvia displayed error 500 which as far as I can find out is a motor fault of unspecified cause and the motor did not kick in. When turning the cranks there is no noise or play to suggest bearing failure and the changing speed is displayed on the screen.

As I replaced the drive sprocket a few months previously I was able to remove it and the plastic covers to look inside. Apart from the 3 plugs for the headset,battery pack and speed sensor which I unplugged and checked the connections for being clean ,secure and dry , there is nothing much else to see or do.

At this point I decided to find a local bike shop that sells e-bike and see if they could fix it or send it back to Bosch for a replacement. I live in Devon and sent the same email to 4 local shops asking for help and the replys were not consistent.

They all offered to try and clear the fault , run the Bosch diagnostic software and update the software on the Intuvia headset as there has been one for it and do an e-bike service circa £65 which I thought was okay as I would not mind a print out of its history etc.

As for fixing the motor and a timescale to getting a working bike back, no chance of a date, just leave it with us attitude and the feeling once you do your stuck with them and how much to expect on the final bill is anyone's guess.

One bike shop said unless I go back to the original retailer it would not be classed as a Bosch warranty job and another said they only do Bosch warranty on bikes they sell. The others said to bring proof of purchase and as a Bosch diagnostic center they would handle the repair or replacement provided I had a proof of purchase.

As an online customer and first time e-bike owner I found it unsettling that after I took my bike to the nearest one ,who have great reviews it became clear that the repair side of things is not straight forward.

Having been a production engineer for many years the process of gaining access to the motor , removing 3 plugs and a few bolts to take it out is very simple. And the same goes for plugging in a laptop and running diagnostic software to update the system or display a fault - anyone with a little training could do it.

What I want to know is - after checking the software is the latest and apart from clearing a fault and hoping it does not come back what else can be fixed on the bike by these Bosch diagnostic centers or are they a fancy name for doing nothing relevant to repairing my bike.

Only 4 components in the Bosch system the Intuvia display, battery ,speed sensor and motor, if after trying the headset and battery on another bike or swapping out the components and finding the bike works normally and the HMI on the faulty bike displays the speed changing when manually turning the pedals it only leaves the motor or cable damage.

If local bike shops are not allowed to open them to further diagnose then I can see why there is such a cloud of mystery around them and why I cannot find what triggers Error 500 in any detail is frustrating.

I wonder why do all these local bike shops not stock replacement motors and instead make customers wait indefinitely for one to be sent back to Germany and a replacement sent out. And £600 for an out of warranty replacement is not something they advertise.

Error codes are built into many pieces of equipment from industrial robots to cars and most point you to what or where the fault originates, so why do we have to pay for the LBS to diagnose a fault that is displayed on the screen when it points to a motor which they are not allowed to touch.

If your car engine management light comes on you have no idea what it means until the garage plug in a portable fault reader , get a code number and look it up and say No 50 means your oxygen sensor has failed and that's £40 please for the info and £40 for the sensor and £40 fitting.
If you told them to fit the sensor as the car computer displayed sensor failure you would save the £40 diagnostic charge.

I spoke to a mechanic while waiting for the counter staff. His view was we don't sell Scott bikes ,you need a Scott dealer to sort it out, then it was the Bosch service center only spoke German and it was a nightmare communicating with them and that they shouldn't be allowed to sell the motors as he seen so many less than 2 years stop working. At this point I nearly left to try another shop but the counter staff returned and were all smiles and reassured me they would try and fix the problem by updating the software and running the diagnostic software, if that didn't work provided the motor was less than 2 years old, all I would have to pay would be postage to send the motor back to Bosch and the fitting of the new motor which is £40 per hour for e- bikes.

I left the bike with them and the original sales receipt which did not say ex- demo bike but Internet price match price next to the sales total.

After leaving I then realised that even though I have only had the bike 13 months , it was a 2016 model and I have no idea how old exactly the motor is or whether it is classed as 2nd user.

And lastly I think there must be a lot of people of all ages and incomes who have no idea how potentially expensive an e- bike is when it goes wrong and the 2 years warranty expires.

Anyone had similar experience or advice?

 

[soundwave]

if the motor is under 2 years old then it can be sent back to bosch for a replacement whether it is 2nd hand or not if they sell bosch motor bikes then they can get a warranty replacement.

why ebike dealers say no because you never bought the bike from them or it is 2nd hand is up to them i guess so just dont use them.

pcg in germany will take over the motor warranty if it has any left just you pay postage and fit it ur self, not hard 10 min job.

no dealers can fix motors because there are like no parts other than bearings that can be replaced.

even if you want a new motor they need the old one back b4 they can sell you one thus why none in stock.

you also cant change motors even if you buy a new one.

 

[Wander]

Why not get the dealer you bought it from to repair it under warranty?

 

[Denis99]

I had a very similar frustrating experience.
Bought a Bosch powered ebike online, after about 2 months and 500 miles I had alot of motor reliability issues.

Error codes, motor cutting out, then coming back on, etc.

Long story, but the online shop were quite a distance away from me, but very helpful in getting in touch with the UK Bosch rep.

Eventually, Bosch sorted out a local dealer for me to visit to have them look at the issue(s).
The shop were friendly enough to me, but did grumble about the fact that I wasn't one of their customers, despite me having bought a spare 500w bosch battery from them.....

The bike was fixed, still wasn't clear what they didd apart from software updating etc.

Worked for a month or so, then failed again with all the same error codes......

Eventually the original bike shop sorted me out, but it took a long time with alot of phone calls , and obviously no bike to ride.

For me, I wouldn't buy a bike online again.

Have bought a Trek Commuter 9 ebike from a local dealer and has been fine so far.

I think the bike dealer network need to wake up to what customers want in this day and age though.

Its difficult for customers who are looking for a bargain. Online shops are under cutting some local shops , and thats where the problem starts.

A good bike shop with proper support is worth paying a bit more for.

I won't be buying online distance again, in fact, this was the first and only time.

 

[Mazvol]

Why not get the dealer you bought it from to repair it under warranty?

I bought online and dealer is 250 miles away

 

[Mazvol]

I had a very similar frustrating experience.
Bought a Bosch powered ebike online, after about 2 months and 500 miles I had alot of motor reliability issues.

Error codes, motor cutting out, then coming back on, etc.

Long story, but the online shop were quite a distance away from me, but very helpful in getting in touch with the UK Bosch rep.

Eventually, Bosch sorted out a local dealer for me to visit to have them look at the issue(s).
The shop were friendly enough to me, but did grumble about the fact that I wasn't one of their customers, despite me having bought a spare 500w bosch battery from them.....

The bike was fixed, still wasn't clear what they didd apart from software updating etc.

Worked for a month or so, then failed again with all the same error codes......

Eventually the original bike shop sorted me out, but it took a long time with alot of phone calls , and obviously no bike to ride.

For me, I wouldn't buy a bike online again.

Have bought a Trek Commuter 9 ebike from a local dealer and has been fine so far.

I think the bike dealer network need to wake up to what customers want in this day and age though.

Its difficult for customers who are looking for a bargain. Online shops are under cutting some local shops , and thats where the problem starts.

A good bike shop with proper support is worth paying a bit more for.

I won't be buying online distance again, in fact, this was the first and only time.

 

[anotherkiwi]

If I was to buy another bike I have quite a few choices of dealers within a 50 km radius but none of them sell what I want... I could of course go to the LBS and ask them to order one and negotiate their margin with the manufacturer I suppose but I wouldn't pay above list price for the privilege.

 

[Mazvol]

I think it is a learning curve first time your e-bike breaks down. Already I am not sure I made the right choice of which bike shop to take my bike to. The one I went to have a very good reputation for customer service and going above and beyond but it is clear that I am the first customer who has brought in a bike not supplied by them and a brand not stocked by them. The leave it with us about a week ,the workshop is very busy was a bit vague for my liking but also a good sign they are in demand.

Since then another local e- bike seller who does sell Scott e-bike has got back to me and said to bring it in and they will fix it no problem type of message.

Its a bit like finding a local garage you trust to fix your car when you don't know the area.

At least if you buy online you can pick who repairs your bike , half the battle is being unsure what to do the first time and with the bike shops having limited experience it is a leap of faith who to choose.

 

[Denis99]

I don't know where this situation is leading to though.

There is an increasing trend for manufacturers to sell direct to the public now.

If there are any warranty claims then how will they be resolved to the customers satisfaction?

There are some unstated demands that the customer has, it isn't unreasonable to expect timely repair or replacement really.

Local bike shops could soon just be places where bikes are serviced and maintained, with manufacturers selling direct.

 

[wheeliepete]

You don't mention getting in touch with the dealer that sold you the bike. they maybe really helpful, or not, but got to be worth a call. They may be able to hook you up with a local dealer through the Bosch service centre, as in Denis99's case.

 

[flecc]

I don't know where this situation is leading to though.

There is an increasing trend for manufacturers to sell direct to the public now.

If there are any warranty claims then how will they be resolved to the customers satisfaction?

There are some unstated demands that the customer has, it isn't unreasonable to expect timely repair or replacement really.

Local bike shops could soon just be places where bikes are serviced and maintained, with manufacturers selling direct.

Where crank drive units are concerned, only Panasonic have got this aspect anything like right.

Firstly both series of unit have been far more reliable than any of the others, so a good starting point.

Second, a failure within two years mean an automatic warranty new replacement unit with no need to send the old one back.

Third, any failure beyond two years means buying a replacement unit since they are not repairable and no spares are available. Sounds harsh, but since they are very reliable the incidence of this is very low. The units usually run for many years without fault and there are many originals up to 15 years old still running well.

Fourth, for the most part they've partnered with makes that give good dealer service. For example for their first six years here almost all their units were on Giant bikes and any Giant hybrid dealer would carry out warranty work or software updates, regardless of where the bike was bought. In remoter areas where the only Giant dealer wasn't a hybrid (e-bike) one, they would still carry out the work under the guidance of Giant with any equipment necessary for that sent to the dealer on loan FOC.
.

 

[footpump]

mazvol how many miles has the bike done?
I too bought a bosch powered ebike ex dem 2016 in may last year
but my main thoughts were cost of battery replacement not the moter.

bike has only done 315miles , as I have another ebike so I could find myself out of moter warrenty, and if its £600 for a new one is just not viable.

 

[Wander]

I bought online and dealer is 250 miles away

A good dealer 250 miles away would still sort out your problems.

Classic case of buying online, cheap, ex demo, price match etc. & giving the lion's share of any profit to that dealer then being surprised when other dealers aren't too interested with doing the unprofitable warranty work.

Accepted people don't know and it's a harsh lesson to learn. People often expect the same sort of service that they get from car dealers, however it's better to think of the situation more in line with electrical equipment purchases.

How many of us would buy cheap etc. then expect the small local independent electrical retailer / engineer to sorry out any warranty problems?

 

[Denis99]

Not always the case though.

I wanted a particular bike, couldn't find it anywhere locally, so bought online as it was available and in stock.

The shop was really good throughout the whole episode, and would recommend them.

The problem was the lack of resolve for the problem(s).
The bike manufacturer blamed Bosch, and Bosch said it was the manufacturers fault.

I just wanted it resolved.

 

[Wicky]

Be prepared to spend the money to get it fixed, that you initially saved at the outset.

I was in a similar postion by buying here from Tom @KTM from many miles away an ex-demo KTM P eRace (with warranty) at a very good price. Thankfully the only thing that needed doing in the 1st year was a new rear rim for gratis that was posted to me and rebuilt (at my cost) by a local bike shop. Almost 4 years later its still going strong with no problems.

 

[Mazvol]

mazvol how many miles has the bike done?
I too bought a bosch powered ebike ex dem 2016 in may last year
but my main thoughts were cost of battery replacement not the moter.

bike has only done 315miles , as I have another ebike so I could find myself out of moter warranty, and if its £600 for a new one is just not viable.

The bikes done 1800 miles and from what I have found out so far, about the error 500 is that there is a good chance the software can fix it, having worked on plc controlled machines for many years this does not surprise me as I have come across software glitches that have stopped machines running long after installation and the simple resetting of a counter ,timer or update fixes it.

 

[Mazvol]

Why not get the dealer you bought it from to repair it under warranty?

The dealer is a long way away as I bought online, to source a box and courier could be done but expensive as I think the weight of the box may put it into the 2 man delivery price both ways.

These days everyone buys on the Internet , cars , kitchen appliances etc and they don't think to send things back even under warranty - they get a locally trained person to fix breakdowns. Bosch is apparently training local bike shops all over the UK to do this work , it will be a good money maker for the shops and once the early gremlins are worked out I think the situation will improve.

 

[Mazvol]

A good dealer 250 miles away would still sort out your problems.

Classic case of buying online, cheap, ex demo, price match etc. & giving the lion's share of any profit to that dealer then being surprised when other dealers aren't too interested with doing the unprofitable warranty work.

Accepted people don't know and it's a harsh lesson to learn. People often expect the same sort of service that they get from car dealers, however it's better to think of the situation more in line with electrical equipment purchases.

How many of us would buy cheap etc. then expect the small local independent electrical retailer / engineer to sorry out any warranty problems?[/QUOTE

I would say the people who buy their bikes in a sale and at the lowest online price are smart and I apply that logic to all consumer goods

. Many ebike like ordinary MTB are sold off cheaper when the next year's model comes out that's always been the case and even in sales we are talking in the thousands so your definition of cheap does not make sense to me especially when your talking about Bosch who are a premium equipment supplier.

Regardless of where you purchase your bike you should be able to take it to a local bike shop to be serviced and get the same level of service as someone who bought direct from the shop or am I missing something.

As for not making much on warranty I strongly disagree, where I live in Devon prices are a lot lower than in the larger towns and cities of the UK but e-bike servicing and warranty is good money, the written quotes I have had - they charge £40 - to plug in a laptop and clear a fault, update software and give you a printout - not bad for 10 mins, to remove a motor which I could do in 15 mins is £40 plus extra for the p&p back to Bosch and same again when refitted. So compared to doing a job on a regular bike I reckon they would be working a lot longer to make that sort of profit.

 

[Wander]

I would say the people who buy their bikes in a sale and at the lowest online price are smart and I apply that logic to all consumer goods

. Many ebike like ordinary MTB are sold off cheaper when the next year's model comes out that's always been the case and even in sales we are talking in the thousands so your definition of cheap does not make sense to me especially when your talking about Bosch who are a premium equipment supplier.

Regardless of where you purchase your bike you should be able to take it to a local bike shop to be serviced and get the same level of service as someone who bought direct from the shop or am I missing something.

As for not making much on warranty I strongly disagree, where I live in Devon prices are a lot lower than in the larger towns and cities of the UK but e-bike servicing and warranty is good money, the written quotes I have had - they charge £40 - to plug in a laptop and clear a fault, update software and give you a printout - not bad for 10 mins, to remove a motor which I could do in 15 mins is £40 plus extra for the p&p back to Bosch and same again when refitted. So compared to doing a job on a regular bike I reckon they would be working a lot longer to make that sort of profit.

Completely understand what you are saying & where you are coming from.

Unfortunately it displays your naivety about how the bike industry is set up & works.

 

[Denis99]

The bike industry needs to adapt to current customers needs.

There is nothing naive about a customer wanting to buy a product and expect good service.

In general, the cycle industry has its head buried in the sand. It needs to adapt to changing demands and expectations. I'm old enough to know what happens if manufacturers fail to recognise change.

It needs to change.