Bike Europe draws attention to illegal tuning kits

[Gubbins]

If E-Bikes encourage more people to ditch their cars for bikes, will the lost revenue from car tax and fuel duty encourage the "think tanks" to find a way to claw it back? The current low petrol prices and low emission cars are having some effect already.....

 

[Twangman]

Col I live and cycle all over London but very raley see other ebike riders, we are not a common sight. Tell me what is the total market share of e bikes in the UK compared to the sale of regular bikes? Of total E Bikes sold what is the average age range, how many are bought by people with mobility issues,
What plans have the trade to grow the market?

 

[flecc]

E-bike sales in Britain have been around one percent or a bit less of the total bike sales for about a decade now.

In The Netherlands where they are not concerned about the assist speed limit it's typically 12% of total bike sales and has peaked higher.

So they have had no difficulty in growing the market.

The market restriction in Britain is simply the lack of popularity of cycling, those who don't cycle don't adopt e-bikes. Any notion that Britains commonly anti-bike motorists are going to rush to adopt e-bikes if they are made a bit faster is sheer fantasy.
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[Artstu]

The market restriction in Britain is simply the lack of popularity of cycling, those who don't cycle don't adopt e-bikes. Any notion that Britains commonly anti-bike motorists are going to rush to adopt e-bikes if they are made a bit faster is sheer fantasy.

You've just identified the potential buyer of a faster e-bike, the cyclist who wants an easier commute to work. Current e-bikes don't meet that need for nearly all seasoned cyclists being for the most part slower.

and the very people who would be happy with the speed of an e-bike as you say, aren't going to choose one over driving a car.

On the other hand I imagine a lot of healthy cycle commuters are too image conscience to be seen riding an e-bike.

Either way it seems both types of potential user will take some persuading.

 

[D8ve]

I disagree Artsu.
In urban areas ( where the majority live) cycling is significantly faster that cars during the rush hour and often at other times too.
Ie 15 mins or half an hour for me

 

[flecc]

You've just identified the potential buyer of a faster e-bike, the cyclist who wants an easier commute to work. Current e-bikes don't meet that need for nearly all seasoned cyclists being for the most part slower.

Precisely, what's the point! Since they are cycling anyway, why would a politician not be happy as things stand.

Converting to a fast e-bike doesn't in any way ease the roads situation or increase cycling, it only benefits one part of a trade against another part.
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[trex]

...
Converting to a fast e-bike doesn't in any way ease the roads situation or increase cycling, it only benefits one part of a trade against another part.
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the guy who is after a fast e-bike (e.g. cwah) wouldn't want to buy from Col anyway, Col loses nothing. The customer will most likely get an s-pedelec or do a conversion.
Most people who buy e-bikes are pensioners buying for leisure ride or campers/caravanners. I reckon two thirds of them want a throttle, another item that is going to be rarer than hens' teeth in a couple of years.

 

[Gubbins]

I disagree Artsu.
In urban areas ( where the majority live) cycling is significantly faster that cars during the rush hour and often at other times too.
Ie 15 mins or half an hour for me

Me too...
My sometimes twice daily post office run is 2.2 miles each way 8 or 9 minutes on the e-bike each way, with 5 minutes in the shop gets me back home in just over 20. In the car it's just not possible and on a bad day it can be 45 minutes. .

 

[Artstu]

I disagree Artsu.
In urban areas ( where the majority live) cycling is significantly faster that cars during the rush hour and often at other times too.
Ie 15 mins or half an hour for me

I never said cycling in an urban area was slower ? but I did say Current e-bikes don't meet that need for nearly all seasoned cyclists being for the most part slower.

Obviously there will be cyclists like yourself who disagree of course.

The point I was making was that one potential market isn't catered for, how big or small that market is I've no idea.

 

[selrahc1992]

I never said cycling in an urban area was slower ? but I did say Current e-bikes don't meet that need for nearly all seasoned cyclists being for the most part slower.

Obviously there will be cyclists like yourself who disagree of course.

The point I was making was that one potential market isn't catered for, how big or small that market is I've no idea.

i was cycling late home last night - slowly because it was freezing, anything over 12 mph felt it could cause frostbite. however, it was great to have more than nett 250W for bursts up very hills. i think pedelec power works best when similar to a car's: its great to have up to a kilowatt for the occasional hills while carrying thirty kg, it doesnt mean one wants to rip across pavements at 50mph

 

[JohnCade]

I never said cycling in an urban area was slower ? but I did say Current e-bikes don't meet that need for nearly all seasoned cyclists being for the most part slower.

Obviously there will be cyclists like yourself who disagree of course.

The point I was making was that one potential market isn't catered for, how big or small that market is I've no idea.

It depends on the terrain and the bike. On a fairly hilly commute a strong cyclist should be faster on an e bike than on an unassisted one. If the bike is a good one that pedals well past the cut out it will be even faster. Since a strong cyclist can then go almost as fast on the flat once it's rolling as he can on an unassisted commuter bike, and of course go uphill a lot faster.

 

[SRS]

the guy who is after a fast e-bike (e.g. cwah) wouldn't want to buy from Col anyway, Col loses nothing. The customer will most likely get an s-pedelec or do a conversion.
Most people who buy e-bikes are pensioners buying for leisure ride or campers/caravanners. I reckon two thirds of them want a throttle, another item that is going to be rarer than hens' teeth in a couple of years.

I think that it may be the pre pensioners that wish to go faster. ie those that need to get to and from work quickly.
Most pensioners seem to have all day to potter so speed is probably not an issue. As far as the future of throttles, I think mobility scooters are to keep theirs.

 

[flecc]

I think that it may be the pre pensioners that wish to go faster. ie those that need to get to and from work quickly.

Yes, it's definitely the British commuters who are the main drivers of the demand for higher assist speed. And it really is just a British thing, commuting in the European cycling countries being very different in character as all the videos show. I've thought long and hard about the possible reasons for this, but always conclude that the British attitude that cycling is primarily a sporting pursuit is the cause.

Fast club cyclists, aka lycras, don't ride or want e-bikes and utility and leisure e-bikers don't really need it so their demand for higher assist speeds is low.
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[trex]

it's kind of ironic isn't it that the most active cyclists are those who commute 20-30 miles a day, they do hell a lot more miles than the weekend lycra types and yet, our goverment would not want to see them as representatives of cycling - they'd rather see the lycras. The general attitude of LBSes is to carry sporty looking machines with eye wateringly high price tags so they can offer 'deals'. Of course they look good in their windows but do they suit the majority? No. The majority of e-bike customers need mudguards, lights and a comfortable riding position and don't want to spend £2k on a bike.

 

[JohnCade]

Yes, it's definitely the British commuters who are the main drivers of the demand for higher assist speed. And it really is just a British thing, commuting in the European cycling countries being very different in character as all the videos show. I've thought long and hard about the possible reasons for this, but always conclude that the British attitude that cycling is primarily a sporting pursuit is the cause.

Fast club cyclists, aka lycras, don't ride or want e-bikes and utility and leisure e-bikers don't really need it so their demand for higher assist speeds is low.
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I suspect it's because British commuters travel further in general than mainland European ones, and public transport costs are higher. It's hard to park anywhere now in British cities too unless it's provided by the employer.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Pensioners need to go faster because we don't have much life left. Going faster enables us to do more before time runs out. When you're young, you have a lifetime ahead of you. Most young people wish they were older, but then one day they wake up as pensioners like us.

 

[flecc]

I suspect it's because British commuters travel further in general than mainland European ones, and public transport costs are higher. It's hard to park anywhere now in British cities too unless it's provided by the employer.

That's certainly an element, but I see the same type of grim faced, helmeted and specially clothed, fast riding among those who have shorter commutes in London. Seeing bunches of them racing along together has all the appearance of a peleton, regardless of their trip distance.

I remember when young and in the days when most of Britain cycled, my father cycling between East Bedfont and Charing Cross each day, not a short distance. Like virtually all others then, he sat upright on a utility bike, cycling at the usual circa 12 mph or less, so no different than those European cycling countries now.

The difference is that they never stopped utility cycling, we did, leaving only the residual sporting model for the future to model itself on.
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[Gubbins]

Pensioners need to go faster because we don't have much life left. Going faster enables us to do more before time runs out. When you're young, you have a lifetime ahead of you. Most young people wish they were older, but then one day they wake up as pensioners like us.

Having just passed my government age test I have finally won my much coveted prize of a monthly pension, I could also be described as a "Baby Boomer" which would make me a member of a large group that have been in employment for most of their lives, have an above average disposable income and most importantly dont feel like pensioners!!
I think that a lot of e-bike design is geriatric and seems to be aimed at the older person who perhaps needs the help or just wants to tootle about, but I for one really like the new more aggressive looking MTB machines that are probably aimed at a younger audience but are most likely bought by people like me..
I think the manufacturers are missing out here and should target my age group, but not as pensioners..... 80 year olds are now as active as 60 year olds used to be, so if 80 is the new 60, then 65 must be the new 50...

 

[VictoryV]

I remember when young and in the days when most of Britain cycled, my father cycling between East Bedfont and Charing Cross each day, not a short distance. Like virtually all others then, he sat upright on a utility bike, cycling at the usual circa 12 mph or less, so no different than those European cycling countries now.


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Describes my dad to a "T" but commuting across Liverpool. And the only colour for a bike was black.

 

[flecc]

I think that a lot of e-bike design is geriatric and seems to be aimed at the older person who perhaps needs the help or just wants to tootle about, but I for one really like the new more aggressive looking MTB machines that are probably aimed at a younger audience but are most likely bought by people like me..

Don't you think we have both Phill? Some of Haibike's models for example are hardly geriatric and to me match what you ask for, and they aren't the only make with modern designs.
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