Battery Fires

[lenny]

E-bike battery sparks Crouch End flat fire

E-bike battery sparks Crouch End flat fire

The occupants of the property managed to escape without harm

haringeycommunitypress.co.uk

 

[lenny]

Man's close call as e-bike battery explodes moments after being thrown outside

https://www.9news.com.au/national/lithiumion-battery-fires-homeowners-close-call-after-ebike-battery-explodes-into-flames/e2eab69c-f235-4bc9-a97e-a71405c2b39c

 

[lenny]

"ACT concerned at growing misconception that all e-bikes are unsafe"

Misleading reporting is damaging public perception of e-bikes says trade body

The Association of Cycle Traders (ACT) is urging fair and accurate reporting of e-bike-related news. It warns in particular increasing coverage of fires linked to unsafe products is giving rise to broader fears about the safety of all e-bikes and batteries. ACT director Jonathan Harrison said in...

ebiketips.road.cc

 

[chris_n]

Another conversion fire

Converted electric bike caused fatal Coventry fire

Investigators focus on a pedal bike converted into an electric model stored in a property's hallway.

www.bbc.com

 

[matthewslack]

Another conversion fire

Converted electric bike caused fatal Coventry fire

Investigators focus on a pedal bike converted into an electric model stored in a property's hallway.

www.bbc.com

Bike in what seems to be a shared hallway, and so a shared escape route. Shouldn't be there.

People who died are not necessarily the bike owners.

 

[Az.]

Product Recall: Canyon E-Bike Batteries (2411-0074)

Product Recall for Canyon E-Bike Batteries presenting a high risk of fire.

www.gov.uk

 

[mark sutton]

Becoming quite a risk, this subject. There's now a significant trend of bike shops being denied insurance because somehow the insurers have come to the idea that an e-bike is almost always a risk, when in fact all of the risk is coming from things that are not, in fact, e-bikes: https://www.cyclingelectric.com/news/call-for-government-to-up-pace-on-dangerous-kit-imports-or-face-existential-risk-to-cycling-industry

 

[eas2lv]

Becoming quite a risk, this subject. There's now a significant trend of bike shops being denied insurance because somehow the insurers have come to the idea that an e-bike is almost always a risk, when in fact all of the risk is coming from things that are not, in fact, e-bikes: https://www.cyclingelectric.com/news/call-for-government-to-up-pace-on-dangerous-kit-imports-or-face-existential-risk-to-cycling-industry

The state of data about ebike fires is so pathetic that its hard to make out what really causes fire. All that one hears about is charging, but there are several incidents of fire while riding.
Then articles like this make the data even murkier.

Referring to fire data apparently for 2022 , the article says
"As for the most recent data, the London Fire Brigade is again cited as a leading source. In this year, 46% or 74 of 161 fires labelled ‘e-bike’ were post-market conversions and nearly 30% of an unknown origin. 14% (29) were believed to have been manufactured goods, a lower proportion than the 36 e-scooter incidents."

When did 29/161 became 14%? Its 18%. Total doesn't add up to 100%. And, the graph for 2022 shows only ~3% for "manufactured" ebikes!

 

[mark sutton]

Windgoo B20 electric bike recalled https://www.cyclingelectric.com/news/windgoo-b20

 

[saneagle]

Windgoo B20 electric bike recalled https://www.cyclingelectric.com/news/windgoo-b20

"The product presents a risk of fire as it has been identified that when the electric bike is being charged, it is possible for the lithium-ion batteries to go into failure mode, potentially leading to a thermal runaway and fire."

That doesn't sound like whoever wrote that recall notice had a clue what they were talking about. I'm not saying that there is or isn't a problem.

 

[lenny]

TTC report suggests an alternative to banning e-bikes and scooters

The TTC board asked for a report on the equity impact of a proposed seasonal ban on low-income people and racialized groups.

“Alternatives such as public transit, manual bicycles or scooters are viewed as less economically viable, and in some cases, less convenient, potentially increasing travel costs and negatively affecting their budgets.”

"In her report, Naraine suggests rather than a complete ban, the TTC impose “specific restrictions”— similar to Metrolinx’s, which ban e-bikes with uncertified batteries but allow those with batteries displaying a UL or CE safety certification."

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/ttc-report-suggests-an-alternative-to-banning-e-bikes-and-scooters/article_24516cd8-b0bc-11ef-88da-5395fe8de90a.html

 

[eas2lv]

TTC bans e-bikes, e-scooters aboard vehicles during winter months
On Tuesday, the TTC’s Board of Commissioners voted in favour of banning e-bikes and other micromobility devices which use lithium-ion batteries during winter months over the fire risk.

The board made the move despite acknowledging that it will disproportionately affect lower-income gig workers and enforcing the new rules will be difficult to do so.

The decision means that all e-bikes and e-scooters will be banned from November 15 to April 15, effectively prohibiting the devices on board any TTC vehicle as of Tuesday.

TTC bans e-bikes, e-scooters aboard vehicles during winter months - Toronto | Globalnews.ca

The move means that all e-bikes and e-scooters will be banned from Nov. 15 to April 15, effectively prohibiting the devices on board any TTC vehicle as of Tuesday.

globalnews.ca

(The ban mentions e-scooters as well but they are already illegal in Toronto. May be because we do see plenty of e-scooters on the road, sidewalks and paths as there is no enforcement).

 

[Az.]

The decision means that all e-bikes and e-scooters will be banned from November 15 to April 15

I don't quite understand logic behind this decision. Between November 15 and April 15 there is a risk of fire and between April 16 and November 14 there is no risk of fire?

 

[eas2lv]

I don't quite understand logic behind this decision. Between November 15 and April 15 there is a risk of fire and between April 16 and November 14 there is no risk of fire?

Winters here are very different from summers. Roads are slushy with snow and salted, and the thinking appears to be that salt and water leads to more chances of electrical shorts. Unfortunately whatever data is out there on battery fires is so incomplete and of poor quality to make any conclusions. The only largish ebike battery fire in a TTC subway car happened on Dec 31, 2023 --- one data point for winter, zero for summer!

I would think of this as a compromise as a year-round ban is hard to push through the board. We were expecting a less harsh decision like requiring UL label on batteries but that was voted down probably because enforcement would be harder.

 

[harrys]

Shouldn't BMS protect battery?

Yes. A decent one will cut off charging when cells are at designed max, DIY battery builders know how that works, or they should.

Even so, quality bare cells can take overvoltage. From the Lishen 21700 cell data sheet. You can short circuit them or overcharge to 6.3V.

9.1. External Short-circuiting Test at 25 ºC
Cell fully charged per 7.1.1, is to be short circuited by connecting the positive (+) and negative (-) terminals
with a total external resistance of less than 50mohm. Stop the test when the cell voltage falls below 0.1V
and the cell case temperature has returned to a value within 10 ºC of the original testing temperature.
Criteria: No Explosion, No Fire

9.2. Overcharge Test
Cell fully charged per 7.1.1, is to be overcharged with 1.0C to 6.3V while tapering the charge current.
Charging is continued for 7 hours.Monitoring change of cell temperature during testing. Stop the test when
cell temperature decays to room temperature.
Criteria: No Explosion, No Fire

Sure, if they put in crap cells where the batteries can't pass hazmat shipping rules, overcharging will burn them up if the BMS fails,

And this goes back to the first video in this thread, where the Grin guy says good cells make for the safer batteries;.

 

[lenny]

New UK e-bike law coming in bid to tackle 'ferocious' problem

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/uk-e-bike-law-coming-160026190.html

https://bills.parliament.uk/bills/3752

 

[guerney]

Yes. A decent one will cut off charging when cells are at designed max, DIY battery builders know how that works, or they should.

Even so, quality bare cells can take overvoltage. From the Lishen 21700 cell data sheet. You can short circuit them or overcharge to 6.3V.

9.1. External Short-circuiting Test at 25 ºC
Cell fully charged per 7.1.1, is to be short circuited by connecting the positive (+) and negative (-) terminals
with a total external resistance of less than 50mohm. Stop the test when the cell voltage falls below 0.1V
and the cell case temperature has returned to a value within 10 ºC of the original testing temperature.
Criteria: No Explosion, No Fire

9.2. Overcharge Test
Cell fully charged per 7.1.1, is to be overcharged with 1.0C to 6.3V while tapering the charge current.
Charging is continued for 7 hours.Monitoring change of cell temperature during testing. Stop the test when
cell temperature decays to room temperature.
Criteria: No Explosion, No Fire

Sure, if they put in crap cells where the batteries can't pass hazmat shipping rules, overcharging will burn them up if the BMS fails,

And this goes back to the first video in this thread, where the Grin guy says good cells make for the safer batteries;.

Looking at the datasheet for the LG MH1 cells in my battery...

https://datasheet.octopart.com/INR18650-MH1-LG-Electronics-datasheet-48665530.pdf

4.5.2
External Short -
Circuiting Test
Cells are charged per 4.1.1, and the positive and
negative terminal is connected by a 100mΩ-wire for 1
hour (Per UL1642).
: No explode, No fire


...for only 1 freaking hour?!?!? Good job I charge my battery with a heat alarm plonked on, and when I'm not using it. I hate surprise outbursts. Will expulserate via a window before one happens. Yes I do the same with people. You lot can do what you like.

https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/home-ruination-by-ebike-battery-fire-expulserating-preterminator%E2%84%A2%C2%AE%C2%A9%E2%84%A0.46934/

 

[MikelBikel]

Yes. A decent one will cut off charging when cells are at designed max, DIY battery builders know how that works, or they should.

Even so, quality bare cells can take overvoltage. From the Lishen 21700 cell data sheet. You can short circuit them or overcharge to 6.3V.

9.1. External Short-circuiting Test at 25 ºC
Cell fully charged per 7.1.1, is to be short circuited by connecting the positive (+) and negative (-) terminals
with a total external resistance of less than 50mohm. Stop the test when the cell voltage falls below 0.1V
and the cell case temperature has returned to a value within 10 ºC of the original testing temperature.
Criteria: No Explosion, No Fire

9.2. Overcharge Test
Cell fully charged per 7.1.1, is to be overcharged with 1.0C to 6.3V while tapering the charge current.
Charging is continued for 7 hours.Monitoring change of cell temperature during testing. Stop the test when
cell temperature decays to room temperature.
Criteria: No Explosion, No Fire

Sure, if they put in crap cells where the batteries can't pass hazmat shipping rules, overcharging will burn them up if the BMS fails,

And this goes back to the first video in this thread, where the Grin guy says good cells make for the safer batteries;.

Are these the cells with built in protection? Almost a bms per cell. So a short would not be a Real short?
Must be pricey, esp when one would need 50 plus ?
https://irl.grandado.com/products/nitecore-21700-li-ion-rechargeable-battery-nl2150-5000mah-3-6v-overcharge-discharge ...
I've truncated the Link, it's too long (suspicious?)
Here a picture instead

42 euros each! Eek, for 10 surely?.

 

[lenny]

Boy, 8, died in Wirral house fire after charging e-bike caught alight

Boy, 8, died in Wirral house fire after charging e-bike caught alight

Merseyside Fire & Rescue Service (MFRS) is urging caution around e-bikes, e-scooters and lithium-ion batteries, following an inquest held in…

www.wirralglobe.co.uk

"Since the start of 2022, there have been 57 fires linked to items containing lithium-ion batteries in Merseyside. Of the 57 fires, almost 50% have occurred in someone’s home. Of the fires that occurred in someone’s home, over 70% occurred between 9pm and 8am. The advice from MFRS is to never charge e-bikes and e-scooters overnight, instead do this during the day and outside of the home when possible."

 

[lenny]

Exploding e-bike battery started horror blaze that killed mother, 24, and father, 28, before leaving their two young children in hospital

• Josh Pearson and Danielle Bamber died after a fire in Blackpool's Peter Street
• Inquest concludes the pair died after an e-bike battery exploded in the living room

"The inquest heard that Joshua had bought and sold e-bikes and that there was 'clear evidence' he had been tampering with batteries.

Mr Wilson said: 'Joshua had a hobby where he would buy and sell e-bikes. He would do them from home and stored the bikes in the dining room.

'Danielle didn't like this and asked him to keep them outside but he continued to do so.'

Mr Wilson said the fire was a result of a 'deficient' battery management system."

Exploding e-bike battery started blaze that killed young parents

Josh Pearson, 28, and Danielle Bamber, 24, were killed when the blaze broke out at their home in Peter Street, Blackpool, on July 17. Mr Pearson had been storing e-bikes in the house to buy and sell.

www.dailymail.co.uk