Yose kit

[Sturmey]

Hi. Anyone know the rpm of the newer yose 250w kits? I am in a position at the moment that I have both a 2-3 year old yose 250 front wheel (700c)and an xf07 side by side and am comparing both. Both wheel hub motors actually look identical with identical patterns. The only noticeable difference is the extra thin lock nut on brake side of the xf07. Both have 15 A kt controllers with front lights.
However, the Yose motor is rated at 210 -220 rpm whereas the xf07 (pswpower) is rated at 270 rpm. (all at 36v). The 270 rpm is way faster as expected whereas the 210 rpm power curve starts to taper down beyond 20 km/hr.
I am trying to make up my mind which I like best. Whereas the 270 rpm is faster, I notice that both the hub and controller get fairly warm/hot at the slightest hills. Also if you have speed, you tend to use it and this tends to use battery power. (about 25% extra in my case)
The slower 210 rpm (yose) motor and controller seem to always stay cool, except on steep hills. The motor power starting to decline at 20 -22km/hr tends to save on battery and I get a much better range, so this makes the 210 rpm a better buy in many respects, especially if you want to stay within legal speeds or am a lazy/easy rider like me. But if you wear Lycra or like speed ( and have legs), go for the faster motor. (imo)

PS. To every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction (Newton) and most of the reaction/recoil of the motor is taken internally on where the clutch is anchored to the axle on the left solid axle side of these motors. Not tightening this nut (on the solid side) properly ( or say fitting a torque arm to the weaker hollow right side only) means that the weaker (and hollow ) sections of the axle has to take almost all the reactive torque and I suspect this can lead to axle failure/breakage.

 

[Nealh]

I think the new yose hubs are 210rpm.
The reason the 270rpm gets warmer is it isn't as efficient on hills, it terminal speed is higher so one needs to also maintain a higher rate of climb speed.
On reason why a low rpm hub is always recommended for hills.

 

[guerney]

Hello, have you guys found out that the 250w is enough for you power/speed wise?

Yep. I really wouldn't want to go any faster, and it copes with all the steep hills I have found this far.

 

[Joes5]

Yep. I really wouldn't want to go any faster, and it copes with all the steep hills I have found this far.

Is the 250w motor capable of going 20-25 mph with strong assistance from pedaling or will the motor just be dead weight in that speed? My unassisted speed is something between 20-23 mph so I would like a motor that would assist me in that speed, not a lot, just in the headwind.

 

[PC2017]

Is the 250w motor

A geared motor should not drag once "off" power, mine reaches 35 mph down hill and with the right bike gear ratio one can pedal as fast off power as their legs will allow, on a good day I cut power and go about 23mph pedal power alone. I say PAS 5 is "head wind mode" in the winter.

 

[guerney]

Is the 250w motor capable of going 20-25 mph with strong assistance from pedaling or will the motor just be dead weight in that speed? My unassisted speed is something between 20-23 mph so I would like a motor that would assist me in that speed, not a lot, just in the headwind.

I have a Dahon folding bike which is limited in speed by it's shorter chain and gear setup - before I made it legally compliant, it managed 22mph on the flat pedalling with asistance. On a normal MTB, 25mph would be attainable no doubt, as I've read others here report. My 19.2ah battery helps on hills, because voltage sag has to sag a lot, before it's a problem - the motor has only ever cut off assistance due to low voltage uphill, when the battery was almost completely depleted. Well worth the extra couple of kgs, is a large battery IMHO... plus as capacity decreases over the next few years, my bike will still have useful range.

 

[Joes5]

I have a Dahon folding bike which is limited in speed by it's shorter chain and gear setup - before I made it legally .

What I have read, those speeds from 250w need a lot of overvolting or other tuning? As a noob I should then take a closer look to these. But would the 36v 250w with 15.6ah battery hit over 20 mph without mods? As the controller's rated current is 7 A and max 15 A. And the battery is within these limits. (Yose kit). I would prefer a "easy" way to electrify my bike without mods (other than easy mods from like the displays). I also like to cycle myself so the motor wouldnt have to do so much work. And the bike has 700c wheels and it is a city bike.

 

[guerney]

What I have read, those speeds from 250w need a lot of overvolting or other tuning? As a noob I should then take a closer look to these. But would the 36v 250w with 15.6ah battery hit over 20 mph without mods? As the controller's rated current is 7 A and max 15 A. And the battery is within these limits. (Yose kit). I would prefer a "easy" way to electrify my bike without mods (other than easy mods from like the displays). I also like to cycle myself so the motor wouldnt have to do so much work. And the bike has 700c wheels and it is a city bike.

My kit was from IE Bike on Amazon and it's only a 36V 250W bbs01b with a 19.2ah battery with LG-MH1 cells, just 15A. Unless your donor bike is extremely heavy or has low gearing or something, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to hit about 25mph. Before I knew it was illegal I was whizzing around at 22mph with no problems. But do you really want to collide with something while riding a bicycle at 25mph? Fear of maimage keeps me at a legal 15.5mph these days...

 

[Joes5]

My kit was from IE Bike on Amazon and it's only a 36V 250W bbs01b with a 19.2ah battery with LG-MH1 cells, just 15A. Unless your donor bike is extremely heavy or has low gearing or something, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to hit about 25mph. Before I knew it was illegal I was whizzing around at 22mph with no problems. But do you really want to collide with something while riding a bicycle at 25mph? Fear of maimage keeps me at a legal 15.5mph these days...

I should have said that i am looking for front hub motor. As isn't your mid drive? For my understanding these motors wary a lot and hub motors aren't capable of high speed if they are low rpm (like earlier comments for yose kit suggests).

 

[guerney]

I should have said that i am looking for front hub motor. As isn't your mid drive? For my understanding these motors wary a lot and hub motors aren't capable of high speed if they are low rpm (like earlier comments for yose kit suggests).

Aha! I have never tried a hub drive. I went with mid-drive for less stressful (to the motor and controller) hill climbing and cargo towing. And also because I couldn't at the time find a 20" hub conversion.

 

[PC2017]

I would prefer a "easy" way to electrify my bike without mods

That is good to hear - thumbs up emoji - darn you lacking forum emoji'

You will find the YOSE a good kit even with the non-KT system you can always upgrade and tinker as you learn... Why don't you take a look at the ton of YOSE power threads, just pop Yose power in the search most topics have been covered already.

23mph yose front @48v circa 220 rpm(36v rated) on a 36v I get 18mph on a 14a max 7a average controller - AH of the battery is capacity not amp rating you need to look at the continuous discharge and nominal discharge rate of any given battery to figure what controller you need - 23-25 mph is enough imo for any off-road private use and it goes without saying 15.5mph is the UK law on roads - on an unrelated note for noobs - I know of a case; 500w motor(320 rpm) 20a controller, 14ah battery 48v a year on throttle only (26mph top speed) heavy bike, new did 35 mile now 11 mile, samsung 30q cells I believe.

 

[guerney]

on an unrelated note for noobs - I know of a case; 500w motor(320 rpm) 20a controller, 14ah battery 48v a year on throttle only (26mph top speed) heavy bike, new did 35 mile now 11 mile, samsung 30q cells I believe.

Whoa... I might have to start dialling down PAS assistance on my bbs01b, as I have it on max 15A 100% "Keep current"nearly all of the time. Cos good batts aint cheap!

 

[PC2017]

"Keep current"nearly all of the time.

Not sure about the technical details when it comes to efficiency curves or mid drives but if you are pedalling and putting in tad of effort then you should be ok, do you have a watts read out on your display? For example I use PAS 5 & pedal a lot however the faster I go the less watts I use, I start at 550w set off and average 300w as I go - 550w~11-13a(nominal @48v) and 300w ~6-7a(nominal @48v) ergo less stress on the battery - the case study I refer too is on all gradients all the time I can only guess as there was no watts read out but it's akin to full throttle no pedalling up a steep hill most of the time and when on a flat it was throttle coast throttle coast max PAS. Also there is nothing to say the Chinese battery maker who supplied the company didn't save a few quid and swap out the cells for lower spec, who actually takes a battery to bits to check the validity of the cells, except a selected few on this forum.

 

[Neilgtis]

Cool - pop some pics up when done

Hi
Just a couple of photos need to tidy the wiring up
Waiting for a battery bracket because it just
Held with one bolt and strap

 

[PC2017]

couple of photos

Nice - looking tidy - have you got a decent lock? that bright green may attract some unwanted attention. Did you get the torque arm on? Watch out for loose gravel at traffic lights in any PAS level especially PAS 5 from stand still, tbf I do not know how the Lushi controller/lcd is setup up ie default settings out of the box, I do know however they some complex settings are not easy if at all impossible to change.

 

[Neilgtis]

Hi
Not fitted the torque arm yet I have looked at some settings on YouTube will try the default settings first
The bike is locked in a garage with a alarm and a
Anchor fitted to the floor
I never leave the bike anywhere
Might invest in a good lock any ideas
Neil

 

[PC2017]

Anchor fitted to the floor

Sounds secure.

good lock any ideas

Try "the locking picking lawyer" on youtube, some of his early stuff has the good, bad and the ugly on bike locks, mostly short vids. The take away is mainly no lock is 100% I always remove battery unless I can see my my bike and trust(ish) the location. OneGuard or a good shackle lock with a disc detainer core usually deter most, avoid rusty white empty vans with one battery operated power tool in em and you should be good - I live, sadly in a high crime, low policing hood & hate tea leaves.

 

[guerney]

Not sure about the technical details when it comes to efficiency curves or mid drives but if you are pedalling and putting in tad of effort then you should be ok, do you have a watts read out on your display? For example I use PAS 5 & pedal a lot however the faster I go the less watts I use, I start at 550w set off and average 300w as I go - 550w~11-13a(nominal @48v) and 300w ~6-7a(nominal @48v) ergo less stress on the battery - the case study I refer too is on all gradients all the time I can only guess as there was no watts read out but it's akin to full throttle no pedalling up a steep hill most of the time and when on a flat it was throttle coast throttle coast max PAS. Also there is nothing to say the Chinese battery maker who supplied the company didn't save a few quid and swap out the cells for lower spec, who actually takes a battery to bits to check the validity of the cells, except a selected few on this forum.

I've not got that kind of display - shows voltage and some kind of representation of battery power, but that's it for the DPC-18 display, I think. The battery charges to 42V after a year and a half of decent use. The last time I looked at the ODO it was 1,563 miles or so. Actually, the battery charges to a skippy 42v/41.9v - the display toggles between those two numbers rapidly, after a full charge. Oodles of counterfeit batt cells about, so I've read. I should imagine fakes would give themselves away by offering lower range, power and lifespan. So far range is what I'd expect at my heavy usagle level, but as you say, one can't know without taking the battery apart to test cells? I get 45+ miles making zero effort, using the full 15A on PAS. And that's the way I like it, unless it ushers the battery to an early demise... Any less powerful PAS, my knees do not like! A new battery purcahse somewhat sooner than expected, is the price I'll pay for less painful knees...

 

[Neilgtis]

I know what you mean seen to many crime
Videos where they turn up with battery operated
Angle grinders
Like I said before I never leave the bike unintended
Mainly used for leisure ride where I go out and back and don’t stop

 

[PC2017]

skippy 42v/41.9v

That's about right for 36v, a year+ and some miles covered, so not bad, what cells(brand) do you know? Whether its make any difference, but I always before summer, ride out locally till the battery hits LVC or near as possible, then give it a few hours rest then full 6 hours + an hour on green light, it may or may not add a better cell balance and then most of the time I keep my batteries topped up sometimes full others removed just full, say around 52v[40-41v for 36v] I have 3x batteries 2x36v one was one cell missing from the start but effectively it was free so can not moan, the other 36v is now 7 year old although not used as much I tried to run it for a miles a week but it still does 20 miles(25 miles new) and charges to 42v the other 41.5v - my 48v-er 2 year old and does 30 miles charges to 54.6v and uses LG blue cells a Chinese version made by LG for the internally business to OEM suppliers (apparently) sold by BMS battery, cheap as well, but no issues.

45+ miles

What AH is that, that's awesome mileage, although mid drives are better, I think for range.

Oodles of counterfeit batt cells about

There is defo some messed up people selling counterfeit, however I can not see them going into ebike batteries and they are normally some small cell in a shell and are an actual con/scam - low spec are normally made for cheaper power tools, single 18650 flash lights and the vape pen market and are not inherently bad but not designed with high amp draw that motors use some do make their way into ebike batteries and some poor soul somewhere will get one, I would hope that anyone in the ebike supply chain worth their salt would stay clear. I think, I could possibly be talking out of my bottom now from bits I picked up in the early days of vaping.

Angle grinders

Yep defo worth spending a few quid on a harden steel lock, it may not stop em but they may think twice and pick an easer mark. The amount of people I see with a £700+ bike and a 99p home bargains combo lock is truly mind blowing.