Yet another female cyclist death in London

A subject I raised a short while ago has sadly arisen yet again. On Monday Dr Katherine Giles, a young distinguished research fellow at University College London was killed by a left turning lorry, the most common single cause of cycling deaths in London.

Once again she was riding on the left of the lorry in the driver's blind spot, as they both turned left, the most dangerous position for any cyclist to be in. Most of these deaths involve female riders and this has been repeatedly widely publicised, but still they make the same silly mistake.

The usual reason is that they are too law abiding, waiting alongside high cab lorries below the driver's view at traffic lights, where male riders will commonly move ahead of the stop line or even cross against the lights at opportune moments, both strictly speaking illegal but sensible in the circumstances.

I can fully understand why many female riders prefer not to break the law, but I fail to understand why they don't hang back to the rear of lorries as a legal alternative, since the danger is so obvious and these deaths so widely publicised. I just hope that by repeating this posting here on every occasion that at least this forum's members will avoid being unnecessary victims of such deaths.

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Edited April 10, 201313 yr by flecc

I wonder if a poster displayed at these left turns, together with advice written on the road surface in the appropriate place would help.

The problem is that the cyclist may be on the inside of the first of two or three cars, and being slow to start, may get overtaken by the lorry.

If I was investigating this collision, I would want to know if the lorry driver overtook the cyclist.

Certainly, all barriers on the pavement edge should be moved 2 feet onto the pavement, and made of plastic. Originally, they were put there and made strong to protect pedestrians and I would suggest that this need is no longer present in modern day pedestrians.

since the danger is so obvious

Evidently not.

I'm sure if she'd have realised how dangerous it was she wouldn't have got into that situation.

Evidently not.

 

I'm sure if she'd have realised how dangerous it was she wouldn't have got into that situation.

That appears to presume she was unable to think with any degree of realisation of consequences. Given her professional status I think that highly unlikely.

The danger was obvious to anyone giving a moments thought to what they were doing, so at the very least she was riding without due care and attention. I also find it difficult to accept that she had not seen at least some of the many warnings about this common situation, which have included London area TV programs on both ITV and BBC 1, full page London area newspaper advertisements and items in the main TV and radio programs. The half hour ITV program even staged a simulation of such an accident to make it very clear how they occur.

Making excuses for the victims is unlikely to help, possibly reassuring into apathy as it can, but perhaps some timely criticism might make some wake up.

To Mike: The report said they were turning the corner together, the swinging in of the lorry length going over her and knocking her off to be run over. This has been the case in all but one of the cases I've looked at where details have been available. The odd one out was at a roundabout with the lorry overtaking and that driver is being prosecuted accordingly. Most happen at traffic lights or other halt points where the cyclist is stopped alongside under the high cab blind point, both move off together and the lorry left turns.

One actual death case was fully videoed by CCTV throughout the accident and shown on TV later. The female cyclist cycled in to stop on the nearside alongside the stationary lorry, completely ignoring it's flashing left turn indicators as she did so. When the lights changed and they both moved off, the inevitable happened.

My car beeps at me if I am going to reverse over a daffodil.

Why the hell can't these vehicles be fitted with a device that activates on turning left. If something is in the blind spot, brakes come on instantly. So simple its not true. How many more deaths before someone in power develops big enough balls to sort the problem once and for all.

No point in discussing who's at fault. We've been doing that for years. The technology exists at a very low cost to prevent these untimely deaths so lets have it sorted. Sorted now!

Without knowing the full story its difficult to know if she was lacking attention or not. Lorrys often overtake cyclists without regard to their forward passage. They have also been noted to turn left without giving enough room for a cyclist even if they have approached them from behind. Buses often do the same thing.

Sad. I heard the report yesterday, but she was still unidentified at the time.

My car beeps at me if I am going to reverse over a daffodil.

 

Why the hell can't these vehicles be fitted with a device that activates on turning left. If something is in the blind spot, brakes come on instantly. So simple its not true. How many more deaths before someone in power develops big enough balls to sort the problem once and for all.

 

No point in discussing who's at fault. We've been doing that for years. The technology exists at a very low cost to prevent these untimely deaths so lets have it sorted. Sorted now!

Many lorries operating in the London area have been modified with extra mirrors, but the trouble is that for some types of cab, the full complement is no fewer than 7 mirrors. As an experienced past truck driver I can assure you that is asking too much for a driver to view all those frequently enough to avoid all such accidents.

I strongly disagree that who is at fault isn't worth discussing. It's about time that people took responsibility for their own actions and stopped passing the buck to others to cover for their stupidity. That includes cyclists, they should ride with due care and attention too.

Many lorries operating in the London area have been modified with extra mirrors, but the trouble is that for some types of cab, the full complement is no fewer than 7 mirrors. As an experienced past truck driver I can assure you that is asking too much for a driver to view all those frequently enough to avoid all such accidents.

 

I strongly disagree that who is at fault isn't worth discussing. It's about time that people took responsibility for their own actions and stopped passing the buck to others to cover for their stupidity. That includes cyclists, they should ride with due care and attention too.

I have had vehicles overtake me and turn left at a junction. Its amazing what the thought of being stopped by a red light does to some drivers accelerator foot. You may have a chance with a car, its not so easy with a lorry or bus.

I strongly disagree that who is at fault isn't worth discussing. It's about time that people took responsibility for their own actions and stopped passing the buck to others to cover for their stupidity. That includes cyclists, they should ride with due care and attention too.

Flecc, the fact remains that this topic has been talked about again and again and we still have people being killed.

Years ago, artic trailers were fitted with steel bars to prevent a car entering the space beneath in the event of an accident.

It would be a simple matter to install small bars or sensors around a truck. Should these bars or sensors be activated by a person or object pressing or activating them the truck would automatically stop.

Lives would be saved, we could then talk about the weather.

Yes, we all need to take as much careas possible but as we know from A and E figures, this is not always enough to prevent an accident.

Would it be surprising if this government banned left turns?

(bet that's an old one)

Flecc,

Thankyou so much for bringing up this new incident to our attention once again,because it is so so dangerous out there on the roads and streets of London.

I do make some mistakes from time to time,but my main concern is those drivers out there regardless of shape or size of the vehical do not have any form of respect for cyclists,anyway my heart goes out to her family and friends,may God bless her soul and rest in piece.

Mountainsport. LET US TRY OUR BEST TO KEEP SAFE ON ALL JOURNEYS.

I'd never heard of this problem until I read about it on here a few months ago. Then a few weeks ago, I was reaching for the remote as one of those traffic programs was starting. I stopped and watched only because I noticed this problem was mentioned in the intro. I consider myself lucky to have happened upon this info, not well informed. I think a public service ad campaign is in order.

Drivers don't always see cyclists as serious road traffic... But then cyclist don't always act like serious road traffic.

I'd never heard of this problem until I read about it on here a few months ago. Then a few weeks ago, I was reaching for the remote as one of those traffic programs was starting. I stopped and watched only because I noticed this problem was mentioned in the intro. I consider myself lucky to have happened upon this info, not well informed. I think a public service ad campaign is in order.

 

Drivers don't always see cyclists as serious road traffic... But then cyclist don't always act like serious road traffic.

May I politely suggest you read this

https://www.gov.uk/highway-code

Its full of warnings about this both for cyclists and motorists. Its a shame that most people never read it again after passing their test.

eg

167 stay behind if you are following a cyclist approaching a roundabout or junction, and you intend to turn left

170 watch out for cyclists, motorcyclists, powered wheelchairs/mobility scooters and pedestrians as they are not always easy to see. Be aware that they may not have seen or heard you if you are approaching from behind

170 watch out for long vehicles which may be turning at a junction ahead; they may have to use the whole width of the road to make the turn (see Rule 221)

182 Use your mirrors and give a left-turn signal well before you turn left. Do not overtake just before you turn left and watch out for traffic coming up on your left before you make the turn, especially if driving a large vehicle. Cyclists, motorcyclists and other road users in particular may be hidden from your view.

187 cyclists and horse riders who may stay in the left-hand lane and signal right if they intend to continue round the roundabout. Allow them to do so

187 long vehicles (including those towing trailers). These might have to take a different course or straddle lanes either approaching or on the roundabout because of their length. Watch out for their signals.

221 Large vehicles. These may need extra road space to turn or to deal with a hazard that you are not able to see. If you are following a large vehicle, such as a bus or articulated lorry, be aware that the driver may not be able to see you in the mirrors. Be prepared to stop and wait if it needs room or time to turn.

I also strongly suggest your read this

Motorcycle Roadcraft: The Police Rider's Handbook to Better Motorcycling: Amazon.co.uk: Phillip Coyne, Bill Mayblin, Penny Mares: Books

as while its really for motorcyclists a lot of is advice applies just as well to cycling.

Agreed, it's all in there, Garry, but cyclists don't take a test, most don't read it & "It's all just common sense innit?" prevails.

I agree, it's time for an ad campaign.

Agreed, it's all in there, Garry, but cyclists don't take a test, most don't read it & "It's all just common sense innit?" prevails.

 

I agree, it's time for an ad campaign.

Oh I agree but it should be a read the Highway code campaign not just the one issue. Could still highlight a few of the ones most people get caught out by.

eg did you know xxxxx you would do if you read the Highway code.

I agree, it's time for an ad campaign.

As it's been such a big problem in London with it's doubling of cycling in the last decade, there has been a large ad campaign which was launched and run by the previous mayor Ken Livingstone. As the cyclist friend he's always been, he didn't stint, taking full page ads in all the London circulation newspapers and free sheets. Much of the campaign was aimed at drivers, and there have been other initiatives involving the major truck operating companies and their drivers, and many of them have installed extra mirrors and organised driver training programs specifically about cyclist needs.

In addition, as said before, the BBC and ITV have run special half hour programs in peak evening hours to cover this subject, and both of them have run items about the problem on their London TV news programs. The BBC has also covered this in the Radio 4 PM program.

I'd suggest that it isn't the lack of publicity that's the problem, it's more the cyclists who simply don't act on all the advice, and as observed, there is a specific problem with female cyclists who make up most of these deaths. That is the purpose of this thread, to remind them and others of their repsonsibilities. It's simply not good enough for any cyclists to always point to others to be responsible for their safety and/or just ride thoughtlessly. Road safety is the active concern of every road user.

Thanks for the links, GaRRy, but that's still me going looking for the info... I didn't get a highway code book with my bike. And if I read those quotes in the context of the whole book, I don't think it would help to realise the problem for me.

I agree that the onus is on the cyclist to not put themselves in harms way. It may be common sense to some of us but we don't all see things in the same way.

I, like many people, don't read newspapers. I get my news from tv and google.

"Clunk, click before every trip."

"Think... before you drink... before you drive."

"Treat a cyclist like a small car."

Just a few examples of tv ad campaigns I recall. I can't think of a single full page spread campaign...

167 stay behind if you are following a cyclist approaching a roundabout or junction, and you intend to turn left

...yea right....like that's gonna' happen

I stopped cycling in london when a car drew up level with me(while cycling) then turned left with me holding onto the roof and bike under rear wheel...

That was 400 meters after a parked van opened its off side door on me.

stopped cycling for a few years then.

I stopped cycling in london when a car drew up level with me(while cycling) then turned left with me holding onto the roof and bike under rear wheel...

That was 400 meters after a parked van opened its off side door on me.

stopped cycling for a few years then.

My god......you were lucky it didnt stop you cycling forever......and breathing .......totally terrifying how some people drive......

Lynda

My thoughts are with this poor girl's family.

I worry myself sick every day about i) son, aged 29, rides own push bike, foolhardy, jumps lights, hangs on to lorries,a ll sorts of things, and has actually been hauled up TWICE by the police and shown a video in a nearby van about the consequences of dangerous cycling and ii) daughter aged 25, rides Boris bikes, not road wise at all, could easily sidle up alongside a lorry, and sometimes has to cycle home at 3am.

Both in London.

Going to email daughter right now about this issue and hope it sinks in. Son never takes any notice of parental warnings but will email him nevertheless....

Oh well.

Hatti

Thanks for the links, GaRRy, but that's still me going looking for the info... I didn't get a highway code book with my bike. And if I read those quotes in the context of the whole book, I don't think it would help to realise the problem for me.

 

I agree that the onus is on the cyclist to not put themselves in harms way. It may be common sense to some of us but we don't all see things in the same way.

 

I, like many people, don't read newspapers. I get my news from tv and google.

 

"Clunk, click before every trip."

"Think... before you drink... before you drive."

"Treat a cyclist like a small car."

 

Just a few examples of tv ad campaigns I recall. I can't think of a single full page spread campaign...

Yes but my point is EVERYONE should read (and occasionally re read) the Highway Code not just people learning to pass their test.

Heres a challenge for everyone see if you can pass all four tests on here (try and avoid reading the hints).

Driving Theory Test. Practice Online Theory Test Questions

Remember for a learner a fail means no license until can pass.

Obviously there are a fair few quetions that only really apply to car divers but most of it is stuff ALL road users should no.

Agreed, it's all in there, Garry, but cyclists don't take a test, most don't read it & "It's all just common sense innit?" prevails.

 

I agree, it's time for an ad campaign.

In my current issues of the Institute of Advanced Motorists magazine , the Chairman reports that following a FOI request, spending on Road safety campaigns have been cut by around 80% in the past four years (from £19million 2008/09 to just £3.57m in 2012/13) Road safety adverts are no longer shown on TV. Each fatality is estimated to cost £1.7. The number of children killed last year actually rose,as did cyclist deaths which hit an all time high of 122, so it just makes absolutely no financial sense either.

Of that £3.57m just £78k was spent on childrens road safety and a derisory £53k on cyclists safety.

As he says, 'It is yet another example of road safety being cut too hard and too quickly.

If the govt is serious about saving lives it must start protecting safety budgets.'