Ditto - I now have a Trek Soho Deluxe and after using it for a few weeks commute I wouldn't go back to a chain drive - esp on an electrically assited bike.
Wisper ties up distributor deal for Grace bikes e-bikes in the UK
- Thread starter Wisper Bikes
- Start date
Ditto - I now have a Trek Soho Deluxe and after using it for a few weeks commute I wouldn't go back to a chain drive - esp on an electrically assited bike.
Absolutely spot on Flecc, we will learn more as we go, but this bike will be restricted to 25kph. Hopefully it wont be long before speed pedelecs are road legal here in the UK, it is very exhilarating bombing along at 30mph on a slight incline, keeping up with the traffic.
All the best
David
Hi Grasshopper.I have bought my ticket for the Cycle Show at the NEC on the strength of this post. Do you have your stand number yet, David?
Do these bikes come with mudguards?Not really bothered about having an ashtray.
It will be on show at the NEC, although because we had a bike stolen last year these bikes will not be on the test track, however, if you find me on the Wisper Stand E4.1 adjacent to the test track, I will arrange a ride for you.
Mudguards are available!
All the best
David
Hi Jerry, love your bike, what a cracker!
I don't imagine we will sell hundreds of the Grace MX in the UK next year, it really is a trail bike first and foremost. You are correct though in Germany a lot of younger riders are enjoying these exhilarating bikes off road and there is a bit of a cult growing.
All the best
David
Still dont see how they are ever going to allow 30 mph e-bikes with less rules than mopeds. If i was to start a campaign to get mopeds reclassified as bicycles with no need for helmet, tax, insurance ,MOT etc ( or at least no more than proposed 'S' class ) what do think my chances would be? And the brakes, tyres, handling etc of a moped far exceeds those of a ebike.
I really dont understand why anyone would want a ebike that can travel almost as fast as Bradley Wiggins in a time trial ( he averaged 32mph at Olympics)
Strange though it seems Garry, Germany and Switzerland both have these high speed and higher power classes with less rules than mopeds. However, they aren't rule free by any means. They have to be registered, have number plates and third party insurance and cycle helmets must be worn. There are also restrictions on where they can be used, for example not on normal cycle paths, so they are basically classed with motor vehicles.
Therefore they don't get away with much, its the rider rather than the bike that benefits from some relaxation of law, since no driving licence, test, CBT etc is required.
Therefore they don't get away with much, its the rider rather than the bike that benefits from some relaxation of law, since no driving licence, test, CBT etc is required.
Yep im aware of this. However in this country where the government has slowly been doing all it can to kill of motorcycles by introducing tougher and tougher testing I really cant see this loop hole ever being allowed. Even if it is I can see it very quickly going the way of sports mopeds in the 1970's.
I can see the argument for say a 35kph class with some regulation as a in between class but I get the impression that all the speed freaks want more than this just with out all the hassle that this currently requires. But even this worries me as the next thing will be "if they have to have insurance etc why dont we introduce this for all bicycles" (place your bets
).Source please?
Chief Delphi - Belt vs. Chain Drive Evaluation - Team 234 would seem to show that belts are about 3 to 4% more efficient!
I though the helmet wasn't actually a requirement?
And 95% of designated cycle paths are open to S-class machines as well now.
Maybe for their use its the best idea. But there is a reason why MotoGP / World Super Bikes and that because a well adjusted a chain is more efficient.
For day to day use a Belt is a better idea as it stays at maximum efficiency for far longer as less prone to stretch and general wear and tear.
See you there, David! Do I bring my cheque book or cash? On a more pessimistic note, I am assuming a protracted delivery timescale?
Grasshopper
Indeed, something does not compute here the single speed track bikes in the Olympics all use the latest high tech design and materials yet they stick with chain...I've also read about some of the human powered aircraft use some sort of plastic chain because of better efficiency. Belts have to be at a higher tension with causes more friction a correctly aligned chain with tension wheel should be more efficient...I note in that report the chains seemed to be under tension with no idler sprocket to take up slack.
The source is myself, I worked with them for years on machinery. I can go into the fine detailed reasons of why they are less efficient and have done so previously in this forum, but for the moment I'll give you a simple undeniable fact and let you work it out from there.
Lay a chain down and it will take any shape you like flat on a smooth surface without resistance. A toothed belt by contrast is made as a perfect circle and that is the shape it retains. It needs an energy input to make it take other shapes such as traversing smaller radii like a rear toothed wheel. That energy input is an inefficiency which a chain doesn't have.
To claim that toothed belt drives are more efficient is pure bunkum.
Hi Grasshopper,See you there, David! Do I bring my cheque book or cash? On a more pessimistic note, I am assuming a protracted delivery timescale?
Grasshopper
We have had a few people asking to buy the bikes now so are currently trying to get some in for the end of this season, hopefully we will get a few and of course I will earmark one for you now, no obligation. Otherwise it will be in the new year. The Grace Easy, will certainly not be available until 2013.
We are in competition to get hold of the Grace bikes for 2012, the French dealer just ordered 200 for urgent delivery, However we have been told that any available will shared amongst the European dealers. Fingers crossed!
"Patience young Grasshopper!"
Or should that be GraceHopper???!!
All the best!
David
Cycle sport has a rule for just about everything and there is probably a rule which tells them what the drivetrain has to be made of, what weight and what size. Technical advances in cycling are very much about how to push the rule envelope and not all out tech advancement. It's a shame as I think it holds back cycle development but I guess without the heavy rules the team with the biggest wallet would always win like they did in F1 a while back.
There are lots of benefits to a belt drive, more for motorbikes really as unsprung weight is important there. Lower inertial mass to aid acceleration, cleaner, lower maintenance, a belt won't cause as much damage if it snaps.
One big disadvantage that I still see is when debris starts flying around, a chain will just shake off most dirt or stones but a belt can get thrown much more easily. Buell had this problem racing their motorbikes on a racetrack, go off road and it's going to get worse.
Another big reason racers don't use belts is they are a fixed length, with a chain the rear sprocket can be changed easily as conditions require. For the track cyclists there might be a problem with needing a split frame to fit a belt.
I'd happily believe that belt and chain drives are equally efficient and it's the other design considerations (adjustable length, robustness, weight, cost, fashion etc) that will decide the drive type rather than the designer flipping a coin to see what he picks.
Just found the regulations and seems theres nothing in there stopping the use of a belt drive...certainly not to my untrained eye....
On the other hand: The bicycle is a vehicle with two wheels of equal diameter. The front wheel shall be steerable; the rear wheel shall be driven through a system comprising pedals and a chain.
On the other hand: The bicycle is a vehicle with two wheels of equal diameter. The front wheel shall be steerable; the rear wheel shall be driven through a system comprising pedals and a chain.
Last edited:
As far as im aware there are no rules restricting transmission type in motorcycle racing (Buell trying demonstrates this.) but you can bet full well if belts were better then likes of Honda,Yamaha and Ducati would be using them.
Cant see how the dirt and stones argument stacks up as a excuse as Harley have been quite happiliy fitting them to their road bikes for years where there is far more chance of this causing a problem than on a race track.
Sadly this use for racing means that most road bikes also come with chains despite the fact for general use belts makes far more sence. I think Harley reckon there belts are good for 100,000 miles which a chain gets no where even close to.
Last edited:
Related Articles
-
MTF Enterprises announces acquisition of EMU Electric Bikes- Started by: Pedelecs
-
Wisper 806T folding bike wins Which? ‘Best Buy’- Started by: Pedelecs
-
Sustrans calls for protected cycle lanes- Started by: Pedelecs
-
Amazon launch their first UK e-cargo micromobility hub- Started by: Pedelecs
