Will the end of full speed throttles in January 2016 cause a rush to buy.

[Andy_H]

Thanks for the welcome Andy. Is the Valley place OK to deal with. It's position and frontage isn't exactly welcoming - I'm sure you know what I mean!

Thankfully Craiggor replied above as I haven't visited them myself, I know of them through the AMPS website (AMPS distribute Wisper bikes).

To be honest I discounted them as I tend to check company house when thinking of buying from a new firm, but I couldn't find them so decided not to visit, obviously I hadn't used the correct search terms, but if I can't easily find and check a company - they don't get my money.

Sorry everyone if this has got off topic.

 

[Yamdude]

The broom sketch !!! Had it for 10 years.It's only had 4 handles and six heads.

Ha ha.... Triggers broom.
Nice one Dave.

 

[craiggor]

Thankfully Craiggor replied above as I haven't visited them myself, I know of them through the AMPS website (AMPS distribute Wisper bikes).

To be honest I discounted them as I tend to check company house when thinking of buying from a new firm, but I couldn't find them so decided not to visit, obviously I hadn't used the correct search terms, but if I can't easily find and check a company - they don't bet my money.

Sorry everyone if this has got off topic.

He has been there for years.I biased though he gave me a broken girls electric shoper bike.See my post in the kit section, to see what I did with it.

 

[Yamdude]

Seeing as we touched on 'Only Fools & Horses' earlier...... another show of the same vintage was 'Minder'
When Arthur was once asked 'Isn't that illegal Arfur ?'..... he replied 'Well, only technically'

A man after my own heart and pretty much how i view this throttle law.

 

[craiggor]

Value of secondhand pre 2016 ebikes set to sky rocket as new law comes in to force !!!

 

[flecc]

I guess i'll just have to make do with ignoring this law then.

It's what most UK e-bikers had been doing between 10th November 2003 and 13th April 2013, nearly ten years of wicked naughtiness.
.

 

[Yamdude]

It's what most UK e-bikers had been doing between 10th November 2003 and 13th April 2013, nearly ten years of wicked naughtiness.
.

Glad to hear it...... sometimes petty rules, regulations and laws aren't worth attaching any importance to.

 

[flecc]

Glad to hear it...... sometimes petty rules, regulations and laws aren't worth attaching any importance to.

Of course all it needs for all this discussion to be redundant is some suppliers type-approving their throttle equipped pedelecs.

They'd then be legal EAPCs in the UK.
.

 

[Lancslass]

Hatti is looking for altternatives, such as large B&Bs willing to have her e-bikes for demos and hire.

Thanks Trex, that's good news. Sorry to go off topic folks.

 

[the_killjoy]

,

where the
output of the motor is cut off when the cyclist stops
pedalling

Doesn't this all come down to the definition of pedalling, surely a throttle will be legal as long as it can only be used whilst the pedals are being turned ~ no matter how slowly .

 

[flecc]

,

Doesn't this all come down to the definition of pedalling, surely a throttle will be legal as long as it can only be used whilst the pedals are being turned ~ no matter how slowly .

It would appear so, and certainly will be under the revised UK law. For a number of years the eZee bikes throttle worked this way when the bike was switched to pedelec mode. Since that was how they were supplied into mainland Europe, probably entirely legal there too.
.

 

[craiggor]

If you stick on the required label and write up and sign a certificate of conformity with yourself as the constructor you fall under EN15194.

1. the bike must already comply to current bicycle norm and have the manufacturers markings to that effect
2. The motor must be marked CE and the battery must be to EU norms, get all the paperwork you can from the Chinese manufacturer, they often have PDFs on their web sites
3. You as the builder engage your responsibility that all these norms are respected in the final product you have assembled and sign off on it

Then if the xxxx hits the fan you should have a fair go of defending yourself in court.

no need for a sign.It says the bike has to be marked (does not say how) or a sign.

 

[craiggor]

Yes, quad bikes are now allowed by the amendments of the 6th April 2015 to the 1983 EAPC regulations. They naturally wouldn't mention something as obscure as generation while in motion since it's not part of a pedelec, but there are at least two laws that can make that illegal.
.

By jov Flec,I think i may of cracked it.

"portable engines" Can't find anything about idling on the move.Got idling while stationary covered it says it allowable for diagnostic purposes.

It would appear so, and certainly will be under the revised UK law. For a number of years the eZee bikes throttle worked this way when the bike was switched to pedelec mode. Since that was how they were supplied into mainland Europe, probably entirely legal there too.
.

 

[flecc]

By jov Flec,I think i may of cracked it. "portable engines" Can't find anything about idling on the move.Got idling while stationary covered it says it allowable for diagnostic purposes.

I doubt it, there are catch-all laws in many areas and this could well be a case. For example, there's absolutely no mention in law about hoverboards or a whole host of other odd vehicle types, but they are all made illegal by the catch-all type-approval law. If those don't mention something, it's automatically illegal.
.

 

[trex]

could a bike with onboard petrol generator inverter be type approved as EAPC?

 

[craiggor]

could a bike with onboard petrol generator inverter be type approved as EAPC?

Not a clue.

 

[flecc]

could a bike with onboard petrol generator inverter be type approved as EAPC?

As an i.c. vehicle since petrol is the energy input*, no.

*The inverter would be effectively be the transmission, not the motive unit.
.

 

[Kudoscycles]

,

Doesn't this all come down to the definition of pedalling, surely a throttle will be legal as long as it can only be used whilst the pedals are being turned ~ no matter how slowly .

But doesnt that make a throttle redundant. If you can get max power just by rotating the pedal I cannot see why we need throttles,unless of course you are disabled-the law should have helped the disabled.
I have a throttle on my Kudos Secret but hardly ever use it...it is sometimes usefull on set off on a steep hill but we are allowed 4mph throttles.
KudosDave

 

[Kudoscycles]

Of course all it needs for all this discussion to be redundant is some suppliers type-approving their throttle equipped pedelecs.

They'd then be legal EAPCs in the UK.
.

I cannot find any way of type approving these e-bikes in the UK.
I spoke at length to most of the bigger e-bike suppliers at the NEC and none appeared to have any method or plans to type approve.
The SVA guys I spoke to didnt even know about the reg change.
It seems the government have specified a way of retaining throttles but have not established an e-bike class,until that happens it appears to me that type approval is not possible in the UK.
KudosDave

 

[flecc]

I cannot find any way of type approving these e-bikes in the UK.
I spoke at length to most of the bigger e-bike suppliers at the NEC and none appeared to have any method or plans to type approve.
The SVA guys I spoke to didnt even know about the reg change.
It seems the government have specified a way of retaining throttles but have not established an e-bike class,until that happens it appears to me that type approval is not possible in the UK.
KudosDave

An extract from this document:

Department for Transport

Information Sheet

Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycles (EAPCs) in Great Britain – revised June 2015

Power assistance - "Twist and Go"

"Because of the particular benefits for elderly and disabled users, pedal cycles providing electrical assistance without use of the pedals - usually called "Twist and Goes" - are included in the above GB classification provided they are capable of pedal operation and comply with the above restrictions on maximum motor power and assistance cut-off speed.

However, under European law new "Twist and Go" vehicles will, from January 2016, have to meet a range of technical requirements before they can be used on roads. This will normally be established by "type approval" at the manufacturing stage but importers and individuals will be able to seek an individual approval for vehicles that have not been type approved."

Having published that, I cannot see how the DfT can deny an individual access to Single Vehicle Approval testing from 1st January 2016, and a manufacturer/supplier can surely demand the indicated Type Approval facility, quoting this publication.

It was published by:

International Vehicle Standards
Department for Transport
Zone 1/34, Great Minster House
33 Horseferry Road, London, SW1P 4DR
Telephone: 020 7944 2091
Fax: 020 7944 2196
Email: ivs.enquiries@dft.gsi.gov.uk
.