Why can't you derestrict a Whisper 905e?

[phil]

I have been wondering this for a while but felt it a little unfair to Whisper to bring up on the forum until most stocks of 905e's had been sold. Now I see that A1chalky has one for sale only 15 miles away frm where I live, which has brought back my intrigue. Back to the point - if the 905se can be off-road derestrictable, why can't the 905e? Surely at some point a decision on restriction is an electrical current down a wire (ie what you do surgery on with an Ezee) and you just need to work out where this wire is (??within the motor, even?). As you can see I'm a simplistic thinker and am quite ready and prepared to be trodden into the ground by the normal high standard of intelligent responses we get on this site (except about pretty ladies on AtoB magazine!). I'm still wondering about making an offer on A1chalky's 905 but as some of you have pointed out, they must currently be one of the most rapidly depreciating electric bikes.

Any answers from smart people?

Phil

 

[flecc]

I don't know the wiring and controller on a Wisper bike, but on a few eZee models the controller has provision for it with two connecting wires that can be parted for derestriction. Originally that was only the Torq, but later the F series as well, but now the whole range had the derestriction facility removed.

However, the electrical side is only part of this. To get the extra speed the motor has to be internally geared high enough to run the wheel faster. If the gearing only allows 15 mph on the available voltage, no derestriction for higher speeds is possible.

The original example of the Torq illustrates this. The eZee Quando model uses the same motor geared for it's 20" wheel to comfortably achieve 16 mph. Then the Torq was created with the identical motor, but this time in the larger diameter 28" wheel. As a result, it naturally ran to around 22 mph, so it had electrical restriction added to give the option for it to be run legally.

From this you can see that derestriction isn't added to a bike, it's restriction that's added to tie it down to a speed. If it can't achieve the higher speed by design in the first place, nothing can be done to improve that other than a higher voltage.

I hope a Wisper owner can give more detail for the 905e and whether it has restriction in the first place.
.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Derestric 905e

Hi Phil

I have sent your question to the factory for an answer and wiring diagram. I assume you want to permanently de restrict it? As soon as I have them I will forward the details to you.

Re your comment

"I'm still wondering about making an offer on A1chalky's 905 but as some of you have pointed out, they must currently be one of the most rapidly depreciating electric bikes."

The 905e has been on the market for over a year at £850 and, although we still support it, is now a discontinued product. We are selling off our last few demo models at £600 which may have bought the price down a little. They are used and there are some marks on them but are great value for money.

Best regards David

 

[aaannndddyyy]

I I'm still wondering about making an offer on A1chalky's 905 but as some of you have pointed out, they must currently be one of the most rapidly depreciating electric bikes.

Any answers from smart people?

Phil

Hi Phil
A1chalky 905e is also on EBay Wisper Works 905e the ultimate electric road bike.22mph on eBay, also, Bikes, Cycling, Sporting Goods (end time 26-Mar-08 19:42:26 GMT) his add says "it will do 22mph at the press of a button" I have a 905e and there is no button that will do this on the standard 905e. only on the se.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

De restrict

However, the electrical side is only part of this. To get the extra speed the motor has to be internally geared high enough to run the wheel faster. If the gearing only allows 15 mph on the available voltage, no de-restriction for higher speeds is possible.

As always Flecc is spot on, there is a restrict on the later 905e's, it was put on to reduce the speed from 17 mph which is illegal in the UK to the legal limit of 15.5mph (25kph).

On the new SE's the de-restricted motor will still only achieve 20mph without power input from the rider.

Best regards David

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Speed

his add says "it will do 22mph at the press of a button" I have a 905e and there is no button that will do this on the standard 905e. only on the se.

Sorry guys it won't do 22mph without input from the rider and the only switch on the 905e is the on/off switch for the throttle control.

Best regards David

 

[phil]

many thanks guys for all your helpful replies, my depreciation comment was probably a little harsh ...or more a compliment to the 905SE; what I'm really after is a bike that still gives me a bit of help at 20mph although I expect motor gearing is still the issue here. Thanks a lot David for asking at the factory, Phil.

 

[keithhazel]

The original example of the Torq illustrates this. The eZee Quando model uses the same motor geared for it's 20" wheel to comfortably achieve 16 mph. Then the Torq was created with the identical motor, but this time in the larger diameter 28" wheel. As a result, it naturally ran to around 22 mph, so it had electrical restriction added to give the option for it to be run legally.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

am i right in thinking then Flecc, if i was to put my motor in a bigger wheel it then would be a deristricted wheel running to 22mph ?....i have as you know not the knowledge to chenge a tyre let alone what this would entail, and besides the Quando with its folding ability is spot on for me at the moment...but just wondered..

 

[HarryB]

am i right in thinking then Flecc, if i was to put my motor in a bigger wheel it then would be a deristricted wheel running to 22mph ?....i have as you know not the knowledge to chenge a tyre let alone what this would entail, and besides the Quando with its folding ability is spot on for me at the moment...but just wondered..

You could do that and it would work but your Quando would look a little odd don't you think?

 

[frank9755]

Keith, if you put your Quando motor in a 28" wheel, you would have re-invented the Torq!

 

[Mandy]

Sorry guys it won't do 22mph without input from the rider and the only switch on the 905e is the on/off switch for the throttle control.

Best regards David

Hi David

I had a look at the pics and at first thought he may be listing an SE and calling it an E by accident. But I know is not the case as the handle bars are chrome coloured etc etc.
I have sent the seller a question as I am curious as I expect others may have too

David. is the battery on the 905E compatible with the SE? I know the one's on the SE are improved but if one was to pick up an old 905E cheaply could it be beneficial to the running of the SE, ie. parts etc?
I do know the SE is superior regarding parts as I have one but just wondered

Regards

Mandy

 

[Mandy]

I have been wondering this for a while but felt it a little unfair to Whisper to bring up on the forum until most stocks of 905e's had been sold. Now I see that A1chalky has one for sale only 15 miles away frm where I live, which has brought back my intrigue. Back to the point - if the 905se can be off-road derestrictable, why can't the 905e? Surely at some point a decision on restriction is an electrical current down a wire (ie what you do surgery on with an Ezee) and you just need to work out where this wire is (??within the motor, even?). As you can see I'm a simplistic thinker and am quite ready and prepared to be trodden into the ground by the normal high standard of intelligent responses we get on this site (except about pretty ladies on AtoB magazine!). I'm still wondering about making an offer on A1chalky's 905 but as some of you have pointed out, they must currently be one of the most rapidly depreciating electric bikes.

Any answers from smart people?

Phil

Hi Phil

You may be being simplistic but logical is another name for simplistic in many ways Phil. On some other bikes, normally the older models then de-restriction is possible. eg. the older E zee Forte that was not supplied on the market de-restricted could be de-restricted. On new models I believe this is not really an option unless you considered a partial rebuild. Or of course you could always build your own as I am still thinking about for the future

I would go for the SE if possible as the E is an older discontinued version. Bit like cars really, simply improving.

I bought mine from Germany and it may be worth seeing if they have any left with a saving of around £300? E zee have gone down the legality route with restricting new models which is fair enough but am not sure if Wisper will be? Are you David? I hope you may be able to find a way around that

Hope you find what you are looking for?

Kind Regards

Mandy

 

[keithhazel]

Keith, if you put your Quando motor in a 28" wheel, you would have re-invented the Torq!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

however you cant get a de restricted torq anymore can you ?.....this would have no switch to flick to change it from 15mph to 22mph.. ....it was merely a query though as the way i can fold up my quando in anything from 10-300 seconds on a bad day and pop into a boot or in my carry bag (when made) and hop on a bus is something a torq couldnt do.... ....

 

[Caractacus Potts]

As always Flecc is spot on, there is a restrict on the later 905e's, it was put on to reduce the speed from 17 mph which is illegal in the UK to the legal limit of 15.5mph (25kph)...

David,

you seem to imply that there is a difference between the earlier 905e and the later models - as I have an 'ex-demo' model which can only achieve 13 MPH or so on the flat (and even less under throttle only) - with considerable input from me I can increase this to 15 MPH but it's hard work I have a couple of questions:

1) Can I tell if my 905e is capable of 17MPH ?

2) If so - can I have a copy of the wiring so that I can modify mine accordingly

regards

 

[jimmyengland1000]

David,

you seem to imply that there is a difference between the earlier 905e and the later models - as I have an 'ex-demo' model which can only achieve 13 MPH or so on the flat (and even less under throttle only) - with considerable input from me I can increase this to 15 MPH but it's hard work I have a couple of questions:

1) Can I tell if my 905e is capable of 17MPH ?

2) If so - can I have a copy of the wiring so that I can modify mine accordingly

regards

I think you'll find that the controller has a variable resistor in the speed restrict circuit. Two grey wires with a little white, crossheaded gadget on the end. You just remove the resistor completely. If you take pix of the controller (which lives under the battery) and e-mail me them, I'll point out the bit and return the photo to you. I can also e-mail you a circuit diagram.......

You could actually fit a new controller if yours does not have the resistor. I received a Wisper controller today from the manufacturer.... only £20 delievered by airmail. If you message me, I'll send you a photo with the resistor pointed out. Then you can see if you have one on your 905e and remove it. I can't remember if my 905e had one but my SE certainly did until I removed it. My bike is now permanently de-restricted.

You'll only get about 16-17mph on the flat from a derestricted 905E. With pedalling and throttle full on, then you'll get 20mph+ easily In pedelec mode though, about 16 or 17mph.

 

[phil]

jimmyengland - this sounds very exciting - I think what a subset of fitter electric cyclists are after is being able to augment their normal cycling by an extra 5mph even if they're able to naturally cycle at 15mph; if you're saying that, in such a situation the 905e would continue to give its "boost" then that's great (although not so great about legality); I look forward to discovering if Coractacus Potts can "augment" his 905e and, if so, may well be after some wiring diagrams / photos in anticipation of a 905e purchase! (all a bit cheeky, but maybe acceptable behaviour as originator of the thread??!) Phil

 

[jimmyengland1000]

jimmyengland - this sounds very exciting - I think what a subset of fitter electric cyclists are after is being able to augment their normal cycling by an extra 5mph even if they're able to naturally cycle at 15mph; if you're saying that, in such a situation the 905e would continue to give its "boost" then that's great (although not so great about legality); I look forward to discovering if Coractacus Potts can "augment" his 905e and, if so, may well be after some wiring diagrams / photos in anticipation of a 905e purchase! (all a bit cheeky, but maybe acceptable behaviour as originator of the thread??!) Phil

No problem. Worst case scenario is that the controller on the restricted 905e does not have the resistor.... in which case you replace the controller at a cost of £20. It's almost guaranteed to have one though and it's a 5 minute job to derestrict it......

 

[Caractacus Potts]

de-restricted

... I look forward to discovering if Coractacus Potts can "augment" his 905e

Well it worked - and how !.

I made the mods as per Jimmy's instructions (simple - just disconnect the small 'pot'). I needed a little bit of help from Jimmy to identify the wires - his were grey and mine were blue. I was just looking for a little bit more assistance in pedelec mode to offset the 'drag' effect of the battery / motor / gearing as the assistance cuts out at around 14-15 MPH as most of my cyling on the flat seems to be at around 14-15-16 MPH (headwind permitting). Well I got that and I can tell that the motor is still there at 16 now ... and then I tried the throttle - 20 mph is easily achievable pedalling with the throttle fully open on the flat.

Can't help feeling that my 40+ miles on one battery charge will suffer though . Still, so long as I can still achieve 17 miles to work all will be OK. (hopefully I'll be fine if I keep off the throttle).

Thanks again Jimmy and if anyone is thinking about making the same mod I can say that is is effective (just make sure you get the right wires - piccy below:

)

 

[jimmyengland1000]

On the 905SE, the restrictor is on grey wires as per this pic. On my 905SE, I removed it entirely (on the SE it's connected by a block connector), thus rendering the easily knocked green de-restrict button on the left handlebar redundant. I also by-passed the red pedelec on/off switch at the controller end and then removed the entire switch assembly from the handlebars.

 

[musicbooks]

On the 905SE, the restrictor is on grey wires as per this pic. On my 905SE, I removed it entirely (on the SE it's connected by a block connector), thus rendering the easily knocked green de-restrict button on the left handlebar redundant. I also by-passed the red pedelec on/off switch at the controller end and then removed the entire switch assembly from the handlebars.

Just like Bond at the end of Goldfinger..