Which e-bike for powerful/fast unassisted use and towing a luggage trailer?

Hi guys, i've just relocated to Switzerland such is the public transport and convenience of the city I live in that there is no need whatsoever for a car. Now, I am planning to buy a cheap "regular" bike for exercise/tootling around on... but I also want to invest in the most powerful e-bike possible capable of going long (around 30 miles or more) distances unassisted on a single charge, and capable of towing (with assistance when necessary) a shopping/luggage trailer like this AVENIR MULE BICYCLE LUGGAGE TRAILER :: £79.99 :: BIKE TRAILERS :: Trailers :: Southwater Cycles

Not only will this help me carry loads to friends houses etc, but it will make shopping much mor eco friendly and allow me to carry much more back up hills etc.

So in summary what i'm looking for is:

[*]The most powerful/fastest motor possible capable of unassisted travel on even roads, and capable of pulling a trolley assisted without too much hassle

[*]Reliable

[*]Looks reasonable and sleek

Any suggestions please chaps?

From what I remember of Switzerland a UK hub motor won't do the trick on the hills and the Panasonic motor won't work unassisted, you will probably need something designed for the US market.

Problem then is getting 30 miles on Swiss hills without putting in any effort, that's one hell of a battery.

From what I remember of Switzerland a UK hub motor won't do the trick on the hills and the Panasonic motor won't work unassisted, you will probably need something designed for the US market.

Problem then is getting 30 miles on Swiss hills without putting in any effort, that's one hell of a battery.

...how about the Dolphin...?

velocity

...how about the Dolphin...?

 

velocity

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is there anywhere on this site to switch it to english ?...hard to take a shine to something if i cant read anything it does..:o

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is there anywhere on this site to switch it to english ?...hard to take a shine to something if i cant read anything it does..:o

You can read quite a lot about it on the ExtraEnergy site Keith.

It's one of the very few bikes that can come anywhere near what Richdog wants, and it's Swiss so he's in the right place to buy one.

.

Richdog, I do plenty of heavy trailer load hauling when necessary, but my advice is to only use a trailer when it's essential, using large panniers whenever possible instead, since trailers bring various disadvantages.

The trailer weight to be hauled is far greater than a pannier set.

Two trailer wheels doubles the tyre drag of the bike.

I've found range with a trailer often drops by over a third from normal due to the above factors.

The bike handling and braking is far worse with a trailer.

.

You can read quite a lot about it on the ExtraEnergy site Keith.

 

It's one of the very few bikes that can come anywhere near what Richdog wants, and it's Swiss so he's in the right place to buy one.

.

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as always thanks for the solution Tony,my swiss not being up to scratch im much better in english..

Richdog, if money is no object and you want the highest powered e-bike available you can't go past the "el-cycle". This is the world's most powerful production e-bike and has a top speed of 97kph. It is entirely European designed and hand built in Austria. The company which builds them only makes a maximum of 50 cycles per year and each cycle is custom assembled from the highest quality materials.

The el-cycle has no problem at all of towing a trailer up even the steepest hills carrying a heavy load due to the 400amps peak discharge capability of the 36volt LiFePO4 battery which powers this e-bike.

You can check the specifications out on the manufacturer's website at-

el-cycles

Edited April 20, 200916 yr by BMI

Richdog, I do plenty of heavy trailer load hauling when necessary, but my advice is to only use a trailer when it's essential, using large panniers whenever possible instead, since trailers bring various disadvantages.

 

The trailer weight to be hauled is far greater than a pannier set.

 

Two trailer wheels doubles the tyre drag of the bike.

 

I've found range with a trailer often drops by over a third from normal due to the above factors.

 

The bike handling and braking is far worse with a trailer.

.

Yes, but we've seen pictures of your trailer, with a large garden shed and about half a mile of bubble wrap loaded onto it - hardly surprising that the range is somewhat compromised!

Rog.

Yes, but we've seen pictures of your trailer, with a large garden shed and about half a mile of bubble wrap loaded onto it - hardly surprising that the range is somewhat compromised!

 

Rog.

Most of the loads aren't like that Rog.

Even an empty two wheel trailer cuts range considerably and i only use a trailer when it's absolutely necessary. Below is a much better way to carry a fair amount from the speed and handling point of view:

http://users.tinyworld.co.uk/flecc/images/panniers.jpg

Most of the loads aren't like that Rog.

 

Even an empty two wheel trailer cuts range considerably and i only use a trailer when it's absolutely necessary. Below is a much better way to carry a fair amount from the speed and handling point of view:

 

Did it appear that I was being entirely serious? Shirley not!

Rog.

Did it appear that I was being entirely serious? Shirley not!

 

Rog.

No I knew you were teasing Rog, but I thought it a chance to illustrate how big panniers plus a flat load platform can enable carrying as much as many trailers, leaving out the extra tyre drag. Personally I wouldn't use the average commercial bike trailer since most carry no more than a good pannier/platform setup can cope with.

.

Richdog, if money is no object and you want the highest powered e-bike available you can't go past the "el-cycle". This is the world's most powerful production e-bike and has a top speed of 97kph. It is entirely European designed and hand built in Austria. The company which builds them only makes a maximum of 50 cycles per year and each cycle is custom assembled from the highest quality materials.

The el-cycle has no problem at all of towing a trailer up even the steepest hills carrying a heavy load due to the 400amps peak discharge capability of the 36volt LiFePO4 battery which powers this e-bike.

 

You can check the specifications out on the manufacturer's website at-

el-cycles

If it's as powerful as you say then with the size of battery in the picture the range will be about 5 miles.

was thinking the same think..........looks extremely small. Was expecting to see a beast like the E Rocket! lol

You can read quite a lot about it on the ExtraEnergy site Keith.

 

It's one of the very few bikes that can come anywhere near what Richdog wants, and it's Swiss so he's in the right place to buy one.

.

Another rather small battery (and from the company website still appears to be NiCd) so might get Richdog up one hill.

One of these with pedals on might be what he's looking for.

http://cache.jalopnik.com/images/2006/06/goldwing_tow.jpg

Edited April 20, 200916 yr by Mussels

Heinzmann do some kit motors that are more powerful than UK-legal, but you have to choose either high speed, or high torque for towing and hill climbing.

Maybe if you put a high-speed motor on the front wheel, and a high-torque one on the back, you'd be approaching Richdog's original wish list... but he'd definitely need the trailer for the shopping, because the panniers would be full of batteries.

Mary

If it's as powerful as you say then with the size of battery in the picture the range will be about 5 miles.

Looking at this page

Just Ernst's 2008 el-cycle city

they quote a top speed of 15mph and a range of 40 miles. They add that the prototype set a record of 97kmph but they don't say what the range of the prototype was.

Patrick

The "el-cycle" from Austria is supplied in two versions.

First version is the "street legal" version which is speed limited/governed to 30kph.

Second version is what the manufacturer calls the "off road" version which is speed limited/governed to 60kph.

Both models are programmed not to exceed the maximum speed through the programmable motor controller.

End of 2009 the el-cycle will have the option of being fitted with the latest model "high energy density (HED)" LiFePO4 battery which will increase battery capacity and range per charge by 20%-40% for the same phsical size battery pack. This battery is in the final testing stages now.

As mentioned with no motor speed limiting and allowing full battery voltage to reach the modified 5kW Crystalite motor the bike will reach speeds of up to 97kph.

Maybe a kit. The real problem will be getting full value out of a Lithium battery. It may die before you get a decent number of charge cycles. If you use it once a week or less, leaving it half discharged in the fridge may help, so long as you warm it up before use.

There is not much chance of the battery dieing or risk involved when it is backed by 3years/3000 cycles factory warranty. Also the cells have minimal self discharge and a fully charged cell will still have 80% of its original capacity after 2 years so even if a cell isn't used for a few weeks the miniscule amout of self discharge would not even be noticed.

The "el-cycle" from Austria is supplied in two versions.

First version is the "street legal" version which is speed limited/governed to 30kph.

Second version is what the manufacturer calls the "off road" version which is speed limited/governed to 60kph.

Both models are programmed not to exceed the maximum speed through the programmable motor controller.

End of 2009 the el-cycle will have the option of being fitted with the latest model "high energy density (HED)" LiFePO4 battery which will increase battery capacity and range per charge by 20%-40% for the same phsical size battery pack. This battery is in the final testing stages now.

As mentioned with no motor speed limiting and allowing full battery voltage to reach the modified 5kW Crystalite motor the bike will reach speeds of up to 97kph.

There are a few different battery packs/configurations available for the el-cycle. I understand the main one is a 20Ah pack. I am sure if you email the manufacturer of this bike directly they will get back to you with the battery pack specifications and range per charge with the relevant batteries.

Your posts on this thread sounded like a sales pitch talking about how great the product was with no downside. I see now from your introduction that you provide the batteries that power el-cycles, so it is an advert.

Suppliers do offer information on their products on here and that's not a problem but your connection wasn't very clear.

Mussels,

I supply loose cells to many companies and individuals all around the world. How the manufacturer in Austria of the el-cycle uses them in their own custom assembled battery packs with their own wholly designed battery management system is their busuiness and I had no input into. They are an independant manufacturer and are free to choose any brand of cells they like. I can only report on what I have heard back from this manufacturer. If the batteries were junk and were of poor quality then obviously reports would not be good and they would not want to use BMI cells. I have NEVER heard a negative report with regard to the performance of a BMI cell.

As you quite rightly point out there are always positive points as well as negative points about any product. The only negative point concerning the BMI cells and batteries is the higher initial purchase price. I am sure most people understand that any product (no matter what it is) will cost more if it is the highest quality in the market it serves. "Quality costs extra".

For example would anyone really expect a Rolls Royce to cost the same as a Toyota or a Ford?

Hey guys sorry for the dela in replying to this... had a mixture of nightmares ranging from computer issues to not having an time to do a gazillion things I want to do.

Thanks for the replies but I am not looking to tow a garden shed plus my mates overweight mother plus her seven cats... it will literally just be shopping as and when I need it, and not much in the way of hills either! The rest of the time it would be used as a "normal" assisted bike with the joy of being able to ferry me around Lake Zurich without much fuss if its a roasting summers day and I cant be arsed to exert myself (wouldnt think im in my late 20's would you). Thats why I was also looking at the Wisper 905 Sport as its capable of good assited or non-assisted travel.