What were the main worries queries you had before purchasing your e-bike?
- Thread starter Jack.Eagle
- Start date
Would it do the required job, measure up to what was wanted while still being pleasant to ride.
In this respect there's no substitute for test rides of course, for which there's often no availability without travelling long distances.
.
In this respect there's no substitute for test rides of course, for which there's often no availability without travelling long distances.
.
HiNice one Andy, and true of quite a few members.
Thing is they don't stop e-biking after getting their licences back, so perhaps more widespread driving bans are a route to popularising e-bikes.
.
the law on e-bikes is fairly confusing. The Department for Transport, released a fact sheet in January 2008, which I was told is the most up-to-date one. A copy of it is below. It is interesting to note the statement at the very bottom: "This fact sheet provides our view of the current situation but should not be taken as definitive legal advice as this is a matter for the courts."
-------------------FACT SHEET-------------------
January 2008
CONSUMER ADVICE - ELECTRICALLY ASSISTED PEDAL CYCLES (EAPCs) in GREAT BRITAIN
Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycle (an “EAPC”)
In GB, the EAPC Regulations apply to certain bicycles, tandem bicycles or tricycles fitted with pedals by means of which they are capable of being propelled. For the regulations to apply, the motor assistance must be provided by an electric motor and not by an internal combustion engine. The electric motor must not be able to propel the machine when it is travelling at more than 15mph. Furthermore, the vehicle must also meet the following requirements:
Maximum kerbside weight (including batteries but without rider) shall not exceed
- Bicycle: 40 kg - Tandem Bicycle: 60 kg - Tricycle: 60 kg
Maximum continuous rated power output of the motor shall not exceed
- Bicycle: 200W - Tandem Bicycle: 250W - Tricycle: 250W
An EAPC which complies with the above is not considered to be a motor vehicle within the meaning of The Road Traffic Act 1988. As a result, it is not required to be registered, pay vehicle excise duty (road tax) or be insured as a motor vehicle. No EAPC may be ridden by anyone under the age of 14 years.
The Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) Regulations also specify requirements for EAPCs. These include a requirement to display a plate showing the manufacturer, the nominal voltage of the battery, and the continuous rated output of the motor.
Vehicles outside the scope of the UK Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycles Regulations
A vehicle is not covered by the above exemption if it is outside the scope of the EAPC Regulations. This may be due to the motor power output, speed up to which power can be provided, weight, or that it does not have pedals by means of which the machine can be propelled. Consequently, it will need to be registered, insured and is subject to Vehicle Excise Duty (display a tax disc); the rider will need an appropriate driving licence and will have to wear an approved motorcycle safety helmet.
The requirements applicable to EAPCs outside the scope of the 1983 EAPC Regulations vary. Certain types, for example, those whose power exceeds 250 Watts may require either a European Certificate of Conformity (issued by the manufacturer as part of the “type approval” procedure) or an individual pre-registration assessment, others may be registered directly with DVLA.
Power assistance (Twist and Go)
A vehicle is not exempt from having either a European Certificate of Conformity or an individual pre-registration assessment if it is fitted with pedals and a motor that can provide power assistance at any time without the rider pedalling, or if the motor is not cut off automatically when the vehicle reaches 25km/h. However, if it is within the scope of the EAPC Regulations (see above), it still does not require registration, licensing or insurance.
Other legislation
EAPCs may also need to comply with the Electrical Equipment designed for use within certain Voltage Limits Directive 73/23/EEC (as amended) (commonly known as the Low Voltage Directive) and the Electromagnetic Compatibility Directive 89/336/EEC (as amended). Confirmation should be sought via the Department of Business Enterprise and Regulatory Reform (Local Authorities Coordinators of Regulatory Services - LACORS i.e. Trading Standards).
Access to the Regulations and Directives
(a) The Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycles Regulations 1983 – Statutory Instrument (SI 1983 No.1168), The Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1983 - Statutory Instrument (SI 1983 No. 1176), The Road Vehicles (Registration and Licensing) Regulations 2002 - Statutory Instrument 2002 No.2742 and their amendments are available from The Stationery Office (see below).
(b) Directive 2002/24/EC of the European Parliament and of the Council of 18 March 2002 relating to the type-approval of two or three-wheel motor vehicles is also available from The Stationery Office and is published on the EUR-Lex European Legislation website: EUR-Lex - Simple search
The address of the Stationery Office is: TSO Orders/ Post Cash Dept, PO Box 29, Norwich, NR3 1GN (telephone: 0870 600 5522, Virtual Bookstore: www.tso.co.uk).
Further Information
If you require any further information regarding the Regulations covered by this fact sheet, please contact the DfT at the address below:
Transport Technology and Standards 3
Department for Transport
Zone 2/04
Great Minster House Tel: 020 7944 2078
76 Marsham Street Fax: 020 7944 2196
London SW1P 4DR Email: TTS.enquiries@dft.gsi.gov.uk
Information for retailers, importers and manufacturers is available in a separate fact sheet
Statement
This fact sheet provides our view of the current situation but should not be taken as definitive legal advice as this is a matter for the courts.
What a pathetic cop-out! If they can't give definitive advice, what are they being paid for?
We are very familiar with this Jack, but the reason for prevarication is not made apparent in that statement.
It's because slightly different EU regulations were passed in 2002 which were mandatory on all member countries, which were required to implement them within six months. Our civil service messed up, arranging for parliament to put the legislation in force one day after the deadline, but also forgetting to arrange the cancellation of the British EAPC reguations.
Therefore we've had parallel laws in force ever since.
It's practically certain that a court would rule in favour of the EU law if a case arose since that clearly should be the only law having effect, but there is no certainty, hence that cautious statement. If a court ruled in favour of EU law in a test case, someone breaching that EU law would be driving a motor vehicle with all the consequences of that.
Drink driving would not normally be affected, since only the differences between the two laws would be likely to give rise to a test case.
British law says 200 watts solo, 250 watts tricycle. EU law says 250 watts.
British law permits throttle only control without pedalling, EU law says only pedelec, though it can be combined with a throttle to regulate the amount of power.
Otherwise there's no effective difference.
As a result of the Royal Mail considering buying some 16,000 e-bikes, they've asked for this legal confusion to be cleared up and this is in hand. Therefore we should just have the one EU law in force before long, and still able to plead to being drunk in charge of an e-bicycle without losing one's licence, and continue to ride one once a licence is taken away.
.
Last edited:
could I still ride a bike!.
Part of the ageing process for me, has been a slight problem with vertigo. To be honest, I can't even walk in a straight line!. Initially, I thought this might present a problem in my return to cycling.
Not wishing to make a fool of myself in public, I borrowed a folding non electric bike from a friend, chucked it into the boot, and drove to a local park where cycling was permitted. After the first few yards of frantic waggling of the front wheel to maintain balance, I quickly realised "Hey, I can still do it".
Since that first tentative ride, I have now progressed, and rapidly re-learned those subtle body movements needed in low speed control.
Regards
Bob
Part of the ageing process for me, has been a slight problem with vertigo. To be honest, I can't even walk in a straight line!. Initially, I thought this might present a problem in my return to cycling.
Not wishing to make a fool of myself in public, I borrowed a folding non electric bike from a friend, chucked it into the boot, and drove to a local park where cycling was permitted. After the first few yards of frantic waggling of the front wheel to maintain balance, I quickly realised "Hey, I can still do it".
Since that first tentative ride, I have now progressed, and rapidly re-learned those subtle body movements needed in low speed control.
Regards
Bob
Last edited:
i was concerned as to whether the bike would assist enough on hills and whether the battery would get me up the hills.Also would i get value for money over a conventional bike
Being a shortie my main issue was frame size and that is something you should really only determine in the flesh. Tried all possible e-bikes in my local area but finally took a gamble on the Pro-connect based on available advise - lucky for me it proved to be spot on.
The other main issue was support if problems occur - hopefully by the time I fall out of warrenty period the number of dealers might of grown somewhat !
The other main issue was support if problems occur - hopefully by the time I fall out of warrenty period the number of dealers might of grown somewhat !
Making the right choice.
I spent about six months deciding on my ebike.
The Pedelecs Forum proved invaluable in enabling me to make an almost perfect choice.
Unfortunately, even after all that thinking I didn't make the perfect choice as the SLA batteries made the bike very heavy and virtually unridable without power. However, in truth this boiled down to costs - what I could afford or wanted to spend.
Regrettably, there were no local ebike dealers so I had to purchase over the Internet.
I paid by credit card, in case anything strange happened to the supplier or things went horribly wrong.
The first bike arrived damage (crushed forks) and had to go back.
.
I spent about six months deciding on my ebike.
The Pedelecs Forum proved invaluable in enabling me to make an almost perfect choice.
Unfortunately, even after all that thinking I didn't make the perfect choice as the SLA batteries made the bike very heavy and virtually unridable without power. However, in truth this boiled down to costs - what I could afford or wanted to spend.
Regrettably, there were no local ebike dealers so I had to purchase over the Internet.
I paid by credit card, in case anything strange happened to the supplier or things went horribly wrong.
The first bike arrived damage (crushed forks) and had to go back.
.
Not knowing anything about the electric assist factor
As they say, its a minefield out there! The only thing I knew was that I knew nothing! As Donald Rumsfeld (google is god!) said
"There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know."
I quickly realised that my knowledge of electric bikes fell firmly into the last category. I now see the job of the senior members here to illustrate the unknown unknowns, and then tell us all about them!
Unfortunately, such is the nature of the individual that if one knew everything there was to know about electric bikes (flecc???) he or she could not recommend the perfect electric bike that would suit everybody.
The purchase of an electric bike (like a car or a computor) is a perfect example of experiencing unknown unknowns. As soon as you buy one and try it out over a reasonable period, you realise that that you didn't know exactly what you wanted when you bought it, and that there is a better one for you out there right now.
As they say, its a minefield out there! The only thing I knew was that I knew nothing! As Donald Rumsfeld (google is god!) said
"There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know."
I quickly realised that my knowledge of electric bikes fell firmly into the last category. I now see the job of the senior members here to illustrate the unknown unknowns, and then tell us all about them!
Unfortunately, such is the nature of the individual that if one knew everything there was to know about electric bikes (flecc???) he or she could not recommend the perfect electric bike that would suit everybody.
The purchase of an electric bike (like a car or a computor) is a perfect example of experiencing unknown unknowns. As soon as you buy one and try it out over a reasonable period, you realise that that you didn't know exactly what you wanted when you bought it, and that there is a better one for you out there right now.
Would it work for work
Could I really get to work without needing to change clothes on arrival, without having a necessary shower, without becoming unpresentable, without taking as long as a pushbike, without looking a complete and utter geek or misfit, without resorting to the car if the weather turned a bit bad?
Could I easily get some attention to the bike if things went wrong.
I am pleased to report the bike(a wisper) from a local supplier dispensed with all those worries
Could I really get to work without needing to change clothes on arrival, without having a necessary shower, without becoming unpresentable, without taking as long as a pushbike, without looking a complete and utter geek or misfit, without resorting to the car if the weather turned a bit bad?
Could I easily get some attention to the bike if things went wrong.
I am pleased to report the bike(a wisper) from a local supplier dispensed with all those worries
- Whether I could test ride it or not.
- Who would fix it if it went wrong.
- Availability of parts.
- Real world range and speed.
Re-assured on strength of 2reviews for agattu (flecc and a2b) and personal experience of having previosuly claimed money via small courts when someone wouldnt let me return a mail order product that wasnt suitable.
summary so far
From what I can see the many worries seem to be:
-lack of dealers for test rides
-legal situation
-range/battery life
-ability to repair and sourcing spare parts
-picking the correct bike
-would it be value for money
-would the bike fit it's desired use
many thanks for your comments I look forward to hearing more
thanks
Jack
From what I can see the many worries seem to be:
-lack of dealers for test rides
-legal situation
-range/battery life
-ability to repair and sourcing spare parts
-picking the correct bike
-would it be value for money
-would the bike fit it's desired use
many thanks for your comments I look forward to hearing more
thanks
Jack
My main concerns were reliability and an adequate spares / servicing backup.
This site became my principal source of information before I acquired an e-bike and the pearls of wisdom reflected in the various threads were most helpful.
I had serious concerns about many of the distributors who appeared to be here today gone tomorrow outfits which I suppose always is the case when relatively new products come to market - all jump in in the hope of making a quick buck and stuff the consumer when the thing goes wrong. As the market matures and there are more dedicated cycling retailers providing a full service to the customer then these worries will no doubt recede.
Allied to this is the location of most of the manufacturers in China and the fear of a lack of spares being readily available or not available at all as the manufacturer has changed spec. The U.K. must be a pretty small market in global terms and our current legislation does nothing to help and the sooner EU regulations are adopted the better as we will then become part of a much bigger EU market place for Chinese manufacturers who don't have to modify their products for little old England.
This site became my principal source of information before I acquired an e-bike and the pearls of wisdom reflected in the various threads were most helpful.
I had serious concerns about many of the distributors who appeared to be here today gone tomorrow outfits which I suppose always is the case when relatively new products come to market - all jump in in the hope of making a quick buck and stuff the consumer when the thing goes wrong. As the market matures and there are more dedicated cycling retailers providing a full service to the customer then these worries will no doubt recede.
Allied to this is the location of most of the manufacturers in China and the fear of a lack of spares being readily available or not available at all as the manufacturer has changed spec. The U.K. must be a pretty small market in global terms and our current legislation does nothing to help and the sooner EU regulations are adopted the better as we will then become part of a much bigger EU market place for Chinese manufacturers who don't have to modify their products for little old England.
Main concerns were:
Will the bike actually work as well as I need it to, i.e. enable me to commute 28 miles a day, including some fairly steep hills, in reasonable time and without being too hard for me to face every day?
Is a bike actually a viable form of day to day transport in the UK, given the weather and high levels of traffic, i.e. for someone who is not a hardcore cycling fanatic?
£1400 was a big investment for me to make - I couldn't afford the bike to become a white elephant.
Will the bike actually work as well as I need it to, i.e. enable me to commute 28 miles a day, including some fairly steep hills, in reasonable time and without being too hard for me to face every day?
Is a bike actually a viable form of day to day transport in the UK, given the weather and high levels of traffic, i.e. for someone who is not a hardcore cycling fanatic?
£1400 was a big investment for me to make - I couldn't afford the bike to become a white elephant.