What Is The Best Value German Bike Electric Bike?

C

Cyclezee

Guest
I think there may be confusion because of this:
Ansmann electric bike kit from BTN, View Ansmann electric bike kit, BTN Product Details from Hangzhou Minrui Trading Co., Ltd. on Alibaba.com

Ansmann is foremost a consumer battery company with manufacturing factory in China, from their website, last year turnover of 51 Million Euros, employing 185 people in Germany, the rest in China.
I watched the company's videos, they have a German attitude to quality control, design and processes. Personally, I think that they are excellent.
Thanks for pointing that out TREX, the kit from BTN is not a genuine ANSMANN one, they have clearly copied some info and photos from ANSMANN's website, but the kit shown at the top is incorrect.

If anyone were to buy that kit with a quoted FOB price of $300 to $400, then after adding shipping, import duty and VAT etc., it would not be far short of the UK retail price for a genuine kit. There is also no mention of warranty.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

trex

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 15, 2011
7,703
2,671
there is however, a difference between type-A motor and type-C motor/kit.
Type C has Ansmann name and logo everywhere, type A does not.
 
C

Cyclezee

Guest
there is however, a difference between type-A motor and type-C motor/kit.
Type C has Ansmann name and logo everywhere, type A does not.
ANSMANN is engraved on the casing of type-A motor. The type-C motor is made by GO Swissdrive.
 
A point of view fairly made, but far from correct.
Your point about me not supporting UK bike shops is even wider of the mark.
Sorry I've read my post back, and I wasn't clear about what I meant... whilst your purchase of the bike has bypassed everyone in the UK industry I shouldn't have tried to suggest YOU weren't supporting the UK cycling industry...

I meant ROSE and other brands like them were, by cutting out the retailers from the supply chain are bypassing the UK cycle industry, whilst at the same time expecting the retailers they are cutting out, to be happy to support their customers.
 

trex

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 15, 2011
7,703
2,671
...
I meant ROSE and other brands like them were, by cutting out the retailers from the supply chain are bypassing the UK cycle industry, whilst at the same time expecting the retailers they are cutting out, to be happy to support their customers.
That is an unsupported generalisation.
My LBS sells e-bikes and does not care where I got my bike from whenever I pop in at his shop for advice on something.
Rose customers are happy with the efficient service they receive directly from the manufacturers.
May be you try to justify that you sell bikes and have no stock of spares?
 

trex

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 15, 2011
7,703
2,671
who's told you we don't have stock of spares?? We have massive stock of spares available to all our dealers, from a huge range of branded and own brand components, including eBike parts.
On post #38, Electrifying Cycles said:

Trex is a nice idea but can not see it happening.

We are always happy to take phone calls from customers with queries.

The biggest reason I can not see this happening is cost, people already think prices are too high. Also most distributers are probably not large enough to do this and am sure they would not do it outside of office hours e.g. Saturdays.

Distributers for Bosch bikes do not carry spare parts which is why us and others keep stock themselves. We also stock other parts which our distributers would not stock.

We have had the occasional technical issue with bikes bought a fair distance from us and have normally managed to solve these remotely.

Re Rose sounds like good service. Whether you are local or not people will not go back if you do not provide a good service.
Also, check this link:
http://companycheck.co.uk/company/06549037/FLI-DISTRIBUTION-LIMITED/financial-accounts#company-accounts
 
interesting.

I can't comment on other brands, but there have been two issues with KTM / Bosch / Electrifying cycles.

1) they were trying to warranty a Bosch part.... to do this the part has to come back for us or go direct to KTM or Bosch to look at before it can be replaced.

The customer if I remember correctly seemed to be expecting a new bike because there was a problem with a single part, which I'm afraid just can't happen. Lots of people like to use the car analogies, so to help explain things, its like buying a new car, doing 1000 miles and then because there is a fault with something, expecting the car company to give you a fully new car. What has to happen is the car goes back to have the faulty part replaced, you don't get a full new bike.

if a brand new bike is faulty (happened once - with a Bionx system) we have just shipped a replacement bike to ensure the dealer / customer were happy.

In the specific case you've mentioned above the dealer Electrifying Cycles operated well above their legal requirements under warranty work and as I understand it, its all solved now.

2) in the second case with that dealer Electrifying Cycles were trying to get hold of a spare battery for a Bosch bike... we had a Bosch account at the time when they didn't so, they ordered it from us. Bosch were our of stock, so as soon as they got some we supplied the dealer.

and looking at our accounts isn't going to help you. Nothing we hold here or in Europe counts as our stock so its not on our books.
 

Electrifying Cycles

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 4, 2011
1,005
176
I was not relating it to the warranty of a part, I was talking about how spares should be carried locally so that customers have reduced waiting times (i.e. not talking about that specific warranty case). In particular a better flow for warranty issues would be - dealer finds faulty part - replaces part (from UK source - dealer or distributer) - faulty part sent to Magura/Bosch for testing - Magura send replacement part (part goes into dealers stock). This means the customer gets back on the road quicker.

My post is correct I am aware of no UK distrubuter carrying spare parts related to Bosch items (i.e. components related to the electric drive system). Magura provide spare parts for Bosch bikes but we prefer to keep stock of some items ourselves. No distributer of Bosch bikes keeps them in stock. I was referring specifically to Bosch parts (e.g. spider, spider tool etc) not other standard parts which are available through KTM but come from Austria (i.e. not stocked in the UK). The point I was making is other brands we carry stock spare e bike related parts and do not think Bosch powered bikes should be different so we carry spares ourselves.

Actually incorrect regarding battery, we waited months before you found that you had not paid Magura and that is why we had not recieved the battery, we spent much time phoning and emailing you to find why it was taking so long. This was before we had an account with Magura and if we had of known we would have ordered through Magura ourselves, it would have been quicker. Batteries normally take a maximum of two weeks to arrive.
 
Last edited:
I was not relating it to the warranty of a part, I was talking about how spares should be carried locally so that customers have reduced waiting times (i.e. not talking about that specific warranty case). In particular a better flow for warranty issues would be - dealer finds faulty part - replaces part (from UK source - dealer or distributer) - faulty part sent to Magura/Bosch for testing - Magura send replacement part (part goes into dealers stock). This means the customer gets back on the road quicker.
ok, thats easier to answer then.

that is how it works, but in each stage it can only be replaced quickly if the contact at that point has stock.

ie, customer returns part to shop... if the shop has stock it can be switched, immediately

if the shop doesnt have stock, they have to go to the supplier, if they have stock, a replacement is generally shipped next day, but on the condition that the faulty part needs to be sent back to be checked. If the part is repairable, then a replacement won't be sent, the part will simply be fixed. Warranty is repair or replace.

We ship replacement parts as soon as we have a photo and a completed warranty returns form, we don't even had to have the faulty part back first. However if the faulty part doesnt ever come back, or turns out not to be faulty the dealer is invoiced.

My post is correct I am aware of no UK distrubuter carrying spare parts related to Bosch items (i.e. components related to the electric drive system). Magura provide spare parts for Bosch bikes but we prefer to keep stock of some items ourselves. No distributer of Bosch bikes keeps them in stock. I was referring specifically to Bosch parts (e.g. spider, spider tool etc) not other standard parts which are available through KTM but come from Austria (i.e. not stocked in the UK). The point I was making is other brands we carry stock spare e bike related parts and do not think Bosch powered bikes should be different so we carry spares ourselves.
no brand can stock all parts for all bikes, and all the tools that are required to service them all. Does anyone? We already carry something like 50,000 product lines of parts, which is more than most brands I've worked with in the past, or have any experience of.

we have lots of bosch specific things in at the moment, including batteries. But surely with any component brand, if you want spares or tools you are best buying them from the people who distribute the component brand, not expecting the bike brand to hold everything. I can understand that with budget bikes that don't have branded components, ie just come complete from the far east, the bike brand has to have everything, because no one else will carry those specific parts. However with a premium brand of bike you wouldn't go to the bike brand for new tyres, or new grips, so I'm interested why you would go to them for new eBike drive bits, there is no difference a component is a component.


Actually incorrect regarding battery, we waited months before you found that you had not paid Magura and that is why we had not recieved the battery, we spent much time phoning and emailing you to find why it was taking so long. This was before we had an account with Magura and if we had of known we would have ordered through Magura ourselves, it would have been quicker. Batteries normally take a maximum of two weeks to arrive.
We made a mistake with that Bosch battery order, trying to help out as a middle man... There was a slight delay with us paying, but this was because we didn't know the battery was ready to ship (communication problems with germany is not unusual as I'm sure anyone dealing with bosch will agree with), but this only added a couple of days to the long wait, however we are no longer doing this as a direct result of our experience with your case. We supply products from our stock, and if we don't have stock we can put any dealer in touch with Bosch or indeed any supplier so you can have your own account.
 

trex

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 15, 2011
7,703
2,671
...


I can understand that with budget bikes that don't have branded components, ie just come complete from the far east, the bike brand has to have everything, because no one else will carry those specific parts. However with a premium brand of bike you wouldn't go to the bike brand for new tyres, or new grips, so I'm interested why you would go to them for new eBike drive bits, there is no difference a component is a component.
...
The gist of this statement is:
if you, the customer, buy a Chinese bike, you can expect the importer to have all the parts and all the tools for servicing but not if you buy a German bike?

Totally illogical.
 
The gist of this statement is:
if you, the customer, buy a Chinese bike, you can expect the importer to have all the parts and all the tools for servicing but not if you buy a German bike?

Totally illogical.
no not really, its just how systems work. everyone in the bike trade is part of it.

you as a customers, should deal with the shop you bought it from...

then dealers deal with the brands that are on that bike.

with name brand parts there are companies who take responsibility for back up, stock and servicing / warranty.

Ie if you have a Ritchey stem on your bike and there is a problem, there is a company in the UK who's job it is is to look after Ritchey stuff.

the same as if you have a problem with a Bosch system, Bosch / Magura are there to support the product with knowledge / stock and everything else... far more stock and knowledge than any bike brand could have.

If you buy a chinese bike, then the shop will have to go to the bike brand for everything.

Just as the shop has to go to the bike brand for any own brand, or brand specific stuff.

in practice the premium model should be better providing all the brands do their job, as the shop will get better support from better products from the people with the best knowledge.

its not a big deal, I'm just trying to explain why BIKE distributors don't hold stock or tools for brand name components, its because part of the contract with the component brand is that they handle spares and warranty work.
 

Electrifying Cycles

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 4, 2011
1,005
176
ok, thats easier to answer then.

that is how it works, but in each stage it can only be replaced quickly if the contact at that point has stock.

ie, customer returns part to shop... if the shop has stock it can be switched, immediately

if the shop doesnt have stock, they have to go to the supplier, if they have stock, a replacement is generally shipped next day, but on the condition that the faulty part needs to be sent back to be checked. If the part is repairable, then a replacement won't be sent, the part will simply be fixed. Warranty is repair or replace.

We ship replacement parts as soon as we have a photo and a completed warranty returns form, we don't even had to have the faulty part back first. However if the faulty part doesnt ever come back, or turns out not to be faulty the dealer is invoiced.



no brand can stock all parts for all bikes, and all the tools that are required to service them all. Does anyone? We already carry something like 50,000 product lines of parts, which is more than most brands I've worked with in the past, or have any experience of.

we have lots of bosch specific things in at the moment, including batteries. But surely with any component brand, if you want spares or tools you are best buying them from the people who distribute the component brand, not expecting the bike brand to hold everything. I can understand that with budget bikes that don't have branded components, ie just come complete from the far east, the bike brand has to have everything, because no one else will carry those specific parts. However with a premium brand of bike you wouldn't go to the bike brand for new tyres, or new grips, so I'm interested why you would go to them for new eBike drive bits, there is no difference a component is a component.


We made a mistake with that Bosch battery order, trying to help out as a middle man... There was a slight delay with us paying, but this was because we didn't know the battery was ready to ship (communication problems with germany is not unusual as I'm sure anyone dealing with bosch will agree with), but this only added a couple of days to the long wait, however we are no longer doing this as a direct result of our experience with your case. We supply products from our stock, and if we don't have stock we can put any dealer in touch with Bosch or indeed any supplier so you can have your own account.
Not correct it added weeks minimum.

Do not expect everything but it makes sense to hold most Bosch electric parts. I would go to them for for example a pedal sensor - not something a normal distrbuter stocks. That is the point I do not expect them to hold tyres etc. I was talking about parts related to the drive system i.e. speed sensor, intuvia display etc. If the part is a standard bike part then this is not normally an issue. Also if it is a non warranty issue then again you do not want to be waiting a long time e.g. after warranty period. Also for most items (non KTM branded) you would refer us to the product manufacturer or distributer rather than yourselves e.g. Bosch/Magura. The service you recieve is dependant on each individual company.
 
Last edited:
Do not expect everything but it makes sense to hold most Bosch electric parts. I would go to them for for example a pedal sensor - not something a normal distrbuter stocks. That is the point I do not expect them to hold tyres etc. I was talking about parts related to the drive system i.e. speed sensor, intuvia display etc. If the part is a standard bike part then this is not normally an issue. Also if it is a non warranty issue then again you do not want to be waiting a long time e.g. after warranty period. Also for most items (non KTM branded) you would refer us to the product manufacturer or distributer rather than yourselves e.g. Bosch/Magura.
yes, but what I'm trying to find out is why you think Bosch parts are any different to anything else on a bike?

Many eBike brands have their own drive systems and they are therefore own brand parts, and therefore the bike brand has the spares... so the bike brand handles it.

The Bosch drive system, is exactly the same as a set of tyres or suspension forks in that they are stand alone brands, and therefore the support structure is different, and why you won't find many bike brands who use Bosch holding stock of many of the spares. Bosch is a stand alone brand.
 

trex

Esteemed Pedelecer
May 15, 2011
7,703
2,671
yes, but what I'm trying to find out is why you think Bosch parts are any different to anything else on a bike?

Many eBike brands have their own drive systems and they are therefore own brand parts, and therefore the bike brand has the spares... so the bike brand handles it.

The Bosch drive system, is exactly the same as a set of tyres or suspension forks in that they are stand alone brands, and therefore the support structure is different, and why you won't find many bike brands who use Bosch holding stock of many of the spares. Bosch is a stand alone brand.
I understand your logic now but it's boring and we still don't know which bike is the current Best Value German Bike Electric Bike.
 

Electrifying Cycles

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 4, 2011
1,005
176
True but we have a similar situation with other brands and they do stock spare parts so that does not hold water. These cost up to £1700.

Bosch is different as other brands are more readily available and normally have a UK supplier, Bosch do not.

Service by different brands varies with NuVinci software issue we spoke to company who make the bikes and they provided us with the programme so we could update software. This was a premium brand. Sometimes it is useful to speak to manufactuer as they know the entire product not one element of it.
 
True but we have a similar situation with other brands and they do stock spare parts so that does not hold water. These cost up to £1700.
if you dont mind me asking, what brand is the drive on the bike?

Bosch is different as other brands are more readily available and normally have a UK supplier, Bosch do not.
this is very true, and one of the reasons we're increasing the number of spares we do hold to support dealers, but in reality the requirement for bosch warranty work is very very small, we've only had 3 or 4 issues in 18 months and only 2 of these actually required parts to be replaced.

Service by different brands varies with NuVinci software issue we spoke to company who make the bikes and they provided us with the programme so we could update software. This was a premium brand. Sometimes it is useful to speak to manufactuer as they know the entire product not one element of it.
again very true, and if you'd have asked us, we could provide the NuVinchi software. Every brand is different and how they support their products also varies.
 

Electrifying Cycles

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jun 4, 2011
1,005
176
Drive was TranzX who provides entire drive system like Bosch. Also all other brands we stock normally carry stock of all electric parts, some even go beyond that. If you have only had a few problems then it means you do not need to carry a massive amount of stock, as number of problems is low.
 
C

Cyclezee

Guest
I understand your logic now but it's boring and we still don't know which bike is the current Best Value German Bike Electric Bike.
Hmm, thought that I had alluded to that with my OP............must try harder:(
 

Davestrong

Finding my (electric) wheels
Sep 29, 2013
5
6
West Sussex
I have owned an Ansmann FT 15 Trek for the last couple of months and am slowly building up to a trip down the West coast of France to Spain in the spring.

So far it has been faultless. Great build quality, excellent 27 gear system. Light enough to use without power on the flat or when the wind is with you but great boost through the battery powered front hub when required. Battery life also excellent. I far prefer it to my previous bike, a Kalkhoff Agattu. Hope this is helpful.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mike63 and Cyclezee