Torq front wheel judder

[skoolrun]

I recently returned my 2nd hand Torq to 50cycles for a service and have a couple of issues sorted, one of which was, what I understand is a common problem, front wheel judder when braking. Picked up the bike today and judder is still present. I have been assured that this is OK and a common issue, I am however disappointed that an otherwise excellent bike to ride provides a somewhat disconcerting experience when the front brake is applied, with much flexing of the front forks. The Torq that a took a test ride on had barely perceptible judder and I expected mine to be reduced to a similar level once 50cycles had undertaken any necessary adjustments. Have others had similar experience? What is an acceptable level of judder and are there any easy solutions? Is there anywhere to go for a second opinion. I don't thing I can ask the AA for a report .

 

[Ian]

It is a common problem skoolrun but not one that affects all Torqs and a visit to any cycling forum will show that it's not only ebikes that are affected. My own Torq suffers from it intermittently, improved but not eliminated since fitting a Shimano Deore XT V brake, nowadays I just clean the rims frequently which keeps it at bay. Other users have tried various fixes but I'm not aware of anyone finding a permanent solution. the strange thing is that some users have never experienced it. It may be related to the tension of the front spokes but I'm not about to tinker with a very true wheel in the hope of fixing what to me is a minor problem.

50cycles were fitting an alternative brake lever in an attempt to cure it, but I understand that was not sucsessful in many cases.

 

[flecc]

It's one of the oddities of the Torq that some judder, some don't.

My one never did, but perversely my Quando was plagued by it, and it's been a well known problem ever since the introduction of alloy rims many years ago. But there's no doubt the Torq is troubled with it more than usual, and there seem to be a number of factors, probably the fork flexing and motor weight coupled with the wheel build being important ones.

Changing the brake pads can help matters, but there's no one type which is the best, it varies with each bike. However, the long pad types are much better than the standard short ones, and I've found Shimano's pads best.

With those I've reduced some bad cases to just an initial snatch which is easily controlled with a firm application of pressure initially.
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[skoolrun]

Ian/flecc many thanks for the information at least I now know that it is not just my bike. Trust me to end up with one that judders In the first instance I will try different pads as you suggest, will it be obvious which ones to get or do I need a specific Shimano product?

 

[flecc]

I think any one for alloy rims should be ok, Shimano seem to get their pad materials more right than the others.
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[Ian]

The Deore XT long cartridge pad set is type S70C part number Y-8CX98010, the same pads are probably used on other Shimano V brakes though.

Beware of cheap imitations though.

 

[flecc]

This page shows them at Wiggle where you can buy direct:

Shimano XT Cartridges

2 to 7 days delay for new stock though.
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[HarryB]

When I first took delivery of my Torq the forks juddered horribly and it was virtually un-ridable - I like you was disapointed. However 15 month on and I suffer from no judder what so ever, so there is hope. In terms of fork judder the brake lever replacement is a bit of a red herring in my view. However the original levers have the wrong leverage so it is worth replacing them with any V brake levers (but you will have to ditch the cut out switches) - this will improve the power and feel of the brakes and if you can get them from 50 cycles so much the better. Longer brake pads do help but they don't last very long. My solution was to fit hydraulic Magura brakes (£35 and about 40 minutes to fit). These are exceptionally powerful, long lasting and I am very happy with the result.

 

[skoolrun]

This page shows them at Wiggle where you can buy direct:

Shimano XT Cartridges

2 to 7 days delay for new stock though.
.

Many thanks for the link, if I am unable to source them locally I will give them a try.

 

[skoolrun]

When I first took delivery of my Torq the forks juddered horribly and it was virtually un-ridable - I like you was disapointed. However 15 month on and I suffer from no judder what so ever, so there is hope. In terms of fork judder the brake lever replacement is a bit of a red herring in my view. However the original levers have the wrong leverage so it is worth replacing them with any V brake levers (but you will have to ditch the cut out switches) - this will improve the power and feel of the brakes and if you can get them from 50 cycles so much the better. Longer brake pads do help but they don't last very long. My solution was to fit hydraulic Magura brakes (£35 and about 40 minutes to fit). These are exceptionally powerful, long lasting and I am very happy with the result.

Thanks for the information and your experience of a positive outcome. I will start off simply and play around with pads and if this is unsuccessful I may well take a more drastic route and change the system. Fortunately cut out switches are not an issue as not fitted to mine (April 07 model). I hold out little hope with 50cycles as although their tech guy was very helpful I got the impression his hands were tied. I must say however that if the fault was with a vehicle under warranty I would expect it to be rectified. I have found adds for magura HS33 (£58.49) and wondered if this was the one you used? As an aside I have found that short bursts of breaking pressure does reduce the problem. Reminds me of pumping the brakes on my first mini van back in the 60s but that was to make them work at all

 

[flecc]

The Magura model that Harry fitted I found was listed as discontinued a little while later on a UK internet site. However, it was still listed as the type fitted to the eZee Forza, so they still had them available in China at that time.

You may need the slightly more expensive one if it is discontinued.

As you say, pumping does work, and another technique on dry roads is to use initial very fierce pressure, easing off a bit immediately. That seems to change the judder into an initial snatch and then smooth operation. A dodgy method on a wet road though.
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[hobo1]

Magura HS11 EVO 11 Still available @ Europes largest Online Bike store - Buy Online. £39.99 & free delivery.

Cheers, David.

 

[flecc]

Thanks David, I was a bit suspicious of the "discontinued" with eZee still using that model.
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[HarryB]

Judder

Magura HS11 EVO 11 Still available @ Europes largest Online Bike store - Buy Online. £39.99 & free delivery.

Cheers, David.

Yes this is where I got my brakes - prices up by a fiver but still good value. Highly recommended but yes, worth trying other solutions like new brake pads first. I gave my headstock bearings a really good tighten and that certainly helped. Things may improve as the brake surfaces wear over time.

 

[skoolrun]

Many thanks all for the information and links, I hope that I can resolve this issue one way or another otherwise I think I will be considering rear wheel drive for any future purchase.