Tongsheng 48v 750w versions

[Domm]

Hi, has anyone tried one of these?

I've seen them discussed at lower power on the forums and I'm considering trying one over the bafang bbs mid drives as people say the ride is more intuitive and "bike like" due to the torque sensing.

If i was to want to ride one legally on UK roads what would i have to do to make it legal? I'd like to benefit from a more robust construction in general and more torque to drag me up hills rather than more speed. Although it would be nice perhaps to have it to try as an option on occasion when away from uk or on private land with owners permission etc. The kits are all very similarly priced so it seems like you might as well get the most for your money.

I'm 6'5" and 110kg so i dont want to waste money on something that will be underpowered for me so will either not work or burn out /break quickly trying to drag my weight around but I dont want to risk legal trouble if im on a uk road and a motorist knocks me off and the bike is investigated for example.

So i wondered if there was an way to have the best of both worlds and legalise these kits when required eg swopping controllers or something?

Thanks!

 

[Wicky]

Get a legal torquey 250W kit / equipped bike as they can when required pump out 750W when you need it up the hills & into headwinds etc.

That way you won'y have to worry about registration plates, MOT & insurance, crash lid etc.

Have you test ridden any pedelecs to see how they perform?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

The answer to your question is no. There's no way to make a 750w kit legal. You need a motor that's stamped or otherwise identified as 250w. Em3ev sell a 25 amp Bafang BBS02 that's marked 250w, which should give you what you want.

 

[tommie]

The answer to your question is no. There's no way to make a 750w kit legal. You need a motor that's stamped or otherwise identified as 250w. Em3ev sell a 25 amp Bafang BBS02 that's marked 250w, which should give you what you want.

We no longer have any kits marked as 250W, but we can provide 250W labels.

What would we do without Labels?

 

[Domm]

No ive not test ridden any. Im just going on what ive read. I should really get around to that though i agree.

If a label is all thats required couldnt anything just be re-labeled?

Surely that wouldn't fool anyone though? Although obviously no desire to fool anyone is either expressed or implied, just curious.

 

[Woosh]

If a label is all thats required couldnt anything just be re-labeled?

no, you can't. You have to be the motor manufacturer to supply the label, otherwise, it is not worth the paper it's printed on.

 

[Domm]

So assuming either bafang or tongsheng supply the label?

 

[Woosh]

So assuming either bafang or tongsheng supply the label?

you tell them what you want on the label when ordering.

 

[anotherkiwi]

Knowing that Bafang doesn't deal directly with end users or even small re-sellers, they only talk to the big fish.

If you kill someone with your bike the police might peel away the sticker to see what is underneath. If you ride responsibly nobody will even think of looking at your motor let alone a sticker. Just don't pass any police cars going up hill at 60 km/h without pedalling for example...

 

[Domm]

Oh, sounds easy then. I wonder if anyone has tried the tongsheng in anything other than 250w. Hope they'll see this thread and give their opinion if so.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

No ive not test ridden any. Im just going on what ive read. I should really get around to that though i agree.

If a label is all thats required couldnt anything just be re-labeled?

Surely that wouldn't fool anyone though? Although obviously no desire to fool anyone is either expressed or implied, just curious.

That could be construed as fraud, which carries a much bigger penalty than using an illegal ebike.

 

[Domm]

That could be construed as fraud, which carries a much bigger penalty than using an illegal ebike.

So how is that different to the bafang you mentioned supplied by Em3ve? Sorry if I'm missing something here!

 

[Deleted member 4366]

So how is that different to the bafang you mentioned supplied by Em3ve? Sorry if I'm missing something here!

The manufacturer says that the Bafang is rated at 250w. how or why they do that is not our concern. We're not qualified or authorised to change the rating of a motor. If you removed 500w markings from a motor and put your own label on, that's a fraudulent misrepresentation of its power rating.

 

[Domm]

The manufacturer says that the Bafang is rated at 250w. how or why they do that is not our concern. We're not qualified or authorised to change the rating of a motor. If you removed 500w markings from a motor and put your own label on, that's a fraudulent misrepresentation of its power rating.

I guess it's tommie's reply in post 4 thats confusing me then as it sounds like the manufacturer no longer labels them 250w and just supplies a label?

 

[anotherkiwi]

I guess it's tommie's reply in post 4 thats confusing me then as it sounds like the manufacturer no longer labels them 250w and just supplies a label?

That is correct:

The Bafang 36V 250-500W BBS02 Ebike Kit with ebike battery pack option

We no longer have any kits marked as 250W, but we can provide 250W labels. So, you can have the more powerful and robust 500W kit, and have it detuned to 250W or 350W power levels, as you require. Or run it at the full 25A and have the 500W rating (~900W Max input power) if preferred.

All our stock is the latest version, with the revised case design and with GearSensor connector.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

That is correct:

The Bafang 36V 250-500W BBS02 Ebike Kit with ebike battery pack option

We no longer have any kits marked as 250W, but we can provide 250W labels. So, you can have the more powerful and robust 500W kit, and have it detuned to 250W or 350W power levels, as you require. Or run it at the full 25A and have the 500W rating (~900W Max input power) if preferred.

All our stock is the latest version, with the revised case design and with GearSensor connector.

Just to make it clear, the manufacturer is authorised to mark the motor 250w. You are not. There's no legal way to use, as a pedelec, a detuned 500w motor, whatever label you put on it. The only question is whether you would get caught.

 

[Domm]

Oh, but in this case the motor is marked 250W "by the manufacturer" as they supply the label?

Are there any other contradictory markings on the motor? Because if not who's to say who stuck on the label as long as it is an official one?

Ok, hopefully I'm getting there...So if i buy one of these kits and ask for this "250W" version and i have it labeled as such but have a 25A controller and a decent (48V?) battery it is still legal but can be adjusted in power levels if required?

Or would i need a seperate, limited, (lower amp?) controller (and battery?) for uk road use? Is that what "detuning" is?

Also, if i can get tongsheng to do the same and state that I'm getting a "250W" version of their motor which is labeled as such by them but can potentially handle more power eg 25A this is the same thing and uk road legal but capable of more if needed in other (eg non uk or private land with owner permission) situations?

Or would they both be legal if marked 250w by the manufacturers no matter what controllers/batteries were used?

Thanks again for your help navigating this minefield!

 

[anotherkiwi]

Just to make it clear, the manufacturer is authorised to mark the motor 250w. You are not. There's no legal way to use, as a pedelec, a detuned 500w motor, whatever label you put on it. The only question is whether you would get caught.

In this case it is the retailler and (s)he is not allowed to either.

Quite frankly I think that 700-800 W peak is plenty on a road bike, that is what the GSM puts out with a 44.4v battery and a 15A controller. I am 80 kg (off season weight ) and that is enough for 45 km/h on the flat. I don't think the 18A version of the BBS02 will disappoint you at legal road speeds, you need to find a compromise between raw power and range.

As for getting caught I don't think that there is much risk. Here in France for example, the police would probably first have to get all the tuned "49cc" mopeds with illegal, noisy exhausts off the streets before they start looking at the labels on pedelec motors...

 

[Deleted member 4366]

The only restrictions on the whole electrical system system are that the motor has to be rated at 250w or less and the maximum voltage allowed is 48v. There's no limit to how much current you run through the motor. Speed has to be limited to 25 km/h and "off road" switches that release the limit are not allowed.