testing controller output

[mike thompson]

Ive acquired a conv-e controller without the motor. Id like to check it works. The battery charges and all the cells have good voltage. I figured if I put 5v and 0v on the hall sensor pins ( not 000 or 555 ) and put 5v on the throttle pin with earth connected I should see volts out on the g, b, y phase pins but I dont, they are all 0v.
Does it need a load to work.?

 

[Woosh]

the controller is a computer, the phase pins are normally not connected to the battery until the controller has passed all the checks.
Don't connect 5V to anything without having understood the schematic diagram (which you don't even have)!
BTW, if you have understood the diagram, you wouldn't want to connect 5V to any of the signal pins in the first place.

 

[JuicyBike]

Ive acquired a conv-e controller without the motor. Id like to check it works. The battery charges and all the cells have good voltage. I figured if I put 5v and 0v on the hall sensor pins ( not 000 or 555 ) and put 5v on the throttle pin with earth connected I should see volts out on the g, b, y phase pins but I dont, they are all 0v.
Does it need a load to work.?

It's not quite that simple.
Most systems only allow throttles to work when the pedals are turning. To recognise that the pedals are currently being turned the pedal sensor is required to send two or three signals to the controller before any power is sent to the motor...
Those signals are generated when a magnet passes the pedal hall sensor.
Also, you need to be very careful not to prolong any connection to any external hall sensor for risk of burning them and be especially careful not to inadvertently connect them to a higher voltage (12, 36 or 48).

 

[Nealh]

For hall testing you need to wire up controller battery and motor, black probe to gnd wire and then red probe to red wire, you should see 5v. To test other halls halls Black to gnd and red to each colour, rotate motor to se 0 - 5v as halls switch.

You can test throttle, connect battery to controller connect throttle. Black probe to gnd wire and red probe to red you will see 5v, now black probe to gnd and red probe to other coloured wire you should see about 1v open throttle and voltage should rise to about 4 - 5v.
Do the same for PAS.

Controller uses circuitry to switch and control voltage don't directly apply volts to halls.

 

[mike thompson]

I am not testing the hall sensors, I dont have a wheel or a motor. I am simulating the output of the hall sensors by putting a voltage into the controller on the correct pins. The conv -e does not have pedal sensor input. I am trying to understand why there would not be a voltage on the phase pins if a voltage is put on the throttle input pin ( I dont have a throttle either )

 

[Woosh]

I am not testing the hall sensors, I dont have a wheel or a motor. I am simulating the output of the hall sensors by putting a voltage into the controller on the correct pins. The conv -e does not have pedal sensor input. I am trying to understand why there would not be a voltage on the phase pins if a voltage is put on the throttle input pin ( I dont have a throttle either )

you can't test a controller by checking the phase wires. They receive 20ms-50ms pulses from the controller. If you see a static voltage on those pins, then some of the FETs have died.

 

[JuicyBike]

I am not testing the hall sensors, I dont have a wheel or a motor. I am simulating the output of the hall sensors by putting a voltage into the controller on the correct pins. The conv -e does not have pedal sensor input. I am trying to understand why there would not be a voltage on the phase pins if a voltage is put on the throttle input pin ( I dont have a throttle either )

Your problem is that your controller needs a signal from the motor sensors to determine which motor phase circuit to power.
A throttle may not work unless the controller had received several signals triggered by the pedal sensor too.
I commend your determination but you might save a lot of time if you fit your wheel and pedal sensor to the system also alongside your virtual throttle.

 

[Woosh]

Mike,
this is the Conv-E:

The motor cable has 3 pins, the green socket accepts a twist throttle and on/off switch:

you need that twist throttle, you can't use the kit without it.

The yellow socket accepts a pedal sensor. You may be able to buy something similar on ebay.

You should post lots of pictures of your kit here, some members may be able to help.

 

[mike thompson]

Thanks for replies. My conv-e is older , does not have the yellow connector. When the wheel is stopped the hall sensors must have a fixed voltage , a combination of 5v, 0v, 0v to represent the section it is stopped at , therefore a phase voltage surely must occur to start the motor. I have an oscilloscope. I have applied 5v to the throttle input of the controller so shouldnt need a throttle. By checking the resistance to ground and to power on each phase pin they are all 10k, the fets are not blown. All 3 phases aee showing 0v

 

[Nealh]

Not tried checking voltage on phase wires without a motor connected.
You can try a simple test though to see if it works, you will need a throttle.
Black probe to Gnd and red probe to a phase wire, operate throttle and if it works you will see a third of the battery SOC voltage across each wire actuating the throttle.

Be very careful not to allow phases to short or the controller will be toast.

 

[mike thompson]

Thanks, I uploaded a file (coveconn.jpg), new to forum so not sure where to view. There are 3 connectors, red one just for charging. The motor connector has 8 pins: 3 phase, 3 hall sensor and 5v, 0v for hall power. The green throttle connector uses four pins: 5v, 0v, throttle input, and 36v ( presumably to show charged state on throttle leds). I am putting 5v across throttle input and 0v pin to simulate full throttle. On the motor connector I put 5v , 0v, 0v combination on the hall sensor pins to simulate a rotation position ( ground attached to the 0v pin of the hall sensor power ground pin so grounds are linked). I figured this represents a stationary state of a wheel so on twist and go I should see something on one of the phase wires trying to turn the motor?
I appreciate I really need a throttle and a brushless motor in a wheel, situation is I inherited controller with good battery and trying to decide if its worth buying the rest.

 

[mike thompson]

Not tried checking voltage on phase wires without a motor connected.
You can try a simple test though to see if it works, you will need a throttle.
Black probe to Gnd and red probe to a phase wire, operate throttle and if it works you will see a third of the battery SOC voltage across each wire actuating the throttle.

Be very careful not to allow phases to short or the controller will be toast.

I have done this with an oscilloscope, I figured I should see a some combination of voltages across the phases depending on which sector I had set up with the hall sensors. There are I believe 6 combinations of 5v, 0v, across the 3 sensors you can use like a 3 bit binary number to represent the 6 of 60 degree rotation sectors, you cant use 5v,5v,5v or 0v,0v,0v.Thing I am not sure of is what happens when wheel is stationary? How does it get going? I just see 0v on all 3 phases

 

[wheeliepete]

Not to undermine your efforts, but have you considered a complete kit minus the battery? If the controller is an older model, then i doubt Powabyke have the parts and even if they do, there prices are silly expensive compared to what is available today.

https://www.yosepower.com/en/product/Hub-Motor-36V350W-26"-Rear-Motor-with-Cassette-Bicycle-E-Bike-Hub-Conversion-Kit-Silver-DIY-E-bike-LCD-Display-131.html

 

[JuicyBike]

I have done this with an oscilloscope, I figured I should see a some combination of voltages across the phases depending on which sector I had set up with the hall sensors. There are I believe 6 combinations of 5v, 0v, across the 3 sensors you can use like a 3 bit binary number to represent the 6 of 60 degree rotation sectors, you cant use 5v,5v,5v or 0v,0v,0v.Thing I am not sure of is what happens when wheel is stationary? How does it get going? I just see 0v on all 3 phases

After 2, 3 or possibly more signals have been received by the controller from the pedal sensor, or a signal is received from the throttle (if it is set up to allow throttle power without pedalling).