suitable specifications for hill climbing bike

Hi

 

I read in the FAQs that 200w was about minimum power-wise,for hillclimbing. The hill I need to be climbing (to get home from the station) is about 1.25 miles long and an average of 1:15 gradient. I weigh about 11 stone and am quite happy to peddle 'as if on the flat'.

 

I see that the Sunlova SL26, which has 250 watts is selling for about £399 but I was expecting to have to pay more than that.

 

any advice gratefully recieved

 

opaz

£399 but I was expecting to have to pay more than that.

You are asking very little from an electric bike so most will be very over engineered for the task, there's no reason you need to pay a lot as you don't need a lot of battery capacity.

I have no knowledge of the bike you mention but it may well be perfectly suitable, as always with these make sure you get a test ride first.

BTW have you considered a normal bike but pedalling slightly slower?

I also have a choice of mile+ long hills to ride up to get to work, which I believe may be significantly steeper than yours, but I may be wrong. On top of this I weigh a good 5 stone more than you.

 

My bike was slightly cheaper than the one you are looking at and it gets me up the hill every day with reasonable input from me.

 

All this bodes well, but I would also recommend you consider the quality of the components your new bike will be made from. I have been plagued by a worrying need to constantly re-adjust the brakes, which I now believe is cable stretch. I am also noticing several patches of rust and one of the pedals has lost it's reflector, only a question of time for the rest to fall off.

 

If you intend this to be your daily commuting tool, it may be worth looking at a bike known for it's quality and a good read through some old posts here will go a long way to finding that. However I believe my bike will have paid for itself in saved petrol costs if it only lasts another 6 months or so.

 

Horses for courses.

Don't take much notice of the quoted 200W or 250W powers, these are merely quoted to match the local legal limits, 200W in the UK and 250W in the EU. In fact most e-bike motors are capable of much more, and that Sunlova will probably be capable of as much as 400W and will easily cope with your hill.

 

It is a very cheap bike though, and it's 36 Volt lithium battery only 8.5Ah capacity, so the range is very unlikely to be the 35 miles they quote. A lithium battery included at that bike price isn't going to be very good quality and lithium types only last two years if you're lucky, so make sure you will be able to get replacement ones and check how much they will cost.

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great advice folks, many thanks.

 

(I notice the sunlova weighs 28kg. That's quite a weight to be heaving up train station stairwells and so on)

 

Are there any bikes that you'd recommend given my requirements?

 

cheers

 

opaz

great advice folks, many thanks.

 

(I notice the sunlova weighs 28kg. That's quite a weight to be heaving up train station stairwells and so on)

 

Are there any bikes that you'd recommend given my requirements?

 

cheers

 

opaz

That's about the norm, have you got lots of money to burn for the ideal solution or are you budget conscious?

I'm budget conscious, but I don't want to undershoot and get something that I end up not using. Given what has been said above, it seems that a modestly priced bike would get me up my hill, the main consideration should be reliability

I'm budget conscious, but I don't want to undershoot and get something that I end up not using. Given what has been said above, it seems that a modestly priced bike would get me up my hill, the main consideration should be reliability

 

If you already have an ordinary bike you like, one option is to go with a kit. These can be pretty good value, are fairly easy to fit and you know the quality of the donor bike already. A few people on the forum have used the Alien kit...

 

Otherwise the list of potential bikes is pretty big and growing rapidly ranging from:

Powabyke

Powacycle

Synergie Mistral etc. at the £600ish end

 

right up to:

Wisper 905se

Kalkhoff

Ezee Torq & Forza etc

 

etc at the £1200ish end

 

If you only have a short journey any of these will probably cope. AtoB magazine have reviewed a number of them too, as well as plenty of reviews on this site. Best to pick a few and get some test rides.

The Synergie Mistral, currently at £799 has a number of members strongly recommending it, but sadly it seems there will be no more supplies until Nov/Dec according to ElectricBikeSales.

 

Below that price for a well known brand is the Powacycle Salisbury at £699, but it is quite low powered. It will certainly manage that hill ok, but you would be putting in a little more effort with that. Range is in the 20 to 27 mile area, depending on how much you contribute.

 

The other low price bikes around tend to be the ones you cannot be certain will be around in a years time, making spares and replacement batteries a potential problem.

 

N.B. Crossed with torrent99's post.

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the powacycle salisbury is listed as having 26V 10.5Ah=273 Watt hours. Does this equate to 273 watts? Do you think that would require pedaling possibly more than 'as if on the flat'.

 

(I'd love to try some of these out for myself, but there aren'tany dealers around here)

 

opaz

The nominal legal power of the Salisbury is the 200W UK figure, but that 273 Wh is the power content of the battery, not the same as the maximum the motor can put out, which in this case is about 300 Watts.

 

If your hill really is 1 in 15 (6.5%), and you are the same 11 stone as me, the amount of pedal power you'll have to contribute is small. In fact the Salisbury is a reasonable hill climber, but not particularly fast doing it. On the flat it powers to about 13 mph willingly and reaches 15 mph ok, the rest up to you.

 

Have a look at these three forum member reviews of the Windsor which is identical but step though frame and you'll see what owners think of them:

 

Powacycle Windsor reviews

 

Also, this thread by member Danny-K has much more information on the Salisbury:

 

Danny's Salisbury thread

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Edited February 18, 200917 yr by flecc

the powacycle salisbury is listed as having 26V 10.5Ah=273 Watt hours. Does this equate to 273 watts? Do you think that would require pedaling possibly more than 'as if on the flat'.

 

(I'd love to try some of these out for myself, but there aren'tany dealers around here)

 

opaz

 

Where abouts are you opaz?

I own a Salisbury and have recently ridden 26 miles on a couple of occasions between Ipswich and the Mid Suffolk/South Norfolk border, with some sizeable hills enroute.

 

I will need to do the maths later to get more precise gradients of the hills (last time I tried I mixed my units and got into a big muddle) but they are tall enough for me to find it strenuous on my unpowered pushbike.

 

The bike still had two lights left on the battery at arrival.

 

I am roughly the same weight as flecc - but was carrying about 12 kilos in the panniers...

 

ETS appear to be developing their own version of the Mistral called the Smarta Bike (same frame but maybe a slightly different motor), planned for sale in February.

Where abouts are you opaz?

 

Hebden Bridge, west yorkshire. about 7 miles from Halifax

The nominal legal power of the Salisbury is the 200W UK figure, but that 273 Wh is the power content of the battery, not the same as the maximum the motor can put out, which in this case is about 300 Watts.

 

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how do get to the 'motor output' from the power content of the battery?

 

Also, what's your opinion of folding bikes?

Hebden Bridge, west yorkshire. about 7 miles from Halifax

if you have to climb the hill towards Howarth,you will need a good climber... I've only done it in the car but my powabike euro will climb similar hills in my area....

I wouldn't advise a kit for a non-electric bike. It isn't ideal weight distribution, not as well sealed against the weather, doesn't look as good, and will be a pain in the ar5e to fit properly. Bikes designed for electronics work much better. Kit=Bodge. It's like the boy racers of the ebike world, would you rather a Ferrari 355 spyder, or a vauxhall Nova with bad boy bodykit, big bore exhaust, and a stupid set of wheels? You know it won't work, the suspension will bottom out, the performance is awful, its unreliable and you look like a pilchard.

how do get to the 'motor output' from the power content of the battery?

 

Also, what's your opinion of folding bikes?

 

The motor power cannot be worked out from the battery voltage and capacity. Only physical measurement or figures from the manufacturer can give the motor power.

 

Folders are normally inferior to full size bikes, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be used, and my main electric bike is a folder, albeit a largish one. It depends what you want a folder for, using it on public transport or just for easier stowing at home. If you can say what you'd use the folder for and any model you have your eye on, we can advise further on using one.

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I wouldn't advise a kit for a non-electric bike. It isn't ideal weight distribution, not as well sealed against the weather, doesn't look as good, and will be a pain in the ar5e to fit properly. Bikes designed for electronics work much better. Kit=Bodge. It's like the boy racers of the ebike world, would you rather a Ferrari 355 spyder, or a vauxhall Nova with bad boy bodykit, big bore exhaust, and a stupid set of wheels? You know it won't work, the suspension will bottom out, the performance is awful, its unreliable and you look like a pilchard.

 

Although what you say is often true, it isn't invariably so. Here are two excellent conversions by members.

 

The first by BGElect is on a Dahon Speed 7 folder using the Alien kit, a nicely balanced folding bike weighing only 20 kilos so bettering many manufacturers, and with good visual integration of the elements:

 

 

The second is a recumbent conversion by Jeremy, using a Tongxin Nano motor and a superbly integrated custom designed below seat battery and a dashboard display. The standards of this conversion are visually superior to many manufacturers bikes:

 

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3209/2347542574_8a08d4fd82.jpg

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Nice. All it needs now is a massive spoiler. And I reckon you could fit some speakers under the seat also........

If you can say what you'd use the folder for and any model you have your eye on, we can advise further on using one.

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Public transport, stashing it in the car, when I visit people bringing into their kitchen, or even the pub. I had my non-electric bike nicked recently round here, an expensive model chained up outside a pub might be too tempting for some.

 

As for which one I had my eye on, so far it's the folding sunlova SL (£399), but I wasn't sure if it would be powerful enough for the 1:15 hill I need to climb

Public transport, stashing it in the car, when I visit people bringing into their kitchen, or even the pub. I had my non-electric bike nicked recently round here, an expensive model chained up outside a pub might be too tempting for some.

 

As for which one I had my eye on, so far it's the folding sunlova SL (£399), but I wasn't sure if it would be powerful enough for the 1:15 hill I need to climb

 

You wouldn't have any problem with that 1 in 15 hill, smaller wheel bikes being better climbers anyway, and these tend to be rather low geared overall. The downside is that they are a bit slower and sometimes difficult to pedal at or above 15 mph due to the low gearing.

 

The main problem is the weight of 24 kilos, and lugging that onto a bus or train or walking any distance carrying it wouldn't be funny unless competition weightlifting is a hobby. It might not sound like much, but these single fold bikes are awkward things to carry.

 

The Sustain Edison folder on the webpage below is actually a Synergie model and it weighs 20 kilos, so easier to handle. Otherwise it's about the same as the Sunlova, though spares and support could be better with Synergie/Sustain. Click on the folded photo to get the details.

Edison folding electric bike

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Edited February 18, 200917 yr by flecc

The sunlova actually has 26" wheels, so not that small (and it's 28kg). I have to carry a 30kg amp around sometimes and that's a bugger to carry, mainly because it's wide. I guess a folded bike would be narrower and possibly easier in that way, but no I wouldn't relish doing it.

 

the full spec is here: 26" New Electric Folding Mountain Bicycle Bike SL26F01A on eBay, also, Bikes, Cycling, Sporting Goods (end time 28-Feb-09 01:06:38 GMT)

 

I emailed the seller and asked about replacement batteries. they said they cost about £180

 

Thanks for the edison link, I'll keep that in mind if I dont go for the sunlova

Understood Opaz, I thought you meant a smaller folder when you mentioned public transport. I don't see much advantage in a full size folder for that, you might be better keeping to a lighter rigid bike like the Salisbury at only 22 kilos.

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A folding sunlova SL doesn't look too bad a specification - for a cheap, cheerful runabout MTB style electric bike.

As long as its limitations are realised and accepted it could be a worthy purchase.

 

It's a folder, so as you say it can go with you most places.

Not sure the pub landlord will let you bring it in and sit it by the fire, but your never know.

36-volt motor is powerful enough for most hills.

Aluminium frame and Lithium battery means its power to weight's ok – but 28 kgs is still a fair lump. My none folding MTB style bike (with it’s original SLA batteries) weighed in at a back-breaking 38 kgs. It’s lighter now with a change of battery but it would still be too heavy for some.

What I will say is without the power a thief would not get very far very fast

With only an 8.5Ah Lithium battery it won't be going great distances.

I don't have much knowledge of Lithium batteries but as a rough guide I always take off 10 miles from range claims, which seems to be about right. So I would estimate its range to be closer 25 miles (less in hilly terrain).

Lithium batteries have a short life (2 years).

Would a replacement battery be available in 2 years?

If not what choices will you have?

I was able to replace my SLA batteries when they started to die (at 8 months old) with a LiFePO4 (I didn’t want Lithium due to it’s short life). It cost about £200 from china. For me the fitting it was not difficult and I’m not electrically minded. LiFePO4 batteries are claimed to have extensive life - 2000+ charges - so mine could last me 10 years as a leisure only rider

Again if you’re a reasonable DIY'er then as long as the bikes controller stays healthy you can replace most of the other bits as they fall (sorry) ware out.

It’s not going to be a Wisper or any of the other expensive bikes – but then (as you’ve said) you don’t want an expensive electric bike.

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Edited February 18, 200917 yr by Footie