Replace existing ebike for London commute

[JohnCade]

Thanks for suggestions. So would a hub motor be better than a crank drive motor if I wanted to take the bike beyond its 15 mph range. One issue I don't like with my current ebike is that when I start pedalling the power is delivered as one and takes the bike straight to 15mph if it is on a straight. I then struggle to take it beyond at best 17 mph no matter how hard I pedal

Some Europian bikes use the ten percent leeway in the regs to allow a bit over 17mph before they cut out. Kalkhoff do with all their bikes, but I’m not sure how many others do it. On mine the power progressively eases off until the cut off is unnoticeable and you are on your own. My Kalkhoff and other ones I‘ve ridden can be pedalled past the cut out on the flat well too, which not all ebikes can be. They are CD, but the main thing is that they have good components and tyres which not all do. That’s what makes pedalling unassisted like riding through deep water with some bikes. Weight also matters but that isn’t so noticeable when the bike is up and rolling.

A cheaper Chinese e bike I had as my first ebike was a pig to pedal past the cut out. Which at 15.5mph was also like hitting a wall because it didn't ease down the power as the cut out speed approached. The only way to make that smooth was to change the cut out to a higher speed which also made it illegal.

On that point your OP was confusing in that you say you are averaging 17/18mph and want more speed but also say you want to stay legal. Your average is over the legal speed now and to average that you must be going well over 20mph at times. So you can’t do that assisted and be legal. But if you want a more efficient bike which will assist you on hills and the flat up to 17mph legally and is easier to ride past the cut out then a Kalkhoff is a good bet. That or a buy a good bike and convert it.

 

[trex]

the OP Freego Eagle has a LED panel, not an LCD. The bike is not restricted, that's why he's been getting 16mph on average. There are plenty of bikes that can go faster but he'll have to derestrict.
I agree with JohnCade that a good Kalkhoff is the way to go for 30 miles a day, all weather riding. Many e-bikes out there are not tough enough to last several years at this mileage. He still has to derestrict to get higher average speed though.

 

[JohnCade]

the OP Freego Eagle has a LED panel, not an LCD. The bike is not restricted, that's why he's been getting 16mph on average. There are plenty of bikes that can go faster but he'll have to derestrict.
I agree with JohnCade that a good Kalkhoff is the way to go for 30 miles a day, all weather riding. Many e-bikes out there are not tough enough to last several years at this mileage. He still has to derestrict to get higher average speed though.

Right. If it and others of the period are unrestricted does that make them technically illegal? They must always have been I should have thought.

I thought maybe he wanted to pedal faster than the cut out and wanted a bike he could pedal on the flat at up to 20mph or so. Though for that a converted good quality lightweight bike like a Cube would be better. The wanting to stay legal bit is still unclear.

 

[gmbb]

Right. If it and others of the period are unrestricted does that make them technically illegal? They must always have been I should have thought.

I thought maybe he wanted to pedal faster than the cut out and wanted a bike he could pedal on the flat at up to 20mph or so. Though for that a converted good quality lightweight bike like a Cube would be better. The wanting to stay legal bit is still unclear.

Yes I definitely want to try and pedal beyond when the bike cuts off which does feel like cycling through water past 15.5 mph. I just feel that I could cycle a bit faster if the bike would let me which is frustrating when so many cyclists are overtaking me each morning. The bike does need to be solid as part of my route takes me off road along rough ground and comfort is also important as I quite like the seating position of the freego eagle but maybe that is also making me cycle a bit more leisurely. I have got used to the throttle which is useful when negotiating traffic through London.

appreciating all the suggestions here. It was an easy choice when I first purchased the bike as it was used so was a good price. Now want to make sure that I buy the correct bike that has to be better than what i have got with my £1500 budget.

 

[trex]

Right. If it and others of the period are unrestricted does that make them technically illegal? They must always have been I should have thought.

most bikes fitted with SWX motors don't need LCDs because they are limited by their construction. You can easily reach 15mph on throttle but the assistance tails off quickly, you can hold to 17mph with a fair amount of pedalling and by time you reach 19mph the motor's efficiency drops to near zero. I reckon people who buy a bike with an SWX motor are not interested in speed. The OP is a bit of an exception.

 

[trex]

Y
...
ow want to make sure that I buy the correct bike that has to be better than what i have got with my £1500 budget.

if you want speed, then crank motors or direct drive motors have the edge over hub motors. If you want speed and lightweight, then crank motors are best.
An 8-Fun BBS02 18A 500W will give you 120 RPM at the cranks, about 28mph. In view of the high mileage you do, I think a 750W direct drive kit is best for you.

 

[JohnCade]

Yes I definitely want to try and pedal beyond when the bike cuts off which does feel like cycling through water past 15.5 mph. I just feel that I could cycle a bit faster if the bike would let me which is frustrating when so many cyclists are overtaking me each morning. The bike does need to be solid as part of my route takes me off road along rough ground and comfort is also important as I quite like the seating position of the freego eagle but maybe that is also making me cycle a bit more leisurely. I have got used to the throttle which is useful when negotiating traffic through London.

appreciating all the suggestions here. It was an easy choice when I first purchased the bike as it was used so was a good price. Now want to make sure that I buy the correct bike that has to be better than what i have got with my £1500 budget.

A Kalkhoff Pro Connect 9 is a bit over your budget at £1600 or so but was available at ten percent off until two days ago. It wouldn’t surprise me if you got a similar discount if you mention that you are a member here. 5o Cycles is trying to move on the 2015 models because completely new ones are on the way.

Good one year old Kalkhoffs can be got for a thousand pounds or even less at times. You also get a lot of people with inflated ideas of s/h values too. The two year warranty is transferable as long as you have the original invoice which not many dealers allow. BTW a member here was selling a Sahel i360 at a good price in the classifieds a week or so ago. He might have changed his mind though but you could PM him.

 

[lordvincent]

John, do you have any info on the different Kalkhoffs for next year - is it the integrale or are there others?

 

[JohnCade]

No I don’t have any special info. But I assume from what Tim at 50 Cycles let drop here in a couple of posts that the whole range will be going that way. I might take longer than one year to change them all over though.

 

[lordvincent]

I notice that 50 cycles are still using the 2013 agattu, which is the model I have, for their front page image banner, which is a bit strange since the model has been discontinued for some time. It is probably their most attractive design to date, which might explain it, although the Integrale is growing on me.

 

[gmbb]

Have been looking at the Oxygen Emate MTB and the Cyclotricity Revolver and also looking at the oxydrive conversion kit and bafang bbs01 as I have a mtb sitting in my garage spare. Price wise the conversion kit is looking ideal but would it be better to get the complete bikes instead. What would be the advantages of a kit vs the bike. Also of the two Oxygen vs Cyclotricity which is better?

 

[Nealh]

A cheaper option if your donor bike is nice a conversion is worth considering , you will lose your front derailleur and chain rings if you fit the BBS or keep them using the Oxydrive. For on road the Oxydrive will be nice but if going offroad then the BBS is better in my opinion as I have both.
Regarding the other option then I think the Oxygen is a no brainer, the Bafang CST is awesome but it is ( 13ah version) twice the price of the revolver, hill climbing is excellent and is no slouch on the flat and a nice looking bike.The components are better with better front forks and nice hdb's. The revolver uses a direct drive hub which is good on the flat for speed but may lack the climbing ability.

 

[gmbb]

I was looking for the conversion as I tend to put my rucksack on the panier and have got quite use to the step through bike so when I look a the Oxygen I struggle to come off the bike when the rucksack is at the back. So I was looking to put the battery on the pannier rack and maybe fit to a step through bike. I also don't like the way my current bike which is a hub motor gives me all the power is one go. It is all or nothing and I prefer to be able to control how the speed is output. Do the newer hub motors do this?

 

[anotherkiwi]

No newer controllers don't do that. Chose a sine wave controller over a square wave one. Chose a LCD with seperate buttons which you can place near the gear shifter. Choose a PAS disk with at least 10 magnets in it.

I use the assitance level buttons like a gear change, examples:

You are in heavy traffic and first at lights put the bike in a higher gear and assitance level 5 and accelerate away at top speed.

You are in heavy traffic and behind lots of other bikes/cars whatever, bike in mid gear and assitance level 2 and pull away slower in full control of your speed.

I don't have a front derailleur mounted at the moment so I use all the 6 gears and assitance from 0 to 5 depending on slope or required speed. My 1st gear is a huge granny gear for getting up steep hills without the motor.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Just to make it clear, the controllers with LCDs control the power much better than those without. To get even better control, you need a controller that uses current control rather than speed control. Current control is sometimes referred to as "torque simulation". The Oxygen one in the kits and Emate MTB has three levels of current control as well as six levels of speed control.

If you don't mind doing a bit of wiring, you can change your present controller to a S06S or S06P (depending on whether your motor has hall sensors) and a LCD from BMSBattery. The cost is about £65, or you can get them from Panda bikes in the UK for about £100.

 

[gmbb]

I have used mapmyride on some of my journeys and actually my average speed over the distance is actually much lower than I expected, around 12mph. I am also noticing my battery range depleting more and more so feel it is getting very close to needing a new bike. I had considered a kit but a bit worried about it being fiddly. Which bikes that would be good hill climbers and also have a throttle apart from Revolver and Emate. I also want to try and realistically reach 19-20mph if I could. I had tried the revolver but didn't find it comfortable.