Range not as good as I would expect from higher amp hour batteries?

Hi all I have a yosepower 10ah bottle battery £160 about 4000k usage, 17 ah yosepower, 1Oook approx, enerproff 13ah battery pack 1oook

 

ebike. Carrera fitted with tdz2 250w, Kudos vita uno fitted with yosepower 350w.14amp controller.

 

Bosch ktm 250w. 400w battery 2400 miles covered.

 

this week tried. Enerprof with tdz2. Sport mode ,mainly flat terrain. 30 miles 2 bars left on display when riding, Using older 10ah bottle battery about 27 miles 2 bars left. Both the same journey.

 

the 350 watt motor using the supplied 14 amp controller mode 4 mainly a little of 5 17 ah battery I have just done 24.7 miles. one bar left on lcd 3 display.

 

I did fit a 17 ah controller to the 350w yosepower, fair bit more power but bike only seemed to do 22 miles before the bike would sudddenly cut out, so reverted back to 14amp one.

 

in comparison the Bosch ktm. Where I tend to use sport mode most ,seems to give better range than my other ebikes even if using a larger battery.

 

has any other members found similar results.

 

most of the above results are for warm sunny days, I hate the accused wind. Which seems to be far too prevalent this year

 

should state I am not sure what charge is actually left in my batteries, I go by What’s left on ebike display .

 

the last mile to my home is hilly regardless of direction, so I do not want to have to push said ebikes ( I have done it twice due to a malfunction)

Edited May 15, 20205 yr by it is i footpump

Hi all I have a yosepower 10ah bottle battery £160 about 4000k usage, 17 ah yosepower, 1Oook approx, enerproff 13ah battery pack 1oook

 

ebike. Carrera fitted with tdz2 250w, Kudos vita uno fitted with yosepower 350w.14amp controller.

 

Bosch ktm 250w. 400w battery 2400 miles covered.

 

this week tried. Enerprof with tdz2. Sport mode ,mainly flat terrain. 30 miles 2 bars left on display when riding, Using older 10ah bottle battery about 27 miles 2 bars left. Both the same journey.

 

the 350 watt motor using the supplied 14 amp controller mode 4 mainly a little of 5 17 ah battery I have just done 24.7 miles. one bar left on lcd 3 display.

 

I did fit a 17 ah controller to the 350w yosepower, fair bit more power but bike only seemed to do 22 miles before the bike would sudddenly cut out, so reverted back to 14amp one.

 

in comparison the Bosch ktm. Where I tend to use sport mode most ,seems to give better range than my other ebikes even if using a larger battery.

 

has any other members found similar results.

 

most of the above results are for warm sunny days, I hate the accused wind. Which seems to be far too prevalent this year

 

should state I am not sure what charge is actually left in my batteries, I go by What’s left on ebike display .

 

the last mile to my home is hilly regardless of direction, so I do not want to have to push said ebikes ( I have done it twice due to a malfunction)

E-bike displays are often wrong. Mine appears to simply show the voltage, without taking into account the current drain as I ride!!

IMHO the manufactures often cannot be bothered to put a decent circuit in there.

But I have no opinion either way if yours is one so affected or not.

But if you start ride with a full charge, and ride until the BMS stops further discharge, that will be a more accurate point to measure total distance on one charge from full to empty.

Use that to compare with other batteries, but its not perfect either!

Furthermore, if you need more range, some controllers allow the maximum current allowed to be adjusted lower. This will save more energy for a longer ride.

The lower the maximum current, the longer the battery will last for you, but you will have to pedal a bit more as well if you want the same speed, or accept a lower speed, which will save your energy as well!

But not all controllers are adjustable in this fashion...

Its a bit like a petrol tank, the faster you drive, the quicker its empty! And the fewer miles that can be driven per tank....

Physic is simply physic!

Here is a fairly simple Math explanation, that is easy to follow as a video:-

regards

Andy

I blame wind and fear it maybe a windy summer!

Not all cells discharge at the same curve, some sag a little and the curve goes down a bit quicker, some sag then level off/ plateau before the curve begins again. On ES the recent cycle ageing tests show some even spike a little before the gradual curve goes down again. All you can do is ride the bike as mentioned to lvc under the same conditions to get a more accurate idea of range possible.

Edited May 16, 20205 yr by Nealh

I blame wind and fear it maybe a windy summer!

Too many are apparently surviving on Baked Beans for many meals during COVID-19 Lockdown!!

I have a CNE SR20a Fat Tyre with an LCD-3 Meter . The Meter shows plenty of information and the Watts while riding and the Voltage provide interest . The 36V battery after a full charge shows 42.1V or even 42.2V and after a period settles at 42V which is the figure I use for any calculations . I use a Holux GPS to record my mileage covered, which usually includes a lot of country lanes with plenty of small hills, as well as some main roads here in the Vale of Glamorgan . I note the Voltage after my ride but take the figure the next day, as the Voltage settles by up to 0.3 Volts higher . My Routes show that I get consistently near 3.8 Miles per Volt lost . My 20x4 in. Fat Tyres are run at 26 psi front and 29 psi rear , the rear being a tractor type and the front a road type , both Kendas .

Thanks all for replies I charged my Bosch 400w battery about 4.5 lights showing so not a full charge, did 36 miles mainly flat 2 hills 3/4 mile. Tour and sport one bar left on display as I got home.

 

putting a voltmeter. On the + and - terminals on the battery I could not get a reading to see what (1 bar on display was as regards volts left in battery).

 

voltmeter works on all my other batteries I have the lcd3 display on my yosepower 350w bike

The Bosch don't allow for any voltage reading as it needs to connect to the controller and display at the same time, the CANbus comms are a closed system best not to try again as you could bugger it up big time and brick the system.

The Bosch don't allow for any voltage reading as it needs to connect to the controller and display at the same time, the CANbus comms are a closed system best not to try again as you could bugger it up big time and brick the system.

A very valid reason for buying a different make.....

Andy

Thanks nealh

Was not aware of the Bosch system l, other than only Bosch batteries which are very expensive .

I bought the bike ex dem, But got the Bosch equipped bike confused with a Shimano I had looked at where a replacement battery was much cheaper.

A very valid reason for buying a different make.....

Andy

Have you ever owned a bike with a Bosch motor?

Have you ever owned a bike with a Bosch motor?

I have owned a Bosch bike and I like it, but I certainly accept that the price of batteries is a reason not to buy one. There are also good reason to own one. You don't need to own one to be able to appreciate the battery price downside.

You don't need to own one to be able to appreciate the battery price downside.

I totally agree with you, but hijacking every thread that mentions Bosch and launching into a tirade of abuse about them when he has had no experience of owning one is counter productive for people looking for balanced advice on various motors and systems.

Have you ever owned a bike with a Bosch motor?

Are you really of the opinion that the only way to decide if something is rubbish or good, is by buying it first?

Let me say, that I am NOT of this opinion, and as nowadays I can easily research on the web before buying anything, not just e-bikes and not just here on Pedelec, for bike infos, to decide, without being caught out with a purchase, what is good and what is not.

But you may have picked a very valid point that possibly some people risk and must always "Buy and try"! Sad for them in some cases!

I try to do the opposite whenever possible, "try and probably not buy!" ;)

With regard to mid motor e-bikes, there is hardly a day that goes by without someone posting problems with one, and I mean just here on Pedelec.....

Going online shows a great many unhappy customers of such designs, and I have posted links in the last 4 weeks demonstrating that very clearly. But if you missed them, I could search them out for you again if you wish? Its not difficult to do.

Andy

I totally agree with you, but hijacking every thread that mentions Bosch and launching into a tirade of abuse about them when he has had no experience of owning one is counter productive for people looking for balanced advice on various motors and systems.

The abuse has always come from the people caught out by mid motor bikes! I have posted verifiable facts and links, mainly as a warning to anyone considering a mid motor, to make them fully AWARE!

I do not believe that you really understand what is a "tirade of abuse" really is!!!

Look here, though some are in German:-

https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=4EXFXtzOJYWdsAeI9ZRw&q=bosch+e-bike+problems%3F&oq=bosch+e-bike+problems%3F&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAzIICAAQFhAKEB4yBggAEBYQHjIGCAAQFhAeMgYIABAWEB4yBggAEBYQHjIGCAAQFhAeMgYIABAWEB4yBggAEBYQHjIGCAAQFhAeMgYIABAWEB46BQgAEIMBOgIIAFCNHFjYaWD2b2gAcAB4AIABeYgBpw6SAQQxOC40mAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdpeg&sclient=psy-ab&ved=0ahUKEwjcvvqr2sLpAhWFDuwKHYg6BQ4Q4dUDCAg&uact=5

That demonstrates clearly just how many people are unhappy with Bosch products.......on one simple search!

And here:-

https://www.google.com/search?ei=70XFXpq_JYaAkwWNw6ToCQ&q=bosch+e-bike+problems+in+English%3F&oq=bosch+e-bike+problems+in+English%3F&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAzIFCAAQzQI6BAgAEEc6BggAEAoQHjoGCAAQCBAeOgQIIRAKUJe7Clif2QpgluAKaABwAXgAgAFqiAH2B5IBAzkuMpgBAKABAaoBB2d3cy13aXo&sclient=psy-ab&ved=0ahUKEwja8o2z2sLpAhUGwKQKHY0hCZ0Q4dUDCAs&uact=5

I even did the same search for Hub motors in General, very few problems shown:-

https://www.google.com/search?ei=oUbFXp20GIGTkwXN7augDg&q=hub+motor+e-bike+problems+in+English%3F&oq=hub+motor+e-bike+problems+in+English%3F&gs_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQDDoECAAQR1CXqAZYvsYGYMzfBmgAcAN4AIABaYgBpAaSAQM3LjKYAQCgAQGqAQdnd3Mtd2l6&sclient=psy-ab&ved=0ahUKEwjdiPGH28LpAhWByaQKHc32CuQQ4dUDCAs

Andy

Are you really of the opinion that the only way to decide if something is rubbish or good, is by buying it first?

Not at all, but if you have no experience of them apart from what you have read online which may or not be a true reflection, why not leave it to the people on the forum who have had experience of them, as for the many dis-satisfied owners there appears to be just as many who have problems with hub motors on the forum, I could search them out for you if you want? It's not difficult to do.

Not at all, but if you have no experience of them apart from what you have read online which may or not be a true reflection, why not leave it to the people on the forum who have had experience of them, as for the many dis-satisfied owners there appears to be just as many who have problems with hub motors on the forum, I could search them out for you if you want? It's not difficult to do.

I have a dozen or so friends and acquaintances, that got caught out a few years ago by Bosch. What is worse, just about all of them are Sunday riders if no rain forecast!! The bikes are very lightly used....

This lead me to research the problems they have had, on the web.

It really was not difficult.

Several have sold their bikes, and either given up on e-bikes, or have bought hub motor bikes. One has changed to something with a Bafang mid motor I believe, though I have not managed to get a good look at it yet, and he is still very happy, but he has only had it a month or two....Late Christmas present!

Andy

I have a dozen or so friends and acquaintances, that got caught out a few years ago by Bosch.

I think you will find that more people have been caught out by the Carrera Crossfire (of which I have had experience of having owned one)and it's problems percentage wise (sales)over Bosch looking at the posts on this forum, Where as my experiences of owning a Wisper, Juicy and Carrera Crossfuse have all been positive.

Edited May 20, 20205 yr by Amoto65

Firstly, I do believe that I do not know anyone with such a Make of bike....

As I mentioned earlier, just about all these folks I know bought Bosch, all, I believe from the same bike shop, which has gone out of business apparently.

I just looked on the web and there appear to be many different model Carrera bikes, some normal bikes, some e-bikes with with a similar name, most/some seem to be mid motor, some hub, just going by the pictures.

I don't understand the point you are trying to make...please elaborate.

If these bikes are as bad as you say, then why, as an informed person, are you not pointing out these failings for newbies looking to get into e-biking?

If I search on the web and ask "problem e-bikes?", I get basically nothing.

But if I add Bosch in the middle, I get dozens of Bosch e-bike problems and fixes shown.

Swapping Carrera for Bosch, brings up a few problems, but nothing like the sheer number of Bosch problems....

Here in Germany, Bosch e-bikes appear to have a fairly bad name, maybe because they have been sold longer here? Just guessing though....

Try it for yourself on the web.....its simple to do.

Andy

If these bikes are as bad as you say, then why, as an informed person, are you not pointing out these failings for newbies looking to get into e-biking?

This has been pointed out numerous times on this forum about the cut outs with the hub driven Carrera Crossfire it has been going on for years, search Carrera Crossfire on this forum it's not difficult.

This has been pointed out numerous times on this forum about the cut outs with the hub driven Carrera Crossfire it has been going on for years, search Carrera Crossfire on this forum it's not difficult.

Then you, as an apparent expert on the subject of Carrera e-bikes, and how bad they really are, (according to you,) are therefore FAR better qualified to do it than I am.

You appear to be making a very "childishly amateur effort", in trying to make me stop telling the true facts behind many mid motor e-bikes. It is not going to work!!

Mid motor e-bikes, are a subject where I have had 5 or 6 years of fairly intense and close personal knowledge from several actual owners, who all cycle together most good Sundays.

And for me to go after a different product that you yourself do not like, but profess to have owned one and that you know its faults!

Also, till one runs over my foot, its still a product that I really don't think that I have ever actually seen, and I do not know any owners personally, and I have (other than your good self) not yet been told anything nasty about them......Lucky I suppose!

I did run a quick bit of research on the web, but sadly for you, it did not substantiate your opinions at all.....At a quick glance, they appear to be a reasonable product to purchase....Certainly none of the owners are "MOANING" online as far as I could see!!

Remember, we should all concentrate on what we do best!

So on your part, a good effort, but IMHO, not good enough and VERY easily seen through...... ;)

But at least no rude words or incredibly bad manners! That alone is very POSITIVE!

Have a great day.

Andy

Then you, as an apparent expert on the subject of Carrera e-bikes, and how bad they really are, (according to you,) are therefore FAR better qualified to do it than I am.

You appear to be making a very "childishly amateur effort", in trying to make me stop telling the true facts behind many mid motor e-bikes. It is not going to work!!

Mid motor e-bikes, are a subject where I have had 5 or 6 years of fairly intense and close personal knowledge from several actual owners, who all cycle together most good Sundays.

And for me to go after a different product that you yourself do not like, but profess to have owned one and that you know its faults!

Also, till one runs over my foot, its still a product that I really don't think that I have ever actually seen, and I do not know any owners personally, and I have (other than your good self) not yet been told anything nasty about them......Lucky I suppose!

I did run a quick bit of research on the web, but sadly for you, it did not substantiate your opinions at all.....At a quick glance, they appear to be a reasonable product to purchase....Certainly none of the owners are "MOANING" online as far as I could see!!

Remember, we should all concentrate on what we do best!

So on your part, a good effort, but IMHO, not good enough and VERY easily seen through...... ;)

But at least no rude words or incredibly bad manners! That alone is very POSITIVE!

Have a great day.

Andy

Andy, you can stick your fingers in your ears and shout “la la la” if you want, but regulars here can confirm that the Suntour electrical system used on the Carrera Crossfire-E is plagued by problems and is widely considered as 'unfit for purpose'.

 

I'm no particular fan of Bosch mid-drive bikes and make no comparisons between the two systems, but can confirm that the Crossfire-E should be avoided at all costs. I don't make the same claim about Bosch bikes.

 

EDIT: I usually tell people, "If you're happy to buy an Apple iPhone, you'd probably have no issues with the proprietary nature of a Bosch ebike.

Edited May 21, 20205 yr by danielrlee

I did run a quick bit of research on the web, but sadly for you, it did not substantiate your opinions at all....

Obviously you are not very adept at research as if you had only looked on this forum you would have found plenty of information on their faults.

Andy, you can stick your fingers in your ears and shout “la la la” if you want, but regulars here can confirm that the Suntour electrical system used on the Carrera Crossfire-E is plagued by problems and is widely considered as 'unfit for purpose'.

 

I'm no particular fan of Bosch mid-drive bikes and make no comparisons between the two systems, but can confirm that the Crossfire-E should be avoided at all costs. I don't make the same claim about Bosch bikes.

 

EDIT: I usually tell people, "If you're happy to buy an Apple iPhone, you'd probably have no issues with the proprietary nature of a Bosch ebike.

You are starting to be rude, and you will not like it if I start to treat you as you are starting to treat me, so stop right now!

 

IF ANYONE IS STICKING THEIR FINGERS IN THEIR EARS AND GOING,

LA LA LA, its you!

 

GOT IT?

 

You are NOT listening to me.

 

"I DO NOT KNOW , OR WANT TO KNOW, THIS BIKE OR MANUFACTURER that you keep mentioniong"

 

I have NO interest in discussing them, with you or anyone else on this planet.

 

Why would I have ANY interest in those bikes good or bad?????

 

You have a Bee in your Bonnet, let it buzz you off.....not me!

 

I do agree with your comment about Apple and Bosch products, both are well marketed, and they get stuff sold......But I would not buy them, and have never owned either...

 

Maybe as a present only!

 

Get your fingers out your ears and go and talk to someone who gives a "F*ck", I don't, and you are making yourself look like an online stalker!

Cease and desist!

Andy

Obviously you are not very adept at research as if you had only looked on this forum you would have found plenty of information on their faults.

Another one who misses the point, I HAVE NO INTEREST IN THIS BIKE OR MANUFACTURER......or their problems.

I also know nothing about them, unlike others here, I post from a seat of knowledge, not guesswork.

I looked online, which includes Pedelec believe it or not, and they do not appear to be any worse than many other e-bikes, at a cursory glance.....

If you feel strongly about them, write your own assessment of them, and leave me out of it!

Help to inform others of the problems, before someone buys another bike from themy, that is the friendly and correct way to do it, not to pester uninterested people!!

Andy