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Ghost1951

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Article on Farage's claim that NATO and the EU provoked Putin.

Written by Ross Clark in the Spectator Magazine

Nigel Farage enjoyed a combative exchange with Nick Robinson in his BBC Panorama interview this evening, and acquitted himself well on many issues. True, the tax cuts and spending rises in his manifesto don’t add up – they rely on a rather over-hopeful expectation of the economy, as indeed do Labour’s. But then Farage is honest that he is not really selling us a programme for government, only giving an indication of the issues on which Reform UK will be pressing if succeeds in gaining a Commons presence. Therefore, his party can get away with some loose budgeting.

But at the same time Farage made his first big error – and one that could cost him dearly among many of his potential voters. He doubled down on previous remarks claiming that the West ‘provoked’ Vladimir Putin into invading Ukraine – provoked him, that is, by allowing the eastwards expansion of Nato and the EU.

It is a theory with which Farage’s friend, Donald Trump, is known to be in sympathy. But such is the apathy towards Europe on the part of many US voters that Trump might get away with it. It is a very different business when you are trying to appeal to the centre-right in Britain.


To accuse the West of provoking Putin into invading Ukraine is, frankly, outrageous. Putin tried to help himself to Ukraine not because the West was rattling sabres at him but because it was too weak. For years, the eastwards expansion of Nato was more symbolic than a genuine attempt to extend the umbrella that had protected western Europe during the cold war; it included only token deployments of weapons and personnel, and certainly no nuclear weapons as lay on the other side of the Russian border. Putin started testing western defences, and only when he was convinced the West was not going to defend Ukraine did he annex Crimea. Even then the western defence was feeble, both militarily and economically. It is remarkable to think now that the deal for the Nord Stream 2 pipeline was signed after the Crimean invasion. Europe was still at that point prepared to make itself reliant on Russian gas in spite of Russia having committed an act of war against a neighbouring country.

But even if Putin did feel threatened at any point by the symbolic eastward expansion of Nato or the EU, is Farage really trying to say that sovereign states of Eastern Europe do not have the right to decide which alliances they wish to join? You might as well say that Ireland has provoked the UK by remaining a member of the EU, and that therefore it would be entitled to invade its neighbour.

Farage has had a good campaign so far, but this is not going to encourage many erstwhile Conservative voters that he is a serious candidate to be Prime Minister – even if he could use the result of this election to manoeuvre himself into future contention.
 

soundwave

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flecc

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Article on Farage's claim that NATO and the EU provoked Putin.

Written by Ross Clark in the Spectator Magazine
Ross Clark has it wrong, Farage was right.

It's not about Ukraine's freedom to choose a defensive alliance to join, this was about the USA persuading Ukraine to join their NATO aggressive alliance and the EU for their own anti-Russian purposes.

Before the start of the 2004 US campaign under the CIA code name Euromaidan, to enlist Ukraine into NATO and the EU, the Ukraine had never expressed any interest in joining NATO. Remember, when the USSR was disbanded, Ukraine, like Belarus and Georgia, chose to stay aligned with Russia and not join into the warsaw pact countries rush into the EU. So this is nothing to do with freedom of choice, it was about the USA's political and economic bribery.
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soundwave

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lenny

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soundwave

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one of my shoes was stolen when i went for a ct scan :rolleyes:

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Woosh

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It's not about Ukraine's freedom to choose a defensive alliance to join, this was about the USA persuading Ukraine to join their NATO aggressive alliance and the EU for their own anti-Russian purposes.
the USA didn't send in troops to persuade Ukranians.
Putin threatens his neighbours including NATO countries and props up dictators.
He is a clear and present danger.
 
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Ghost1951

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the USA didn't send in troops to persuade Ukranians.
Putin threatens his neighbours including NATO countries and props up dictators.
He is a clear and present danger.
Russia has a very active network of agents acting on their behalf. They spout Putin's propaganda everywhere. Not only do they infiltrate NHS networks and blackmail the hospitals, they are also infiltrating assisted bicycling networks. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that they were behind the failure at Manchester Airport yesterday.

Only a Russian agent could suggest that Ukraine, and Georgia were in a friendly relationship with Russia. Both of them have been attacked by Russia since the 1990s. Russian agents have the temerity to tell us this is OK - including Farage and Trump. Trump has a great fear of Putin. Putin has the dirt on his deviant activities at a Moscow Hotel before he was elected.
 
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Ghost1951

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Some people don't care about staying alive. Maybe that radial engined thing is an alternative to going to Dignitas. That radial engine would have a fantastically strong gyroscopic effect that would prevent the bike leaning and steering. Even on planes with powerful steering inputs those engines affected manoeuvrability. How a man is supposed to overcome those gyro forces I have no idea.
 

saneagle

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Some people don't care about staying alive. Maybe that radial engined thing is an alternative to going to Dignitas. That radial engine would have a fantastically strong gyroscopic effect that would prevent the bike leaning and steering. Even on planes with powerful steering inputs those engines affected manoeuvrability. How a man is supposed to overcome those gyro forces I have no idea.
They've been doing it on motorbikes for years. The countermeasure is called contra-rotating shafts.
 

Ghost1951

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They've been doing it on motorbikes for years. The countermeasure is called contra-rotating shafts.
A good while back, I had a BMW R65. I bought it because I had been seduced by the 'German Reliability and engineering quality thing. I never got on with it really.

On first riding it, it was pretty disturbing to feel the way as you revved the engine up in lower gears, the bike twisted in reaction to the longitudinal rotating mass of the crankshaft, flywheel and clutch. It was quite pronounced when you accelerated hard and felt like it was taking over the bike. The same thing caused many crashes among new pilots of some single engine, WW2 fighters. Huge 14 foot, multi bladed propellers and in some cases large rotating mass of radial engines would tip the planes over on take off when the engines were suddenly revved up by beginner pilots.

The other bad thing about the R65 was that the engine had more of the characteristics of a car engine with the clutch operating at crankshaft speed on the back of the motor.
 
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saneagle

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A good while back, I had a BMW R65. I bought it because I had been seduced by the 'German Reliability and engineering quality thing. I never got on with it really.

On first riding it, it was pretty disturbing to feel the way as you revved the engine up in lower gears, the bike twisted in reaction to the longitudinal rotating mass of the crankshaft, flywheel and clutch. It was quite pronounced when you accelerated hard and felt like it was taking over the bike. The same thing caused many crashes among new pilots of some single engine, WW2 fighters. Huge 14 foot, multi bladed propellers and in some cases large rotating mass of radial engines would tip the planes over on take off when the engines were suddenly revved up by beginner pilots.

The other bad thing about the R65 was that the engine had more of the characteristics of a car engine with the clutch operating at crankshaft speed on the back of the motor.
I had a BMW R75, then a R100RT. I never experienced any problems with torque reactions. Though both were pretty crap bikes, I had no problem riding either very fast. It's just a case of smooth riding and not changing gear on roundabouts. The engines gave high torque, so you never did much gear changing anyway. IIRC, the R75 was 4-speed. It was the later one with normal forks and suspension. I did a couple of laps of the TT circuit on it on mad Sunday 1993.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
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A good while back, I had a BMW R65. I bought it because I had been seduced by the 'German Reliability and engineering quality thing. I never got on with it really.

On first riding it, it was pretty disturbing to feel the way as you revved the engine up in lower gears, the bike twisted in reaction to the longitudinal rotating mass of the crankshaft, flywheel and clutch. It was quite pronounced when you accelerated hard and felt like it was taking over the bike.
Likewise, I always disliked the torque reaction on both BMWs and our Sunbeam S7 and S8 BMW imitators.
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,163
30,581
Russia has a very active network of agents acting on their behalf. They spout Putin's propaganda everywhere. Not only do they infiltrate NHS networks and blackmail the hospitals, they are also infiltrating assisted bicycling networks. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that they were behind the failure at Manchester Airport yesterday.

Only a Russian agent could suggest that Ukraine, and Georgia were in a friendly relationship with Russia. Both of them have been attacked by Russia since the 1990s. Russian agents have the temerity to tell us this is OK - including Farage and Trump. Trump has a great fear of Putin. Putin has the dirt on his deviant activities at a Moscow Hotel before he was elected.
Even more delusional than usual, careful, that's only a short step to dementia.

More bad news for you, the newly released World Happiness report for 2024 shows that the right wing USA has dropped out of the top 20. The top four places are held by Nordic socialist countries with the remaining one, Norway, high up in 7th place.

The UK is languishing at 20th after decades of right wing rule and with only a pseudo socialist party on offer now, isn't likely to improve on that. Top cycling country The Netherlands is high up in 6th place so it seems all those Russian agents you say are infiltrating the cycling world aren't having an ill effect. Israel is a surprising 5th, they must either be masochistic or enjoy watching others suffer.
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