Price impact of the "deal"?

[peter.c]

I doubt it will change the fact we now have to pay duty and vat as once we leave, goods crossing the border will incur uk tax

 

[Woosh]

That notice was placed before the deal was agreed, so presumably it will now change again.

the EU/UK deal affect only products originating from the UK and EU only. PSW Power sell Chinese parts, they are not covered by the deal.

 

[montwo]

the EU/UK deal affect only products originating from the UK and EU only. PSW Power sell Chinese parts, they are not covered by the deal.

I stand corrected. As long as they get around to sending my kit I ordered 2.5 flipping weeks ago I'm not too fussed.

 

[Woosh]

one issue that is a direct consequence of the UK leaving the single market is warranty replacement.
Goods sent back for repair or replacement to an EU country must be accompanied by various declarations and proof that duty and VAT have been paid.
If you don't have the appropriate paperwork, your replacement will be charged duty and VAT again.

 

[Edward Elizabeth]

The only way imported bikes will get cheaper is if there is a sustained relative rise in the value of the pound. Who knows if that would happen, because currency markets are manipulated for momentary gain and you can't safely predict a rise or fall. All speculators apcare about is movement in either direction upon which the can trade.

Over 90% of the worlds wealth is generated from the buying and selling of currency in order to make a profit, that's how significant curremcy speculation has become,

 

[egroover]

the EU/UK deal affect only products originating from the UK and EU only. PSW Power sell Chinese parts, they are not covered by the deal.

How would customs/dhl/royal mail know what country the goods originated from? They'll just see it's been sent by pswpower from Germany / Poland etc

 

[Woosh]

the sender has to provide to the courier commercial invoice, HS (harmonised system) code and indicate country of origin.
At the recipient end, the courier needs these documents to clear the goods through customs.
If you are caught lying, the consequence can be severe.

I assemble bikes in Southend, in order for me to sell to the EU, I will have to buy 60% of the parts from the EU.
That's why I have to stop selling my bikes and kits to EU customers because of EU anti dumping levy on Chinese e-bikes.

 

[egroover]

the sender has to provide to the courier commercial invoice, HS (harmonised system) code and indicate country of origin.
At the recipient end, the courier needs these documents to clear the goods through customs.
If you are caught lying, the consequence can be severe.

I assemble bikes in Southend, in order for me to sell to the EU, I will have to buy 60% of the parts from the EU.
That's why I have to stop selling my bikes and kits to EU customers because of EU anti dumping levy on Chinese e-bikes.

so now pswpower kits and batteries will be subject to vat at 17.5% etc payable by the end customer when shipped from EU (presumably this already is applied if arriving directly from China)?

 

[Woosh]

You pay 5% import duty on motors and batteries, then the VAT using this formula (goods + freight + insurance) * (1 + duty) * 20%
In the UK, it's called form C88. Just google it.
Royal Mail and DHL charge £11 to fill in your C88 but they need the correct documentations otherwise, they can't release it to you.
The main problem is when you are not sure of the contents, you will need the supplier to provide you with a certificate of origin, that costs £75.
Welcome to my world.

 

[egroover]

You pay 5% import duty on motors and batteries, then the VAT using this formula (goods + freight + insurance) * (1 + duty) * 20%
In the UK, it's called form C88. Just google it.
Royal Mail and DHL charge £11 to fill in your C88 but they need the correct documentations otherwise, they can't release it to you.
The main problem is when you are not sure of the contents, you will need the supplier to provide you with a certificate of origin, that costs £75.
Welcome to my world.

sounds like death by red tape. Had a look on your website, do you sell the 36v BBS01 250w kits without a battery, in stock and if so how much? cheers

 

[Woosh]

sounds like death by red tape.

it's OK if you import a container except for the delay but imagine selling kit parts from your website. Paypal/Amazon/Ebay will make your life hell if customers raise a dispute.
Border Force or customs officials can also require that you show proof of payment - just to be sure that the amount on the invoice is correct.

do you sell the 36v BBS01 250w kits without a battery

I used to sell BBS01B on their own but not at the moment.

 

[Bonzo Banana]

I thought there was going to be some sort of prepaid tax arrangement for the UK when buying from aliexpress, ebay etc from outside the UK. So that on the aliexpress site the UK price simply ups by 20% and the VAT is prepaid with no additional end costs from the consumer. I have no idea how long this will take to be implemented but I saw it stated somewhere as being relatively soon.

I think ultimately EU goods will get more expensive and many goods from elsewhere in the world will get cheaper sometimes much cheaper but you are looking at something like 6 months probably before everything is settled and the overall saving will be relative to the value of the £. Yes the UK should have a rocky road initially but some key indicators of our economy may show improvement relatively quickly which could boost the £. To be honest though the UK needs a far lower value £ to boost exports and lower imports. We need to return to a trading surplus as a critical part of our recovery and to get to a position to start paying back our huge debts.

 

[Fordulike]

I thought there was going to be some sort of prepaid tax arrangement for the UK when buying from aliexpress, ebay etc from outside the UK. So that on the aliexpress site the UK price simply ups by 20% and the VAT is prepaid with no additional end costs from the consumer. I have no idea how long this will take to be implemented but I saw it stated somewhere as being relatively soon.

I think ultimately EU goods will get more expensive and many goods from elsewhere in the world will get cheaper sometimes much cheaper but you are looking at something like 6 months probably before everything is settled and the overall saving will be relative to the value of the £. Yes the UK should have a rocky road initially but some key indicators of our economy may show improvement relatively quickly which could boost the £. To be honest though the UK needs a far lower value £ to boost exports and lower imports. We need to return to a trading surplus as a critical part of our recovery and to get to a position to start paying back our huge debts.

This is the eBay reponse to potential changes:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/vat-obligations-eu?id=4650

 

[Woosh]

This is the eBay reponse to potential changes:

This change is long overdue.
If I sell something from my website, I am responsible for collection of taxes, so why not ebay, amazon etc?
They ship £ billions every year, think of the 20% tax income for the Treasury.

 

[Bonzo Banana]

This is the eBay reponse to potential changes:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/vat-obligations-eu?id=4650

Yes that's exactly what I meant. Now traders in the UK can buy in bulk and compete with direct sellers outside the EU plus of course a lot more VAT comes into the treasury. I think a lot more taxation should be focused on goods it is a way to control imports especially the most damaging imports and puts the burden of taxation more on those importing more and damaging the economy. In sectors where we don't have a homegrown industry taxation goes up and where we are competing more taxation is lower. You see many taxation regimes like that in Asia. Taxation regimes that support assembly plants even if most of the components are imported still provide jobs and the possibility of complete export products.

 

[Woosh]

the problem that existed before (not charging VAT) was allowed to fester because our government kept the VAT registration threshold too high (£85,000 per annum). This is now corrected indirectly by making the platforms (ebay/amazon) responsible for collecting VAT.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/selling/vat-obligations-eu?id=4650

The changes at a glance

• eBay will collect and remit VAT on orders up to a value of £135 imported into the UK and sold to consumers. There will no longer be a VAT exemption for small consignments up to £15.
• In cases where the seller is a non-UK business and the goods are already in the UK, eBay will collect and remit VAT for goods sold to consumers within the UK, regardless of their value.
• If the buyer is a UK VAT-registered business and provides their valid UK VAT registration number, eBay will not collect UK VAT and instead the responsibility to account for VAT will switch to the UK VAT-registered business customer.
• All sellers listing on eBay.co.uk will have to provide a gross price and separate VAT rate, so that eBay can determine the correct amount of VAT to collect from consumers. For non-EU/UK sellers, unless you have included UK or EU VAT in your pricing calculations, the VAT rate will usually be 0%.
• All prices on eBay.co.uk will be displayed inclusive of UK VAT.
• Where eBay is responsible for collecting VAT on orders sent to a UK delivery address, this amount will also be shown separately at checkout.

 

[peter.c]

The ebay problem will be sellers that appear to be private and based in the uk ,but the goods sent via a 3rd party from china . Have encountered this a lot recently with items sent by air then via a mailing company in Hayes /Heathrow but ebay user is registered as a private seller in uk so classed as a uk sale

 

[Fordulike]

Ebay has already had this VAT payment system in effect with Norway, for a few months now. Apparently, the Norwegian's have something called the VOEC system.

Shouldn't be difficult for eBay to implement something similar with other country tax authorities.

 

[Woosh]

The ebay problem will be sellers that appear to be private and based in the uk ,but the goods sent via a 3rd party from china . Have encountered this a lot recently with items sent by air then via a mailing company in Hayes /Heathrow but ebay user is registered as a private seller in uk so classed as a uk sale

that business model will be corrected from 1/1/2021 - ebay will take 20% of the sale to remit to HMRC. We should see prices going up.

Apparently, the Norwegian's have something called the VOEC system.

Shouldn't be difficult for eBay to implement something similar with other country tax authorities.

The last time I sent a kit to Norway, DPD Europe charged me £25 in forwarding agent fees.
ParcelForce would have charged less but can't take batteries.
The system is easy to use. Each person has a tax ID for all imports.

 

[Deleted member 33385]

Yes that's exactly what I meant. Now traders in the UK can buy in bulk and compete with direct sellers outside the EU plus of course a lot more VAT comes into the treasury. I think a lot more taxation should be focused on goods it is a way to control imports especially the most damaging imports and puts the burden of taxation more on those importing more and damaging the economy. In sectors where we don't have a homegrown industry taxation goes up and where we are competing more taxation is lower. You see many taxation regimes like that in Asia. Taxation regimes that support assembly plants even if most of the components are imported still provide jobs and the possibility of complete export products.

The trouble is, China has the world's largest natural supply of rare earth minerals used in magnets, batteries and most other electronics - we'd have to import much of that at a higher cost (even more so going forward) than Chinese manufacturers.