Police say electric bikes illegal in Northern Ireland

[Tim]

I've found a relevant reference now. The European order was passed into law by an amendment to a UK law, the Motor Cycles Etc. (EC Type Approval) Regulations 1999 (SI 1999/2920) as amended.

Therefore, although our EAPC law doesn't apply in Northern Ireland the EU law does. That means they cannot have throttle control only bikes past or present, only full time pedelec permitted.
.

That's an interesting distinction, so the policemen were right, but only on the grounds of their limited understanding of the different classes of electric bike. A Kalkhoff would still be perfectly legal to ride on the public roads. Good.

 

[Bikerbob]

Hi Bob

That does sound to be eminently sensible!

If I recall correctly, it's comparatively recently that the IOM and the Irish Republic got around to fitting in with UK licence suspensions. Not too long ago you could get banned from driving in the IOM but still drive perfectly legally in the rest of the UK.

Rog.

Hi Rog,

True. Until fairly recently local legislation also allowed for the flogging of violent youths, the jailing of homosexuals, and the shooting of a Scotsman on sight. We have to accept that that times change though! It would be good if the enlightenment would stretch to electric bikes.

Bob

 

[Beeping-Sleauty]

On 1st August 1999, new legislation came into force to allow a fixed penalty notice to be served on anyone who is guilty of cycling on a footway. However the Home Office issued guidance on how the new legislation should be applied, indicating that they should only be used where a cyclist is riding in a manner that may endanger others.

Thanks Flecc, i know you've posted this before but it won't do any harm to display it again....

i don't make a habit of riding on the pavement, but when i do, i ensure there are no pedestrians and exercise extreme caution around any that appear.

however on this occasion, i was stopped whilst walking the bike and i got the distinct impression that words or printed matter would prove irrelevent to this 'semi-cop' in his shiny blue pyjamas. He simply did not want hear anything i might have to say, His attitude & posture said it all.

i was sorely tempted to test his mettle and provoke him into giving me the dammed £30 ticket, just so that i could dissemble him at the local county court and get a proper tested definition, i am however, old enough & sane enough to know this would not be the end of the matter and might just prove to be the start of my troubles.

ho...humm

 

[murphy61]

That's an interesting distinction, so the policemen were right, but only on the grounds of their limited understanding of the different classes of electric bike. A Kalkhoff would still be perfectly legal to ride on the public roads. Good.

I'd like to second that- as I live in Northern Ireland and recently bought an Agattu!

But I also agree with Bikerbob - sometimes its best not to ask too many questions.

 

[rooel]

"You could carry a printout of the following when out, hand it to any officer who behaves in this way and point out the following: Cycling on the pavement isn't necessarily illegal and the officers are disobeying orders, ignorance of those orders being no excuse. An instant automatic penalty should not be applied in all circumstances...."​

If you ride your bike in Scotland remember that Paul Boateng's statement does not apply here. I have just received a letter from The Scottish Government Transport Directorate to the effect that the statutory provision under which the statement was made (Article 3 of regulations made under the Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988) does not apply to Scotland. There are therefore no plans to issue a similar statement here.

It would be possible however for the Scottish Justice Minister and the Crown Office to issue a statement to the effect that throughout Scotland police and other enforcement officers will exercise a discretion similar to that mentioned in the statement, and I think I shall press them to do so.

 

[flecc]

Good idea Rooel, it would be rational in this case to have alignment.

Thanks also for the reminder to Scottish members about this not applying in their country.

With the subject of the differences in Northern Ireland and the Isle of Man raised above, there's a comprehensive nationalist theme developing in this thread. As yet the Welsh are unable to rule separately on such matters though this could change before too long, but those few who still want Cornish independence will almost certainly be disappointed.
.

 

[Phil the drill]

Hi Rog,

Until fairly recently local legislation also allowed for the flogging of violent youths, the jailing of homosexuals, and the shooting of a Scotsman on sight.

Bob

I heard that it only applied to Welshmen seen after dark in Shrewsbury?

Phil

 

[murphy61]

Going back to the original topic regarding Northern Ireland, I got some info from a relative who was until recently a big shot in central government information services.

The Road Traffic (Northern Ireland) Order 1995 (No. 2994 (N.I. 18)) - Statute Law Database
The Road Traffic (Northern Ireland) Order 1995 (No. 2994 (N.I. 18))
Electrically assisted pedal cycles
46. (1) An electrically assisted pedal cycle of a class specified in regulations made for the purposes of Article 6 shall not be driven on a road by a person under the age of 14.
(2) A person who
(a) drives such a pedal cycle; or
(b) knowing or suspecting that another person is under the age of 14, causes or permits him to drive such a pedal cycle,
in contravention of paragraph (1), is guilty of an offence.


The Road Traffic (Northern Ireland) Order 1995 (No. 2994 (N.I. 18)) - Statute Law Database
Certain vehicles not to be treated as motor vehicles
6. (1) For the purposes of the Road Traffic Orders [F1 or the Offenders Order]
(a) a mechanically propelled vehicle being an implement for cutting grass which is controlled by a pedestrian and is not capable of being used or adapted for any other purpose;
(b) any other mechanically propelled vehicle controlled by a pedestrian which may be prescribed for the purposes of this Article; and
(c) an electrically assisted pedal cycle of such a class as may be so prescribed,
is to be treated as not being a motor vehicle.
(2) In paragraph (1) “controlled by a pedestrian” means that the vehicle either
(a) is constructed or adapted for use only under such control; or
(b) is constructed or adapted for use either under such control or under the control of a person carried on it, but is not for the time being in use under, or proceeding under, the control of a person carried on it.


http://www.dvlni.gov.uk/vehicles/vehicle_forms/msva_ni_application.pdf
MSVA does not apply to the following vehicles:
• Vehicles with a maximum design speed not exceeding 6km/h.
• Cycles with pedal assistance which are equipped with an auxiliary electric motor having a maximum continuous rated power of 0.25kW, of which the output is progressively reduced and finally cut off as the vehicle reaches a speed of 25km/h, or sooner, if the cyclist stops pedalling.

For further information on NI Tests
Visit the DVTA website at www.doeni.gov.uk/dvta/ or
• call DVTA Mallusk Testing Centre on 028 9084 2111
For Information on GB tests and test centres
• visit the VOSA website at VOSA corporate website or
• call the VOSA national number on 0870 6060 440.

http://www.dvlni.gov.uk/vehicles/vehicle_forms/MAS_3.pdf
So it looks from that as though there is no specific distinction between pedelecs and ebikes with throttles (would many people know the difference?) so I guess there's nothing to worry about. (Provided nobody asks the question!)

 

[flecc]

MSVA does not apply to the following vehicles:
• Vehicles with a maximum design speed not exceeding 6km/h.
• Cycles with pedal assistance which are equipped with an auxiliary electric motor having a maximum continuous rated power of 0.25kW, of which the output is progressively reduced and finally cut off as the vehicle reaches a speed of 25km/h, or sooner, if the cyclist stops pedalling.

Many thanks for the information Murphy. The section I've quoted above is the Northern Ireland implementation of the 2003 EU directive. The part I've highlighted in bold letters is the ban on throttle control only, so that is clearly illegal in Northern Ireland. As in Europe, throttles are permitted only if the pedelec cuts the power when pedalling stops.

At present in Great Britain, we can use throttle only without pedalling and buy bikes with that facility under our old EAPC regulations, though we know that right will be lost once our laws are rationalised. However, owners of existing bikes will not be affected and will be able to continue with throttle only control while those bikes last.

That's the key difference between Britain's and Northern Ireland's law.
.

 

[wotwozere]

Hi

Thats put me of Guiness.
Not taking my bike there.

thx

Bob

 

[rooel]

A very interesting thread for someone like myself who is hoping to do some ebiking in Donegal in the near future. Rather than remove the throttle control I have been thinking of disabling the throttle by unplugging it from the controller, provided of course the pedelec and other controls will still function normally. The other simpler possibility I have in mind is to make the throttle impossible to turn by simply taping, and thereby also concealing, it securely in the off position with some black gaffer tape. Any views?

 

[john h]

donegal is in the irish republic,

 

[rooel]

Donegal certainly is, and is therefore in the EU where the no-throttle-power without also pedalling regulations apply.

 

[melspea]

Donegal certainly is, and is therefore in the EU where the no-throttle-power without also pedalling regulations apply.

Superb! Now we have a geography-improving website for free without having to leave these pages. Lifelong learning through just having an interest in bikes offering a little help pedalling.....how good is that!

Melissa

 

[Blew it]

There's no fool like an old fool

Relaxed after several club measures of Famous Grouse, a warm feeling of nostalgia crept over me....so many of the long standing but seldom visiting members suddenly contributing to the forum again.

....and then I spotted the date on which the thread was started.....January 2009

 

[Deleted member 4366]

A very interesting thread for someone like myself who is hoping to do some ebiking in Donegal in the near future. Rather than remove the throttle control I have been thinking of disabling the throttle by unplugging it from the controller, provided of course the pedelec and other controls will still function normally. The other simpler possibility I have in mind is to make the throttle impossible to turn by simply taping, and thereby also concealing, it securely in the off position with some black gaffer tape. Any views?

It''s a one minute job to remove the throttle! Then there's no doubt.

 

[Scimitar]

A very interesting thread for someone like myself who is hoping to do some ebiking in Donegal in the near future. Rather than remove the throttle control I have been thinking of disabling the throttle by unplugging it from the controller, provided of course the pedelec and other controls will still function normally. The other simpler possibility I have in mind is to make the throttle impossible to turn by simply taping, and thereby also concealing, it securely in the off position with some black gaffer tape. Any views?

Do you think the Gardai will give a toss about an electric bike, when there's doughnuts to eat?

 

[funkylyn]

Having cycled for years in Spain,Portugal and France with a throttle......honestly, no one is going to give a toss, so I really dont think there is any need to remove your throttle or disguise it for your holiday.

Theres 'being careful' and then theres 'being paranoid'.......

Anyway, isnt the understanding the same as in other instances , whilst in another EU country, as long as its legal in your country of residence then its ok where you are holidaying......

I would state the specific instances I have, in the recesses of my mind ....... but I havent had my coffee yet......perhaps someone who has had their coffee can remind me of the specifics Im trying to think of.

Lynda

 

[jackhandy]

Until that horrible moment when someone's dog nips out right in front of you...

THEN, you can bet the b¥§§€rs are going to have a look-see at your bike.

Or are they just out to get me?

 

[ghouluk]

H
Theres 'being careful' and then theres 'being paranoid'.......

with everyone out to get me, paranoia is only smart thinking........that jam pan is only ever one bag of preserving sugar away.

in a more serious note, i know 3 people in cork who ride ebikes who bought UK ones to get the throttle - garda don't know and don't care, i mean this is a country where half the people never took their driving test (you can drive on your own as a learner and don't have to display l plates - supposed limited to two years, but i've brought employees over to work in UK from ROI, and they have had to very quickly do driving tests