Panasonic 18 Ah battery?

[flecc]

There is always some price premium on brand specific products, companies know that customers will pay more for the genuine article.

For example, check online for a replacement battery for your digital camera and you'll find an unbranded one is very much less costly than the camera branded one.

The markup can be extreme and even a rip-off of course, I remember one case of Lucas Electrical parts repackaged by Volvo in boxes marked Volvo at three times the Lucas price.

That's not normally the case with e-bike batteries though, we largely get what we pay for as numerous early failures of the batteries on low cost bikes have shown. Fortunately most have been warranty replaced so mainly only the inconvenience suffered, but type for type, they've still eventually had shorter lives than the top make ones.
.

 

[lemmy]

For example, check online for a replacement battery for your digital camera and you'll find an unbranded one is very much less costly than the camera branded one.

As an example, a 'genuine' battery for my Pentax k5 costs £52. As a back up, I bought one on eBay one for £4.95 including postage.

I haven't formally tested them but I don't find the 'hookey' item any different in build or performance from the genuine article and I've had them both for a year now.

So, I've been looking on eBay for an 18ah at the same discount - ie 500/(52/5) but they don't appear to have any at £48 so I guess the children will have to go without food for a month or two.

 

[magnuken]

Ok, but I think some 600-700 euros are very too much for an 18 Ah Pedelec battery!

So, please if you know some substitutes for this very expensive Panasonic 18 Ah Pedelec battery, then please tell me and other Kalkhoff and Rixe users!

 

[flecc]

There are none that will fit in the original location. You can buy lower cost packs from such as BMS battery or Li Ping, both direct from China, but you would have to arrange a housing for them and mount the pack on the bike's carrier, arranging connections to the reverse of the Panasonic unit battery platform.

Whether the saving is worth that loss of convenience and long warranty only you can decide.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Competitive priced batteries are already here.

Kudos is earning a healthy profit margin on it's LifePo4 batteries,replacement cost including vat from £156.00,average about £210.00 .The more I get involved in this e-bike business the more I realise that these high bike prices and in particular battery prices is designed to force customers into buying a new bike every 3 years,Euro 600 plus for a replacement battery is ridiculous. These LifePo4 batteries are proving long life(1500 cycles),reasonable price-their only downside is their weight about 30% heavier than Lithium Polymer. We are selling a lot of spare batteries to bikes not made by Kudos and some customers are adapting their bikes to take the Kudos batteries rather than spend out on the OEM battery.
In all other industries copies of the OEM product (see auto batteries,brake pads etc etc) evolve which tends to keep down the cost of the OEM product-unfortunately the e-bike industry just does not have enough volume and the battery shapes so diverse this is not currently possible-but if one battery hits enough volume I will actively look at my battery manufacturer to make copies.
We have a number of Sunlova customers who have found that our Cheetah battery is a straight swap.
It's all a bit of 'chicken n egg'-the market needs to expand to boost volumes,costs will then reduce(we bought 500 off our 36v x 10Ah battery,thats how we can achieve the £208.80 price),the rest of the market will have to respond to survive and volumes will boost more. But in the Uk e-bikes are still a niche product and hence expensive.

 

[Scottyf]

There's also the added issue that even if you do find an alternative 80% of the time its over in China.
Which leads to possible warranty problems along with long waiting times and increased shipping cost.

This also puts alot of people off. Which is a shame. I think the fact there are a few suppliers out there do a 36v 10ah battery at £200 is very reasonable and not much cheaper if you go direct to China.

Least you get some support and warranty which is worth paying for.

If I never went down the Lipo route and monkeying about I would have brought one of these £200 batteries without hesitation. If I wanted more range. I'd buy another one.

 

[magnuken]

Kudos is earning a healthy profit margin on it's LifePo4 batteries,replacement cost including vat from £156.00,average about £210.00 .

Ok, tell me please where to get a Panasonic 18 Ah battery to a reasonible price!

 

[tillson]

Ok, tell me please where to get a Panasonic 18 Ah battery to a reasonible price!

I don't think that you will find an 18 Ah Panasonic battery. Kalkhoff supply an 18 Ah battery that is designed for and will fit the Panasonic motor. 50 Cycles sell it link here

It's £525 which is a large outlay, but if it is of the same quality as the original 10 Ah Panasonic battery, it should last well and give you a reasonable return.

 

[flecc]

As Tillson says, you will not find a cheaper 18 Ah one for the Panasonic unit, they don't exist.

As I've said earlier, the 18 Ah battery is not made by Panasonic anyway, it's made in Germany by BMZ for Kalkhoff, and I'm sure you will be aware that quality German products or not low priced. The largest battery that Panasonic make for standard fitting to your bike is 12 Ah. The 16 Ah one they make needs your bike to be modified for it to fit, and the Panasonic batteries are similarly expensive.

Again as said before by several of us, you can buy a lower cost battery from a different manufacturer, but you will have to find somewhere to mount it like the rear carrier, devise a housing for it and arrange wiring connections into the Panasonic unit.

 

[magnuken]

As Tillson says, you will not find a cheaper 18 Ah one for the Panasonic unit, they don't exist.

Ok, thanks for the information!

I have now understand from your answers that these Rixe/Kalkhoff 18 Ah batteries also cost in Britain some 630 euros and can not be found cheaper. To that price I can now a days also bay such a battery from Finland. So, I will bay this greater battery from my own supplier in Tampere, Finland.

Best Regards
Kentsu

 

[flecc]

Probably best Kentsu. Some while ago we researched buying Panasonic batteries from various places. Although the lowest cost at source was in Japan, by the time one was shipped with duties to the UK, there was nothing to be gained. Given what has happened to exchange rates since, the position is probably even worse now.