New Bike - Specialized Turbo Levo

[mab13]

A few months ago, my hankering after a hardtail began and only grew stronger. So, having recently sold my Bosch powered full suspension Cube (which I've absolutely loved over the last 12 months), I set about my hardtail quest.

Having demo'd the Specialized Turbo Levo HT Comp 6Fattie extensively, this was the benchmark. I really liked the visual integration of the battery and motor, the Brose motor itself (particularly how quiet it is), the plus size wheels / tyres and a few other bits and bobs... particularly how 'natural' it felt in terms of balance, power delivery and the lack of bar mounted controls and displays (also a negative, but what can you do).

The only potential challenger would have been a much lighter bike (say 17kg) but there aren't any plus size bikes at that weight. So, the Levo HT is ordered and I will collect in two weeks' time.

Two weeks will be a difficult wait which I'll try to fill by researching the various items I'll need to purchase before it arrives. The two immediate priorities are pedals (fairly certain I'll go with Shimano Saint MX80 flat pedals which should pair nicely with my Five Tens) and a pair of tubeless valves.

Getting very excited now.

 

[EddiePJ]

Can't beat a hard tail.

Oddly, whilst waiting to take part in the last Wiggle ride, I got to thinking that at these events, there is a broad spectrum of pedal mtb's but Specialized must rank as the most popular choice of bike.
It got me thinking that with the rising popularity in e-mtb's that Specialized could end up being a major contender in the market.

It'll interesting to see how things go for you with it long term. Good luck with the new toy, and enjoy the ride.

 

[mab13]

Picked up yesterday... and I love it!

Bike has been setup as tubeless, Shimano Saint pedals installed, the usual bits added including my tiny Knog lights and my old Garmin, etc. and I'm good to go.

Spent a bit of time messing with the Mission Control app yesterday which enables the various assist levels to be configured, but fine tuning will need to be informed by a few rides first.

It looks really mean and stealth with the matte blank paint finish and the big 3" tyres.

I only have time to potter around this weekend, but I'll have a big ride next weekend including bridleways, forest singletrack, fire roads, a couple of technical rocky descents, etc... although I'm sure it will perform just like the test bike which I've written up in a different thread.

The biggest failing on the test bike was the rubbish dropper post, which I'm really pleased to say has been significantly improved on my production version. I'd been considering a Reverb Stealth upgrade, but I don't think that's needed now which is a bonus.

Overall, I'm extremely pleased so far with no hint of buyer's remorse!

 

[LeighPing]

Nice.

 

[EddiePJ]

Sort it out mab13, it's far too clean.

Very nice looking bike, and unlike many, I suspect that you will be someone that will be both getting it dirty at the first opportunity, and also getting full use from the bike, come wet or dry .

Being black and a pig of a colour to keep clean, a handy hint for when you are cleaning it after a ride, buy yourself a can of ForkJuice* and use that to spray on and wipe off. Keep it well away from brake components though.

http://www.juicelubes.co.uk/fork-juice.html It isn't cheap, but a little goes a long way, and a can lasts for seemingly ever.

I've tried plenty of other products, and Fork Juice is easily the best to date. It is also very good at shedding mud come wash down time.


ref the seat post, I'd suggest just going with it.






*not Frame Juice as it isn't as good, and just evaporates off.



.

 

[baldylox]

Very nice bike, am interested to know what you think of the bride motor, is it particularly tourquey?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

 

[soundwave]

http://www.brose-ebike.com/en/the-motor/

 

[cyberdyne_systems]

Looks really great, very stealthy!

 

[mab13]

Thanks all - I'll get a few more detailed pics up over the next few days as there are some pretty cool bits and bobs on the bike that I believe may be of interest to some of you.

Sort it out mab13, it's far too clean.

Very nice looking bike, and unlike many, I suspect that you will be someone that will be both getting it dirty at the first opportunity, and also getting full use from the bike, come wet or dry .

Being black and a pig of a colour to keep clean, a handy hint for when you are cleaning it after a ride, buy yourself a can of ForkJuice* and use that to spray on and wipe off. Keep it well away from brake components though.

http://www.juicelubes.co.uk/fork-juice.html It isn't cheap, but a little goes a long way, and a can lasts for seemingly ever.

I've tried plenty of other products, and Fork Juice is easily the best to date. It is also very good at shedding mud come wash down time.


ref the seat post, I'd suggest just going with it.


*not Frame Juice as it isn't as good, and just evaporates off.

You're absolutely right - I'll be out next weekend come rain or shine and the bike will be put through its paces! I'll remember to get some good pics for the MTB thread.

I love my bike getting filthy as it means I'm using it properly, but I also enjoy giving it a good clean so thanks for the heads up re: Fork Juice. The matte black colour scheme is going to be a bugger to keep clean, but I've bought some matte helicopter frame tape which should arrive in the next few days and I intend to (at least partially) wrap the frame and forks - not done this before so it will either work or it won't depending on my wrapping skills, but worth a go for a few pounds.

As for the Reverb Stealth, I had one on my recently sold Cube and it was superb. I've not tried my new (cable rather than hydraulic) TransX in anger yet. It'll get some heavy use next weekend though so I'll see how it performs and decide from there.

Very nice bike, am interested to know what you think of the bride motor, is it particularly tourquey?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

I wrote up my thoughts on this bike (including the motor) in post number 12 of this thread:

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/new-specialized-turbo-levo-models-hardtails-fat-bikes.24164/

Regarding torque, for which I'm aware there is limited measurement consistency between manufacturers, Brose report 90Nm. Ignoring the numbers and going purely by feel, there is a real kick from the motor and I have absolute confidence attacking certain trail inclines which I have no right to succeed on - the Brose motor is up there with the best I've tried when it comes to torque.

From the testing I've done thus far I do, however, feel that the Bosch motor is just a little more 'polished' - it's a little more tuned in to what I want it to do and when I want it to do it, it backs off the torque automatically when changing gear, etc. However, the Brose motor is pretty much silent, more natural somehow (which could be partly because you can't hear it) and is more configurable through the Specialized app. The Bosch and the Brose both have advantages and disadvantages over one another.

It will be interesting to see how my opinions develop as I use the Turbo Levo more over the coming months.

 

[mab13]

Ok, so a few more pics and additional information...

The bar is really sparse with no computer screen or bar mounted assist mode selector. I really like the simplicity, the lack of clutter and not constantly looking at ride stats, etc. although I will use my old Garmin on certain rides. However, this does come with the compromise of a more fiddly process to change the assist mode (which we'll come on to shortly).

So this is the downtube mounted user interface. It is super simple with a plus and minus sign to change assist mode and each green light representing 10% battery increments. Again, it's really neat and integrated, but comes with the compromise that having to reach for the downtube when in motion isn't ideal and the buttons can be a tad fiddly when wearing gloves. Specialized do sell (yes, you have to buy it) a bar mounted remote but I'm going to see how I get on without it first given how much I like the uncluttered bar.

Next is the battery. Whilst I never experienced any rattling with my Bosch battery, I seem to recall one or two people complaining of that in the past. I can see little chance of that happening with the Levo as the battery mounts under tension using a thru axle and feels incredibly secure. It is also also IP67 waterproof rated. As a potential compromise, the battery is not locked in place... and unscrewing a thru axle is a bit more of a faff than a simple key turn.

The battery itself is 460Wh on my Levo. The battery is also both Bluetooth and ANT+ enabled so the Mission Control app on my iPhone connects to configure various stuff (e.g. the assist levels) and it connects to my Garmin via ANT+ on a fake channel to show the remaining battery percentage to the nearest 1% (yes, that's 1%).

There are no frame mounted cables whatsoever - everything is run internally within the frame. Sorry for the rubbish photo, but you can make out the cables mounted to the inside of the downtube which are protected by the battery, but easy to get to with the battery removed. I dislike the look of frame mounted cables, so this solution dealt really well with my cable OCD.

I really like the 27.5+ tyres - they're 3" wide and inspire a lot of confidence. Equally, in my quest for a hardtail, I though the extra volume would provide a little more comfort on the more aggressive trails... and they really do. I expect to see quite a few more plus size hardtails on offer in manufacturers' 2017 product lines. The tyre in the photo below makes the massive 200mm rotor look quite small. The photo looking down at the tyre I don't think quite does the size justice.

And finally, as I know a lot of you like downtube mounted bottle holders... here is mine! I don't actually use it though as I always have a hydration pack on my back with my toolkit, etc. This bottle holder is part of Specialized's SWAT offering (Storage, Water, Air, Tools) and has a small tool mounted to the underside. I was hoping the Levo would come with a chain tool integrated into the top cap too, but it didn't. :-(

That's it for now - just need to find the time to get out and ride it properly! That will be this coming weekend at the very latest.

 

[LeighPing]

Great review and awesome pics. It's a shame that you're going to get dirt on it.

 

[mab13]

I thought this may be of interest to some of you regarding the Brose system and Specialized's specific implementation of it.

Specialized have an app, called Mission Control, which you can download to your mobile and then connect to the bike via Bluetooth. The app enables you to configure certain parameters, monitor ride stats, navigate via sat nav, etc.

However, the power configuration is rather interesting. This is the screen where you configure your assist levels:

However, it's not as straight forward as it first appears.

The acceleration response is the easy one, it's how quickly the bike accelerates. I've set this to Eco as it feels really natural when setting off, rather than lurching forward with what feels like immediate max torque.

The max motor current represents the maximum number of watts the motor will provide. So, at 100% the max assist watts the motor will provide is apparently 450W, at 90% the motor would never give your more than 405W, at 80% no more than 360W, etc..

That brings us on to the assist levels themselves which work slightly different to how I thought they did.

The assist % does NOT restrict the maximum number of watts the motor will provide, so you can get the full 450W of assist whether you have set an assist level of 50% or 100%. Bear with me...

The assist % essentially defines the rider input levels at which you receive a given level of motor assist. The motor can provide a maximum of c.300W per 100W of rider input, so:

- at 50% assist, total power equals 100W rider input plus (300W X 50%) motor assist = total 250W
- at 100% assist, total power equals 100W rider input plus (300W X 100%) motor assist = total 400W

If rider input increases to 150W:

- at 50% assist, total power equals 150W rider input plus (450W X 50%) motor assist = total 375W
- at 100% assist, total power equals 150W rider input plus (450W X 100%) motor assist = total 600W

Therefore, at 100% assist level and only 150W rider input, the motor is providing its maximum output of 450W. Any more rider input will not come with a commensurate increase in motor output as it is already maxed out.

However, at 50% assist level, increasing rider input over 150W does come with a commensurate increase in motor output as it still has more to give.

Whilst the max motor output of 450W is achieved at 150W rider input at the 100% assist level, max motor output can also be achieved in 50% assist level if rider input reaches 300W.

The relationship between rider input and engine output is shown in this table:

And if you understand all that first time through, I applaud you!

 

[anotherkiwi]

They are German so they are applying the Factor 4 regulation apparently. Read the article on Bike Europe about Factor 4 about half way down the page

 

[EddiePJ]

And if you understand all that first time through, I applaud you!

That is where my interest in ever owning the bike would go. You can adjust power delivery settings on Nyon as well, which I removed, as I personally don't like gadgetry, preferring to concentrate on just riding the bike.

It doesn't take much for me to switch off and loose all interest.

 

[mab13]

That is where my interest in ever owning the bike would go. You can adjust power delivery settings on Nyon as well, which I removed, as I personally don't like gadgetry, preferring to concentrate on just riding the bike.

It doesn't take much for me to switch off and loose all interest.

I do get your point but once configured to my liking, I can forget all about it and just ride. That is my preference too which is why I'm such a big fan of the uncluttered bar and lack of bar mounted user interface, etc... but I do quite like all the configuration stuff when I'm not out riding!

You have educated me on the Nyon - I didn't realise it could do that.

 

[KeithMac]

Very nice bike you've go there!, nice and simple design and very secure battery locking.

 

[Decca]

I've had one of these for a couple of months. Prior to that I had a Haibike Xduro Allmtn Pro for 18 months. Apart from the fact that it's a hardtail, it's better than the Haibike in almost every way. I had a lot of problems with the Haibike - the motor was replaced twice (the first one failed and the second got very noisy), the bearings were very poor quality and corroded easily, cable rub attacked the frame after just a few miles, the rear shock was exposed to stone strikes, the Nyon bezel disappeared without trace, the chain rubbed on the motor cover and the gearing was all wrong.

The 16 tooth chainwheel on Bosch Haibikes is internally geared by a factor of 2.5, making it 40 tooth equivalent. That's far too large. I spent most of my time using just half of the cassette.The gearing on the Levo is so much better. I can climb some slopes that I couldn't manage on the Haibike and am using every cog on the cassette.

Moreover, the build quality and design of the Levo is night and day better, and makes the Haibikes look extremely overpriced.

Unfortunately, I found the ride of a hardtail too harsh for me on technical trails, and the matt black paint finish rather vulnerable, so am trading it in next week for the Levo FSR Expert. I did however get it wrapped by Lee at Invisiframe in Shrewesbury, who did a superb job (highly recommended), so the next owner will have some protection from scraoes and scratches!

 

[IR772]

Two faulty Bosch engines, that's very unusual.

What were the causes of the fault or is it the bearings in the engines that you refer to.

 

[Decca]

Bosch don't disclose the faults to the dealer. They just do a warranty swap. The first motor just died. The second got very noisy due, I believe, to water ingress causing corrosion to the bearing on the chainwheel side. They now fit a bearing seal on that side (available as an accessory purchase - they should do a recall) - which reinforces my opinion that Haibike have a somewhat slapdash approach to their design. They should NOT expect customers to beta test their bikes! They also now fit a small shield to protect the rear shock from stone strikes on the 2016 models - it was blindingly obvious to me that it was required on my 2014 version, so I made my own.

Don't get me started on that pathetic jockey wheel, either. Mine seized up. I had it replaced under warranty, but that corroded within weeks. I sourced a replacement 6902RS bearing myself that was of a higher quality, and that was fine from then on. I then discovered the front wheel bearings were shot, so I replaced those too with corrosion proof ceramic bearings. Don't Haibike realise that mountain bikes get wet?

No more Haibikes for me. Specialized build quality is in a different league.

 

[soundwave]

i just replaced the ses bearing on mine lol got about 2000 miles out of it tho and removed that fkn plastic thing above it as all it does is collect crud and put it on my chain.

i have the bearing seal that i had to buy, did email haibike for 1 for free but as ever no reply ever for a 1p bit of plastic.

do you have a link for the wheel bearings? as there shite anyway